C200: Can we talk about the C-Log 3 mode in MP4...?

C

cane141

Well-known member
Ok, looking at the MP4 footage Clog3 vs Raw Clog3, I'm seeing a lot more saturation on the MP4 clips?
There's no LUT on but clearly there's something added which I can't seem to figure out.
I'll try and post a screen grab later but has anyone else come across the same issue?
I actually intend on shooting raw mostly but once in awhile you want to dip into the 120p fps mp4
 
I think I have noticed the same thing. It's hard to put my finger on it, but I remember thinking "this does not look very flat". I will have to test again to make sure though.
 
cane141 said:
Ok, looking at the MP4 footage Clog3 vs Raw Clog3, I'm seeing a lot more saturation on the MP4 clips?
There's no LUT on but clearly there's something added which I can't seem to figure out.
I'll try and post a screen grab later but has anyone else come across the same issue?
I actually intend on shooting raw mostly but once in awhile you want to dip into the 120p fps mp4
Click to expand...

Which color matrix are ya using? You can select the CLog3 preset, which uses CLog3 gamma and the "neutral" color matrix, or you can use your own combination (I'm partial to CLog3 or WideDR and the Production Camera matrix).

When using Canon's RAW development, you have a different "Color Space" option which includes Cinema gamut, BT.709, BT.2020 and DCI-P3 that aren't selectable in MP4. Because you can't choose the color matrix when you're developing RAW, I'm assuming it's baked in to the RAW file (but the manual isn't too clear on that point).

So basically in MP4 there is no selectable "color space" option and that could account for the difference you're noticing.
 
Fahnon has a point. With the C300ii, you can select 4 colour space types in C-Log2 & 3 (cinema, rec2020, p3 and rec709). They get progressively more saturated as you go down the list. I would guess the C200 defaults to Rec709 as it would give you the most usable colour information when recording to the 8bit 420 internal files.
 
I'm trying to understand which combinations of gamma, color space (gamut), and color matrix are available on this camera, to get them supported in Logarist.

So there is no color space (gamut) setting at all? You can't select BT.709 Gamut, BT.2020 Gamut, DCI-P3 Gamut, and Cinema Gamut, like on previous cameras?

Can you set Canon Log 1 and Neutral Matrix together, or just Canon Log 1 with the Cinema EOS Original matrix?
 
I don't believe you can select color gamut on any 8-bit Cinema EOS cameras (C100, C100mkII and C300 original). I assume the color gamut of the MP4 mode on the C200 is BT.709.

If you record RAW LITE, you can choose any of those gamuts you mentioned after the fact.
 
drummondb said:
I don't believe you can select color gamut on any 8-bit Cinema EOS cameras (C100, C100mkII and C300 original). I assume the color gamut of the MP4 mode on the C200 is BT.709.

If you record RAW LITE, you can choose any of those gamuts you mentioned after the fact.
Click to expand...

This is correct. It makes sense that they used the rec709 gamut on mp4 mode as it's moving less information about upon applying a lut to de-log it.
 
Thanks. Yes, if there's no color space setting, then it must be BT.709. The camera's status screen #1 shows this:

Canon_C200_color_space_status_screen.jpg


Can anyone tell me if Canon Log 1 can be selected at the same time as the Neutral Matrix?
 
balazer said:
Thanks. Yes, if there's no color space setting, then it must be BT.709. The camera's status screen #1 shows this:


Can anyone tell me if Canon Log 1 can be selected at the same time as the Neutral Matrix?
Click to expand...

I haven't tested myself, but you can according to page 126 in the manual. It lists all possible combinations:

MP4:
You can choose between the following gammas: Canon Log, Canon Log 3, WideDR (default) and Normal 1-4; with Normal 3 being BT.709.

And you can combine those with following color matrix's: Neutral, Production Camera (my fav), Cinema EOS Original, Video and Off.

RAW:
Now the color matrixes seem to only apply to MP4 recording, or the settings are baked in to the RAW files, because when developing RAW you no longer have the matrix option.

Instead, you have a different Color Space option with the following settings: Cinema Gamut, BT.709, BT.2020 and DCI-P3.

The only gammas you have a choice of there are Canon Log 2, Canon Log 3, BT.709, WideDR and DCI (no Canon Log 1 in RAW at all).

Hope that helps!
 
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