C200: C200 and Small HD Focus Color issues

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peter917

Active member
Hello all,

This probably has a easy answer but I could not seem to find any info. When I use my Small HD Focus on my c200 (using resolves Arri lut on the small HD) my colors are not the same as when I actually apply the lut on my computer and I also notice that when I play back the clip on the small HD it blows out information that actually is not blown out.

Does the small HD need to be calibrated some how? I do not have a calibration tool so I am just curious. Is it just a matter of going to the settings on the small HD and adjusting till they match my PC look? Why does the LOOK exposure change when in playback mode as well?

I have a few upcoming shoots and it is annoying that I can't show people close to what they will get in the end result.
 
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peter917 said:
Hello all,

This probably has a easy answer but I could not seem to find any info. When I use my Small HD Focus on my c200 (using resolves Arri lut on the small HD) my colors are not the same as when I actually apply the lut on my computer and I also notice that when I play back the clip on the small HD it blows out information that actually is not blown out.

Does the small HD need to be calibrated some how? I do not have a calibration tool so I am just curious. Is it just a matter of going to the settings on the small HD and adjusting till they match my PC look? Why does the LOOK exposure change when in playback mode as well?

I have a few upcoming shoots and it is annoying that I can't show people close to what they will get in the end result.
Click to expand...

Is the Small HD monitor you are using 8-bit or 10-bit? Calibrated with an X-Rite or something? Possibly because the monitor is working in RGB color space and possibly your computer screen possibly isn't?
Would need more info on your exact Small HD monitor and your exact computer monitor to try to figure this out.
 
Not sure how much of this is playing a part in what you're seeing, but the Focus line of monitors isn't going to show you exactly what you're shooting, in fact it's only going to show you 70% of the NTSC gammut (as opposed to 100% of Rec 709 like their most expensive pro monitors). So no matter what you do to the settings, you're not going to exactly replicate the look you have on your computer on your monitor.

I have the Focus monitor that I use when shooting handheld or on a gimbal and I basically just use it for framing, focus, and being able to see the image outdoors. It takes a little muscle memory to get used to seeing an image on the monitor, but knowing how it will really turn out. For me I almost always treat my Small HD Focus & 702 Bright monitors as if they're about .5-1 stops brighter than the actual image I'm getting, so my image when I'm shooting almost always looks a hair over exposed on the monitor, but I know that the info is really there in the camera.

For what it's worth, I know seeing a LUT while recording can make it more fun because you get to see something closer to your final intended image, but when capturing I never use any LUT other than sending the WideDR LUT from the camera to the monitor. I've found that that is the best way for me to have an accurate enough feeling of knowing where my image is at for a good, base starting point.
 
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chris f said:
Not sure how much of this is playing a part in what you're seeing, but the Focus line of monitors isn't going to show you exactly what you're shooting, in fact it's only going to show you 70% of the NTSC gammut (as opposed to 100% of Rec 709 like their most expensive pro monitors). So no matter what you do to the settings, you're not going to exactly replicate the look you have on your computer on your monitor.

I have the Focus monitor that I use when shooting handheld or on a gimbal and I basically just use it for framing, focus, and being able to see the image outdoors. It takes a little muscle memory to get used to seeing an image on the monitor, but knowing how it will really turn out. For me I almost always treat my Small HD Focus & 702 Bright monitors as if they're about .5-1 stops brighter than the actual image I'm getting, so my image when I'm shooting almost always looks a hair over exposed on the monitor, but I know that the info is really there in the camera.

For what it's worth, I know seeing a LUT while recording can make it more fun because you get to see something closer to your final intended image, but when capturing I never use any LUT other than sending the WideDR LUT from the camera to the monitor. I've found that that is the best way for me to have an accurate enough feeling of knowing where my image is at for a good, base starting point.
Click to expand...

To be fair, the OP didn't state which Focus monitor they're using. The OLED's have a higher color gamut. 105%, I believe.
 
Sorry for late reponse, I am using the Small HD Focus 5".

The over exposure issue isnt a huge deal but what having the color grade be off is. The standard resolve Arri lut was showing a magenta tinge via monitor but not in resolve. I may just mess with the internal small HD settings.
 
Sounds like you just need to “dial in” your monitor(calibrate it or calibrate it as best you can).

One of the reasons I went with the OLED version vs the high-brite LCD. Better color & blacks and almost all of my regularly used external monitors are OLED(1x Sony, 3x sHD) and VF’s, too(Sony and Zacuto Graticle).
 
peter917 said:
Sorry for late reponse, I am using the Small HD Focus 5".

The over exposure issue isnt a huge deal but what having the color grade be off is. The standard resolve Arri lut was showing a magenta tinge via monitor but not in resolve. I may just mess with the internal small HD settings.
Click to expand...

From trying to correct a SmallHD 702 I learned that it has a calibration LUT of its own installed that corrects the raw monitor color into a corrected 709. This is used to make the monitor 'neutral/calibrated' so that the other LUTS display correctly. You issue may be that the factory calibration LUT is off, or you might have a faulty HDMI cable (it's much less reliable than DisplayPort, I've had magenta from HDMI before), or that the .cube file you're using is too large for the SmallHD to use properly, especially if it's a 3D LUT. The last issue possible has to go with ColorGamut mapping. I'm not sure the camera outputs the same colorgamut as is used by the RAW files in Resolve, since you can only see Clog3 in Rec 709 over the SDI.
 
IanTheM said:
From trying to correct a SmallHD 702 I learned that it has a calibration LUT of its own installed that corrects the raw monitor color into a corrected 709. This is used to make the monitor 'neutral/calibrated' so that the other LUTS display correctly. You issue may be that the factory calibration LUT is off, or you might have a faulty HDMI cable (it's much less reliable than DisplayPort, I've had magenta from HDMI before), or that the .cube file you're using is too large for the SmallHD to use properly, especially if it's a 3D LUT. The last issue possible has to go with ColorGamut mapping. I'm not sure the camera outputs the same colorgamut as is used by the RAW files in Resolve, since you can only see Clog3 in Rec 709 over the SDI.
Click to expand...

Just for the fun of it, I turned the "factory calibration" LUT off on my new Focus OLED monitor right after I got it. All I have to say is Wow. 100% un-useable except for framing. I'm not even sure nuclear pastel properly describes some of the colors. I just wish you didn't have to buy the specialized version of the ipro probe to allow the monitor to do a self-calibration.
 
You know what, I never used the factory calibration lut, only my own luts. So it very well could be my calibration lut is either off or the wrong is selected.
 
Run&Gun said:
Just for the fun of it, I turned the "factory calibration" LUT off on my new Focus OLED monitor right after I got it. All I have to say is Wow. 100% un-useable except for framing. I'm not even sure nuclear pastel properly describes some of the colors. I just wish you didn't have to buy the specialized version of the ipro probe to allow the monitor to do a self-calibration.
Click to expand...

Yeah, it really sucks, I have an i1 probe for my monitors already but it can't be used with their monitors. Apparently the Atmos monitors can use the regular probe though, I'm probably going to get the Shinobi SDI soon.
 
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