C100 Ninja vs internal test 1

olof

olof

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This was shot yesterday while testing a lot of settings etc, We shot with native and Nija using PrRes422 in the C100.
And we also shot side by side with the FS700 internally and with the NanoFlash.
I will upload more tests as time allows.
This was unlit with mixed lighting from a North facing window and incandescent light inside. We tested studio lighting as well more on tat later. I used a setting of 6000K set from a slightly warm card.

This would be a typical very quick setup. No grading. Wide dynamic range setting.


https://vimeo.com/54722243
 
I see added sharpness and better color in the 422 footage, noise is there in both but slightly different.

I have shot a lot of footage outdoors and in the studio I am just starting to analyze. I will post more as time allows.

Keying is easier with the 422. Here is a BlueScreen test.

https://vimeo.com/54724722
 
Yes, I can see that the 4:2:2 is a much cleaner key...especially with the strands of her hair on the left. Do you think you could have improved the internal recording by tweaking it some?
 
Can't tell a big difference in the indoor scene. Downloading file to exam closer. I think the codec holds up well.
 
I would say most of the time the internal codec is great. And there is no need to go for an external 422 recorder (there is definitely a difference) unless your client demands 50mb/s 422, if you are keying, or plan to seriously CC the footage.

Bottom line is I love this camera compact and very good image and if you have a lot of Canon Glass like me, it is a no brainer in this price class.
 
I tested my new Ninja 2 yesterday as well, I think Olofs comments are spot on. The internal AVCHD is really good, however you can see the difference in the ProRes footage. I noticed it most so far in horizontal lines, with the AVCHD there was aliasing that didn't occur in the Ninja version.

The file workflow though is fantastic: because I tend to use FCPX at the moment while I'm coming up to speed with Premiere, it's simply a case of exporting the XML file on the Ninja, then plug the SSD into the caddy (I am using Firewire 800, no USB 3), then in FCPX use File>Import>XML in FCPX, all the files are imported and no transcoding or pulldown required, ready to go instantly.

Here's the low light / Ninja 2 test I did last night nothing fancy, not a test, just some footage to look at:

 
Matt Turner said:
I tested my new Ninja 2 yesterday as well, I think Olofs comments are spot on. The internal AVCHD is really good, however you can see the difference in the ProRes footage. I noticed it most so far in horizontal lines, with the AVCHD there was aliasing that didn't occur in the Ninja version.

The file workflow though is fantastic: because I tend to use FCPX at the moment while I'm coming up to speed with Premiere, it's simply a case of exporting the XML file on the Ninja, then plug the SSD into the caddy (I am using Firewire 800, no USB 3), then in FCPX use File>Import>XML in FCPX, all the files are imported and no transcoding or pulldown required, ready to go instantly.

Here's the low light / Ninja 2 test I did last night nothing fancy, not a test, just some footage to look at:

Click to expand...
Wow! Really sharp and detailed. Just viewed on my 47in and it looks GREAT!
 
Thanks for the test videos guys!

One question, does the C100 have a focus peaking option? I couldnt find an answer when I did a google search.
 
alex1 said:
Thanks for the test videos guys!

One question, does the C100 have a focus peaking option? I couldnt find an answer when I did a google search.
Click to expand...

Yes it does and it is adjustable. It also has a magnify function. I think the manual is available on line now. If not I will post it, let me know.

Here is a copy of the manual:
http://www.westsideav.com/C100.pdf
 
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lol, was just a few random shots. The camera handled the low light really well. It's noisy at 12800 but then you'd expect that. How's your one going StMad?
 
olof said:
https://vimeo.com/54722243
Click to expand...

I downloaded the .mov file and looked at it at full res. At 0:05, when you lift the camera a bit and the footage switches over to ProRes, the magazine at the bottom has some serious aliasing (or just jitters). And again when the subject moves her arm at 0:15. The AVCHD parts don't seem to suffer from this problem. I'm assuming there's some misinterpretation along the way. Ideas?
 
aly324 said:
I downloaded the .mov file and looked at it at full res. At 0:05, when you lift the camera a bit and the footage switches over to ProRes, the magazine at the bottom has some serious aliasing (or just jitters). And again when the subject moves her arm at 0:15. The AVCHD parts don't seem to suffer from this problem. I'm assuming there's some misinterpretation along the way. Ideas?
Click to expand...

This is going to be a continuing problem with the C100, and not just because of the 3:2 pulldown via HDMI out (disclaimer: I have no looked at the footage, but I'll take aly324 at their word that there is aliasing going on).

First, never, ever, EVER, shoot PF24. You have to shoot PF30 for 30p, but PF24 is right out. Never shoot in that mode. Always shoot 24 Mbps LPCM 24p mode. Second, make sure the Ninja-2's input option (set by tapping the incoming signal display) is set to 3:2 1080p23.98.

If you accidently shoot in 1080i60, all is not lost as the pulldown flags are still there, but you'll have to remove the pulldown either via After Effects or by Compressor. I haven't exactly found any other solution that works.
 
Yes, it looks like a lot of first attempts (mine included) have been caught out with the PF recording. Definitely a "gotcha" on this camera. It's also one of the reasons a Ninja makes sense to me (if you are not handheld). The progressive ProRes simply saves time and effort thinking about that stuff.
 
I personally haven't had any of the frame issues, but I think Sony Vegas works that out for you.

Matt Turner said:
How's your one going StMad?
Click to expand...

As a hobbyist I've allowed myself to be put off by camera constraints in the past, but now nothing stops me from shooting but me. Just grab the camera and go, knowing that it'll handle whatever I ask of it. I've just got the camera balanced on my Merlin (stripping it down - I love that they thought of that), but that's for another thread.
 
StMad said:
I've just got the camera balanced on my Merlin (stripping it down - I love that they thought of that), but that's for another thread.
Click to expand...
No it's not! lol... I was looking at the Merlin 2 the other day, weighing up the C100 with a lens and removing the top handle comes in about 2.2kg which is about the limit for a Merlin. Sounds like a small easy setup but my concern was that I would be at the maximum load capacity already. Did you take the side grip off too and if so did it make the camera harder to operate? I'm guessing flying around on the Merlin you set up the camera first and then don't need the grip?
 
Hehe..I'll put up a vid of me flying and the resulting footage later today. But you're right...both top and side handles come off, and right again with setting the camera up first with the intent to change nothing but aperture. With the 24mm 1.4 Nikon G (620g) I'm at 1.88kg, and a little less with the Tokina 11-16 (560g). They're both Nikon mounts, so I use a Novoflex adapter for the iris. If I was using my Canon 17-55 (If I hadn't broken the 562b golden rule of safety) I'd assign iris +/- to the body...but as a C-Cinema savant you would already know that :)
 
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