scorsesefan
Veteran
The low light of the c80 is obviously better but my c70 just has a certain mojo due to the DGO sensor
C80 posted on Amazon
- Thread starter scorsesefan
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scorsesefan
Veteran
I owned three fx3's over the years, one a7siii and one fx6. You know what I like the most about the fx3's image - it's grain structure when shooting @ 12800. It just looks so nice and film-like...
As a fellow C70 owner I can attest to that.
But the C80 looks tempting. Maybe my GAS will run out of air before the November release.
morgan_moore
Major Contributor
The reason that 'looking in the hole' is so important is that the camera is closer to the body even than a DSLR with a 'z finder loupe' - getting the camera three inches closer to the spine/core makes a massive difference.
I need to do a video on that.
My R6 is 1.5.lbs too. Moving to a 2.8 lb camera would tip the balance. add the interesting 24-105 2.8 or 28-70/2 and now you have crossed a line of torture.
R6-24-70 /4 look in the hole.. you can do this for five mins
C80+28-80/2 in 'pose one' and you can do this for 30 seconds.
It is massive downgrade.
C80 wiith those lenses will 'need' to be on the shoulder (if you ever do 5mins chat... and you only want an XLR body because you do chat), and unlike the C200-C400 you cant move the loupe to work and would need and SDI loupe, plus battery and then could not use the touch screen because it would be behind you.
--
Monopods
Last week I was doing a 'pop festival' and a pod is just too dangerous in the crowd. And dont get me going on those kidney stabbling cod pieces that folk ware/wore.
Also mono pods create a special seasick form of stabilistation, because the camera wont lose z.. but will sway (pan tilt roll) which is the worst motion.
My 'major motion picture' is on the beach.. A mono pod would sink then and fill with salt water ready to spill corrosive brine all over my toys and van.
Gimbal lightstand rest.
Yes this is what I do, I have a Movi, it is rarely used usually only as part of a crew. Ive maybe got a hotel to film soon. Ill use the gimbal and Ill rest on a Cstand between the 15 second takes. The attracive hotel lady will carry the C stand between rooms and deliver flat whites at no cost. Lovely.
Of course Abe and others have tools that work for them.
Abe.. mainly in doors,
-minimal screen glare
-no interviews or long takes
-clean floor
-no drunkards or mosh pit
-no need to strap on..
terrible deck
lav mic receivers
lokit box/tentacle sick
focus trumpet
thius is a special pleasure.
Tiktok kids.
-Choose thier own handheld three second shots.
-Go home if it is sunny or they are tired.
-May not need to work daily to pay mortgage/healthcare/divorce
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morgan_moore
Major Contributor
I guess I get extra annoyed around the form of 'cinematic doco' cameras.
Cinematic docs you will glide through the mosh pit. Jump in the tank/landrover with Sgt Atkins, be driven across Lusaka in a tiny honda while trying to shoot the goat market out of the windo, fly to a remote island next to a coffin in a small Cessna, roll while she opens up about the death of her kid. Maybe climb Cotopaxi or get too tired and fail.
You need a hard little camera that has a wide FOV, decent zoom and no wires to break off and a form or low mass that can be held for a three min take without getting sewing machine arms.
You wont hear me moan about Alexa, Ember, Phantom, gopro, Arri 65, phones.. they are not cinematic doc cameras. But that is what is C80 is supposed to be. Its the wet dream.
Something like a camera that shoots 6k raw has a full frame auto focus 28-80/2 12million iso is an absolute dream for the fast moving solo shooter. An absolute fking dream
And then one realises that one..
must add and power a £1500 loupe and use it in hasselblad mode.. or with a shoulder rig.
That will position the radically excellent touch screen where you cannot touch or see it.
add on more mass in terms of sound garbage riggage and power for the loupe.
What happens.? the shiny C80 new 'fix everything' stays on the shelf and you grab the R6, 24-70/4 and amazon $8 three stop solid ND, rode video mic and Resolve 'voice isolator'.
The C80 stays on the shelf missing the fun and eating your bank balance..
And like the 5d2, Fs100, F3, the FS7 the C200 you have another camera you cannot wait to upgrade for whatever reason.. they will get it right with the next one!
Cinematic docs you will glide through the mosh pit. Jump in the tank/landrover with Sgt Atkins, be driven across Lusaka in a tiny honda while trying to shoot the goat market out of the windo, fly to a remote island next to a coffin in a small Cessna, roll while she opens up about the death of her kid. Maybe climb Cotopaxi or get too tired and fail.
You need a hard little camera that has a wide FOV, decent zoom and no wires to break off and a form or low mass that can be held for a three min take without getting sewing machine arms.
You wont hear me moan about Alexa, Ember, Phantom, gopro, Arri 65, phones.. they are not cinematic doc cameras. But that is what is C80 is supposed to be. Its the wet dream.
Something like a camera that shoots 6k raw has a full frame auto focus 28-80/2 12million iso is an absolute dream for the fast moving solo shooter. An absolute fking dream
And then one realises that one..
must add and power a £1500 loupe and use it in hasselblad mode.. or with a shoulder rig.
That will position the radically excellent touch screen where you cannot touch or see it.
add on more mass in terms of sound garbage riggage and power for the loupe.
What happens.? the shiny C80 new 'fix everything' stays on the shelf and you grab the R6, 24-70/4 and amazon $8 three stop solid ND, rode video mic and Resolve 'voice isolator'.
The C80 stays on the shelf missing the fun and eating your bank balance..
And like the 5d2, Fs100, F3, the FS7 the C200 you have another camera you cannot wait to upgrade for whatever reason.. they will get it right with the next one!
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Samuel Dilworth
Well-known member
What is the maximum frame rate this camera can do with full-width sampling of all pixels?
Canon is oddly quiet on that in the press release, etc.
The specs here:
www.canon.co.uk
… say:
System Frequency / Frame Rates
59.94Hz mode (59.94P / 59.94i / 29.97P / 23.98P)
50.00Hz mode (50.00P / 50.00i / 25.00P)
24.00 Hz mode (24.00P)
And then go into a heap of codecs, etc., displayed in the usual maximally confusing way.
Then, later:
Slow / Fast Motion
6K RAW: up to 30FPS
4K recording: up to 120FPS (Long GOP) / 60FPS (Intra-frame)
2K recording: up to 180FPS (Long GOP) / 120FPS (Intra-frame)
Some people seem to be assuming that that 4K/120p mode (long-GOP only, BTW – hmm) is oversampled. Why would you make this assumption? The assumption I’d make is that it’s doing a crop to get to 120p. Which would be a little cheesy at this price in late 2024, if you ask me.
Canon is oddly quiet on that in the press release, etc.
The specs here:
Canon EOS C80 Video Camera Specifications
Discover Canon EOS C80, a compact and lightweight full-frame Video Camera ideal for filmmaking productions. Capture stunning visuals with ease and portability.
www.canon.co.uk
… say:
System Frequency / Frame Rates
59.94Hz mode (59.94P / 59.94i / 29.97P / 23.98P)
50.00Hz mode (50.00P / 50.00i / 25.00P)
24.00 Hz mode (24.00P)
And then go into a heap of codecs, etc., displayed in the usual maximally confusing way.
Then, later:
Slow / Fast Motion
6K RAW: up to 30FPS
4K recording: up to 120FPS (Long GOP) / 60FPS (Intra-frame)
2K recording: up to 180FPS (Long GOP) / 120FPS (Intra-frame)
Some people seem to be assuming that that 4K/120p mode (long-GOP only, BTW – hmm) is oversampled. Why would you make this assumption? The assumption I’d make is that it’s doing a crop to get to 120p. Which would be a little cheesy at this price in late 2024, if you ask me.
ahalpert
Major Contributor
Huh. I think you may be right. 120p may require a S35 crop, reading the tea leaves from info posted on Newsshooter. That would be a massive downgrade from what I had assumed. Sony for the win!What is the maximum frame rate this camera can do with full-width sampling of all pixels?
Canon is oddly quiet on that in the press release, etc.
The specs here:
Canon EOS C80 Video Camera Specifications
Discover Canon EOS C80, a compact and lightweight full-frame Video Camera ideal for filmmaking productions. Capture stunning visuals with ease and portability.
… say:
System Frequency / Frame Rates
59.94Hz mode (59.94P / 59.94i / 29.97P / 23.98P)
50.00Hz mode (50.00P / 50.00i / 25.00P)
24.00 Hz mode (24.00P)
And then go into a heap of codecs, etc., displayed in the usual maximally confusing way.
Then, later:
Slow / Fast Motion
6K RAW: up to 30FPS
4K recording: up to 120FPS (Long GOP) / 60FPS (Intra-frame)
2K recording: up to 180FPS (Long GOP) / 120FPS (Intra-frame)
Some people seem to be assuming that that 4K/120p mode (long-GOP only, BTW – hmm) is oversampled. Why would you make this assumption? The assumption I’d make is that it’s doing a crop to get to 120p. Which would be a little cheesy at this price in late 2024, if you ask me.
Canon EOS C80– 6K Full Frame & SDI - NewsshooterCanon has unveiled the EOS C80, a follow-up to the C70 that was announced almost 4 years ago. Just like the C70, the C80 was designed to be a camera
www.newsshooter.com
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scorsesefan
Veteran
Yeah, tempting, but I still would like to have seen a Canon implement a cinema camera in an fx3 style body....As a fellow C70 owner I can attest to that.
But the C80 looks tempting. Maybe my GAS will run out of air before the November release.
Samuel Dilworth
Well-known member
Good catch. No CFexpress. Might explain those codec limitations.
Man, parsing the ever-longer lists of codecs versus frame sizes versus frame rates versus bit depths versus chroma subsampling standards from these cameras makes my head spin. Surely there’s a better way to display this info than endless lists of spot-the-difference.
But I think those Newsshooter specs back up my suspicions. Looks like the C80 crops to S35 for 120p. So there goes your full-frame noise and dynamic range, not to mention oversampled detail, not to mention your wide-angle lenses. You’re back to the C70, basically, but missing DGO (whatever that did, not sure) and with lenses that switch field of view depending on the frame rate.
I realise this camera offers a lot of other perks, but that would be a showstopper for me.
Also, I don’t understand why everything is stalled out at 60p. Can they not read the data off the sensor quickly enough? Are more people clamouring for 6K than 120p S&Q?
Bassman2003
Veteran
I do not really understand the difference between an FX3 or an A7sIII in terms of "cinema". The images seem to be identical. Yes they give some more video tools on the FX3 but in my mind, the term "cinema" is being stretched a bit, no? Sort of like the term "film look". Canon doing this would be an R5 II with more heat management? Just seems like splitting hairs and what the makers decide to include on the small bodies.
To me, the term cinema should include a look that is above normal mirrorless cameras. Just like Cine lenses should look better than still lenses that cost a fraction of the price.
scorsesefan
Veteran
The differences between the image of the fx3 and a7siii is subtle but noticeable to me upon closer inspection. I've heard that Sony responded to complaints about users wanting to match their fx3's more closely to fx6s so they implemented a more organic noise pattern in the fx3. IMO the fx3 image looks less sharpened and digital than the a7siii. Just an opinion...
Bassman2003
Veteran
Good to know and glad there is a difference if only slight. I hope the trend continues with even more separation between the two types of cameras. Since I (did) more stills work up until now, I favored the hybrids as the image was so close that the dedicated video models were not the best value for me. At this current time, I would stick with the A7sIII unless an FX3 II would offer a much better experience and image. I guess that is a maturation of the hybrid/video market.
I think this may be because the a7siii has noise reduction built in and the fx3 doesn't??
For me, (and to piggy back some of what Sam says)... I don't care about the marketing bs of "cinema line"... if I get the small VF hole in the non-cinema version. Call me old-school, but I always prefer the ability to press eye to a screen without extraneous light hitting it.
Bassman2003
Veteran
I agree, that has been a big reason for me to stick with the hybrids. Makes the FX3 and the like look like a "vacation cinema" cameras to me 
Agree with you there. I’m the first one to admit that balancing the C70 on a gimbal is a pain in the behind. The FX3 looks more effortless.
I forgot to mention that the FX30 is 1/3rd the price of a C80 here in Japan. (JPY 30k vs 90k.) The FX6 is about 85k.
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scorsesefan
Veteran
Hmm. I wonder what would account for the price difference. In the US that would make the fx3 the equivalent of about $1800 USD!
@scorsesefan Apologies, I left out a. zero from "FX30". To clarify: The FX30 is 30k, the FX3 is 45k and the FX6 is 85k (JPY).
jmone
Well-known member
The C80 will be of interest to those in the Canon ecosystem as it's the "entry level" full frame with SDI if you like that (I think awkward) body. I'm also less sure how usable it's 6K is going to be with the limitations of the SD Card for internal recording. I'm guessing most will use it in down sampled UHD Mode. Or stump up the extra coin for the C400?
I see little reason to swap to the C80 if you are already in another system.
I see little reason to swap to the C80 if you are already in another system.
