spinkscapes
Well-known member
I will need to have a primary camera for future weddings.
The C500 costs AU$50 more than the C300 to rent per day and less than the FS7.
What would you advise as an alternative?
C500: C500 + Zeiss Master Prime for Wedding
- Thread starter spinkscapes
- Start date
I will need to have a primary camera for future weddings.
The C500 costs AU$50 more than the C300 to rent per day and less than the FS7.
What would you advise as an alternative?
Matt Turner
Well-known member
This.
If you hadn't mentioned the cameras I wouldn't have known the first one was an Arri, as I wouldn't have conceived anyone trying to shoot a wedding with one.
C100 MKII roughly AU$200/day x 2 = a bit more than a single C300 (AU$330?), but you'll have 2 cameras, with 60p slo mo.
LOTs easier to use in a fast paced event environment than almost any other camera on the market and all the other ones you have mentioned.
Add Ninja Stars or Blades if you really want ProRes recording.
Then learn to make them sing and no-one will know the difference. <<<--- this is the key!
Of course, if your clients want 4K then that's not gonna work
... also I'm totally biased because I love my C100 for events.
spinkscapes
Well-known member
This.
If you hadn't mentioned the cameras I wouldn't have known the first one was an Arri, as I wouldn't have conceived anyone trying to shoot a wedding with one.
C100 MKII roughly AU$200/day x 2 = a bit more than a single C300 (AU$330?), but you'll have 2 cameras, with 60p slo mo.
LOTs easier to use in a fast paced event environment than almost any other camera on the market and all the other ones you have mentioned.
Add Ninja Stars or Blades if you really want ProRes recording.
Then learn to make them sing and no-one will know the difference. <<<--- this is the key!
Of course, if your clients want 4K then that's not gonna work
... also I'm totally biased because I love my C100 for events.
Know any good rental houses that currently rent out the C100 mkII in Melbourne?
spinkscapes
Well-known member
I learnt this the hard way with the FS7.
So important to be comfortable with the gear you are using in a stressful environment.
Ebrahim Saadawi
Carbonite Member
A wedding on a C500 + External Recorder + Rails + Battery + Raw 4K + one prime? Impossible. Two C100 MKII + two operators, one with an IS L zoom and one with a fast prime will give a better result to your final client, you will capture the moments, which is all what matters.
spinkscapes
Well-known member
I am constrained by what I can rent.
VA Hire is my usual rental house - http://www.vahire.com/vahire-hd-prime-lenses.html
I also use Crisp Hire - http://www.crisphire.com.au/rental/lenses/p_lenses/
spinkscapes
Well-known member
I think that is very sensible advice.
I will strongly consider what you have said.
Matt Turner
Well-known member
Being a renter you have an awesome opportunity to try a whole bunch of setups.
If it was me I'd start smaller and work up to what I thought was a good price/performance/usability range.
Then it will probably be easy to spot when you have gone too far for little benefit.
Bear in mind though that the vast majority of wedding people seem to shoot DSLR or C100s.
Would love to hear your conclusions.
If you are just getting into weddings you could check out this podcast I found out about this week, I think they use FS7s and A7s, maybe C100, I haven't gotten to Week 19 yet
http://ourweekinvideo.podbean.com/
http://ourweekinvideo.podbean.com/e/week-19-we-finally-upgraded-our-cameras-find-out-what-we-chose/
If it was me I'd start smaller and work up to what I thought was a good price/performance/usability range.
Then it will probably be easy to spot when you have gone too far for little benefit.
Bear in mind though that the vast majority of wedding people seem to shoot DSLR or C100s.
Would love to hear your conclusions.
If you are just getting into weddings you could check out this podcast I found out about this week, I think they use FS7s and A7s, maybe C100, I haven't gotten to Week 19 yet
http://ourweekinvideo.podbean.com/
http://ourweekinvideo.podbean.com/e/week-19-we-finally-upgraded-our-cameras-find-out-what-we-chose/
Matt Turner
Well-known member
BTW I meant this as: you don't need much to deliver as good as or better quality than any Wedding shooter out there, as long as you can deliver on the content and emotion.
Surf it Mike
Well-known member
Apologies IMO. This thread is a case of over delivery ........seriously 1 masterprime to cover a whole wedding ? There are far more appropriate lens systems for coverage of a live event in available light than 1 masterprime . ( as nice as it is ) .
P.s to hire this lens you will need insurance certificates , references and some form of history within the industry, certainly within Melbourne & certainly within Aus.
P.s to hire this lens you will need insurance certificates , references and some form of history within the industry, certainly within Melbourne & certainly within Aus.
rob norton
Veteran
Why don't you keep using your 2xGH4s or 5d iii? Instead of renting any of the packages you're asking about, you could put money towards hiring a jib, extra set of hands, person for sound etc.. You said quality of the final product is most important. This could mean being agile enough to capture once in a lifetime moments, or adding some cinematic moves to certain scenes you have time to set up for. I would focus on nailing these things first - unless you already have. Final product quality won't come from eliminating slight banding in a sky or having less noise in a church pew.
oron cohen
Member
Coming for Cinema/TV, two thing I've noticed from my friends shooting weddings is that they are not that keen on testing (in cinema you usually test and test and test and only then decide), this the big advantage of renting! Just ask the rental company for a few hours to test some camera setups, they should provide this with no cost.
The second thing I've noticed, is that they are not that keen on lighting and the importance of lighting and pre rigging a location. you could sort out a lot of messy shots with a pro gaffer coming to the locations beforehand, gel windows, rig some lights over head and adding some portable lights (kino's on stands with wheels is one example).
After looking at your rental companies sites, and If you like nice cinema style run & gun setup, I'll consider testing C300 PL with a couple of Optimo DP lenses (16-42&30-80) or the 28-76 T.2.6, A very similar setup was used to shoot 'Blue is the warmest colour'', I'd also test the Cabrio 19-90, shoot a bit on each, feel it on my shoulder, then go home a examine the footage and see I do they match to the GH4 as B camera on this setup (I think it would) and if they give you this extra quality you're after.
Regarding primes, would rarely use only one prime to shoot anything documentary, I might keep a fast prime or two for low light stuff, but with the C300 comfortably go up to 2000ISO-3200ISO with some NR, I would just stick with zooms, T2.8 is like F2.5.
Having said that, like the other said, EF IS glass/still glass should be fine on a wedding, you can test this combo as well at the rental house, I found FS7+speedbooster+24-105IS works nice.
bill totolo
Veteran
You may have to set up your grading suite.
The Amira/Cooke video is consistently over exposed and skews magenta.
In the second video you committed the cardinal sin of blowing out the wedding dress and losing all detail.
In both videos you don't pay attention to composing your backgrounds and blow them out in favor of exposing faces in the f/g.
If you flipped sides or staged the action a little you could have avoided this.
I admire your commitment but gear is not your issue. I think you need to concentrate on the fundamentals of photography, and the relationships in front of the camera.
I don't mean to come off as a hard ass, this stuff really takes a lot of years of practice. For some, more than the 10,000 hours proposed by Malcolm Gladwell.
The Amira/Cooke video is consistently over exposed and skews magenta.
In the second video you committed the cardinal sin of blowing out the wedding dress and losing all detail.
In both videos you don't pay attention to composing your backgrounds and blow them out in favor of exposing faces in the f/g.
If you flipped sides or staged the action a little you could have avoided this.
I admire your commitment but gear is not your issue. I think you need to concentrate on the fundamentals of photography, and the relationships in front of the camera.
I don't mean to come off as a hard ass, this stuff really takes a lot of years of practice. For some, more than the 10,000 hours proposed by Malcolm Gladwell.
puredrifting
Major Contributor
No offense, but your quest to shoot weddings with high end cinema cameras seems like a terrible business decision and a questionable aesthetic decision. Unless your clients are screening the films in a cinema, you are shooting with way too much overkill. Camera like the Amira and the C500 were mainly designed to have an AC or two working with them to set them up correctly and optimally. Both are designed to be shot in so-called documentary situations but my experience with both have been they still need a good AC and or DIT to get the really outstanding looks, especially in a situation as wildly uncontrollable as a wedding. Weddings, or at least most the weddings I have been too have terrible lighting just about everywhere, they are the opposite of something you can control. Assuming your clients will view and distribute via YouTube or Vimeo, your present cameras you own are more than adequate. As far as live events, primes are extremely limiting. I love primes and have a full set but every time I am shooting anything for my clients (I don't shoot weddings, mostly material related to Hollywood studios, docs and BTS footage for broadcast) my clients become highly irritated when they want me to punch in or widen out and I reply that I can't because I am shooting with a prime. Primes are for scripted content where you can move and locate the camera exactly where it needs to be. Live events need zoom lenses so you can capitalize on opportunities that you weren't expecting. I would take the money you would be spending on high end cinema cameras and lenses and hire a sound mixer. Sound is far more important than picture for live events. If you still had money left over, another shooter. Weddings can often better covered by three to four shooters or at least two shooters and an assistant who setup up coming shots or better yet light upcoming shots like the bouquet toss, cutting the cake, etc
I have seen some very well done wedding videos, all done with inexpensive DSLRs and once again, no offense, but your footage shot with a hugely expensive digital cinema camera doesn't even come close. The footage shot with the Arri is flat, you used way too much high frame rate, it has a magenta tint, the framing and pacing are awkward, etc. The second video is better but you are still learning your craft and that is fine. It is admirable to want to present your clients with the best, but the best, in weddings, is not using a high end, super expensive, large and heavy camera. Some more effort, learning and practice using what you have as far as gear to improve your shooting, composition and post skills would do a lot more than renting the best cameras available. You are way past your equipment holding you back, your skill set and that of your partner/crew and your post skills are a much larger factor in taking it to the next level. Good luck.
I have seen some very well done wedding videos, all done with inexpensive DSLRs and once again, no offense, but your footage shot with a hugely expensive digital cinema camera doesn't even come close. The footage shot with the Arri is flat, you used way too much high frame rate, it has a magenta tint, the framing and pacing are awkward, etc. The second video is better but you are still learning your craft and that is fine. It is admirable to want to present your clients with the best, but the best, in weddings, is not using a high end, super expensive, large and heavy camera. Some more effort, learning and practice using what you have as far as gear to improve your shooting, composition and post skills would do a lot more than renting the best cameras available. You are way past your equipment holding you back, your skill set and that of your partner/crew and your post skills are a much larger factor in taking it to the next level. Good luck.
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spinkscapes
Well-known member
Thanks for your advice.
I think utilizing a pro-gaffer is not a ridiculous option.
As always lighting is the key ingredient.
spinkscapes
Well-known member
Much deserved criticisms and valuable feedback.
spinkscapes
Well-known member
No offence taken.
I have done a total of 4 weddings from paying clients and only three of which were done with a dedicated 2nd shooter/audio tech.
As with anything there is a danger with picking up a camera on the day.
I gave the Amira for much of the formal shots to my second shooter (too heavy for me) and he accidental changed the white balance.
So while I pulled back the magenta in post I struggle to get rid of the tint altogether.
I'm sure much better colourists than myself (and I am just an amateur) would perform the task better.
spinkscapes
Well-known member
I completely concede that stills lenses are reasonable to use for weddings.