Hey I've been looking around for a boom pole, and with buying this camera and now on the verge of getting the mic plus adapter plus XLR adapter, I'm pretty much out of cash and I still need a boom. Now I have searched through previous threads about boom pole suggestionss but they seem to be out of my price range of $60 or under and I can't find anything on Ebay except for these really cheap poles that are sold by the dozens by this one company in which I'm skeptical about how good they really are. But I did find a metal device that can be stuck onto a painter's pole and make it a boom pole with the exception that the painter's pole is strictly one length and not able to shorten down to 3 feet like a regular boom pole. If there are any Boom Pole suggestions that are $60 and under inform me, or if my painter's pole adaption would probably work just as well as a rediculously cheap boom pole then tell me that too. Thanks
Boom Pole Vs Painter Pole
- Thread starter FOXMAN09
- Start date
LighthouseMedia
Well-known member
For $60 there aren't any real good options...If you go painters pole go with something fibergalss to help with handling noise. But asap upgrade to a good carbon fiber pole for the best results.
Capt Quirk
Veteran
I have actually heard good things about painters poles from some folk- depending on the pro models they compared them to. They can weigh less and reach farther- again, compared to some models.
Until I can get to the point I can comfortably afford to upgrade, I'm using a run of the mill painters pole, $17 at Lowes, 3/8" foam rubber tube for handle, .99 at Ace, adapter to fit shock mount, $14 after shipping off of ebay. I have $100 Azden SGM 1000 coming for the end of it. Next step, is a decent shockmount and dead cat... maybe a blimp too.
Until I can get to the point I can comfortably afford to upgrade, I'm using a run of the mill painters pole, $17 at Lowes, 3/8" foam rubber tube for handle, .99 at Ace, adapter to fit shock mount, $14 after shipping off of ebay. I have $100 Azden SGM 1000 coming for the end of it. Next step, is a decent shockmount and dead cat... maybe a blimp too.
wabbit
Evil has Ears
Let us know how that works for you Capt. Alot of people have tried painter's pole, broomsticks, etc for a cheap alternative to boompoles. Because of the weight, handling noise, and lack of easy adjustment the results tend to be disappointing but some seem very happy with it. I guess a lot might depend on your expectations.
Cheers
Cheers
MattinSTL
Sound Modulator
I have two booms and I like them both for different reasons.
I've got a K-Tek 9' graphite avalon which is a joy to use because it's so freakishly lightweight... but there are a lot of times where 9' just isn't enough to get me there.
I couldn't afford a 12.5' or longer graphite K-Tek so I got a Gitzo CF pole at that length... the g7680c.
I'll still use the K-Tek until it's used up... but for any newbie I will no longer suggest any of the shorter poles. Even at $250 the Gitzo is a bargain for what it is... the last two lengths can't be used all the way out... you must back them in a few inches... so really it's a 12' 6" pole (usable)... but this is adequate length to seperate those who care about sound from those who kind of care about sound. Really this could turn into an all-out vent session... because I am repeatedly appalled at how crappy boom ops are... I rarely see a good boom op... even those that are considered to be professionals. I can't believe that everybody is that out of shape... or whatever the heck the problem is... people are lazy. Is it really that hard to point the damn mic? Put an AA sized narrow beam flashlight on the end of a pole and put it in the mic mount... now see if you can keep an actor's face in the light. Is it really that hard? A mic is more forgiving then a flashlight... you want to lead the actors a bit... but not much. Pointing the pole in the general direction will be better then not trying at all... but man it chaps my ass how little pride most boom ops take in their work.
Am I just bitching or do I have a point? The point is that you WILL have a hard time getting a good boom op... I don't know you personally so maybe even YOU won't be that attentive to the sound as your arms get more and more tired. The less weight you have to support directly over your head... the better off your sound will be for it.
The other factor of weight is leverage... with my 9' pole I sometimes suddenly have to poke it out over a shot and I'm holding onto the very end of the pole where the cable goes in... this is not easy to do for a long time until you get in serious shape. Everybody SAYS they will get in shape... but you gotta' boom a few times to really understand what that means. I've been completely sweaty booming live action in an airconditioned environment before... the cam op doesn't have one bead on his forehead while he's shouldering a big cam... and I'm drenched! Good booming is hard!
On a current production they keep giving me guys that want to hold the pole across their shoulders within 1 freakin' minute of putting the pole out there! WTF is that? Dude you just took THREE FEET off the mic's reach... next thing I know the boom op asks the director if the echoey sound will be a problem... I snatched the pole out of his hands and never said another word to him.
Get the longest, lightest pole you can afford! When recording, INCHES matter and most boom ops will be off by FEET... give a guy a 9' pole instead of a 13' pole and I GUARANTEE that unless he really really really cares... he will be 4' farther away from the source even if he doesn't need to be in order to be out of frame! People are lazy... booming is yoga with weights.
Again let me repeat... get the longest, lightest pole you can afford. From what I've seen so far that means the Gitzo g7680c.
Painter's pole? Forget it! If you absolutely can't afford a real pole then I sympathize... we all start somewhere... make due with what you have to... but don't kid yourself about the value in professional tools.
I've got a K-Tek 9' graphite avalon which is a joy to use because it's so freakishly lightweight... but there are a lot of times where 9' just isn't enough to get me there.
I couldn't afford a 12.5' or longer graphite K-Tek so I got a Gitzo CF pole at that length... the g7680c.
I'll still use the K-Tek until it's used up... but for any newbie I will no longer suggest any of the shorter poles. Even at $250 the Gitzo is a bargain for what it is... the last two lengths can't be used all the way out... you must back them in a few inches... so really it's a 12' 6" pole (usable)... but this is adequate length to seperate those who care about sound from those who kind of care about sound. Really this could turn into an all-out vent session... because I am repeatedly appalled at how crappy boom ops are... I rarely see a good boom op... even those that are considered to be professionals. I can't believe that everybody is that out of shape... or whatever the heck the problem is... people are lazy. Is it really that hard to point the damn mic? Put an AA sized narrow beam flashlight on the end of a pole and put it in the mic mount... now see if you can keep an actor's face in the light. Is it really that hard? A mic is more forgiving then a flashlight... you want to lead the actors a bit... but not much. Pointing the pole in the general direction will be better then not trying at all... but man it chaps my ass how little pride most boom ops take in their work.
Am I just bitching or do I have a point? The point is that you WILL have a hard time getting a good boom op... I don't know you personally so maybe even YOU won't be that attentive to the sound as your arms get more and more tired. The less weight you have to support directly over your head... the better off your sound will be for it.
The other factor of weight is leverage... with my 9' pole I sometimes suddenly have to poke it out over a shot and I'm holding onto the very end of the pole where the cable goes in... this is not easy to do for a long time until you get in serious shape. Everybody SAYS they will get in shape... but you gotta' boom a few times to really understand what that means. I've been completely sweaty booming live action in an airconditioned environment before... the cam op doesn't have one bead on his forehead while he's shouldering a big cam... and I'm drenched! Good booming is hard!
On a current production they keep giving me guys that want to hold the pole across their shoulders within 1 freakin' minute of putting the pole out there! WTF is that? Dude you just took THREE FEET off the mic's reach... next thing I know the boom op asks the director if the echoey sound will be a problem... I snatched the pole out of his hands and never said another word to him.
Get the longest, lightest pole you can afford! When recording, INCHES matter and most boom ops will be off by FEET... give a guy a 9' pole instead of a 13' pole and I GUARANTEE that unless he really really really cares... he will be 4' farther away from the source even if he doesn't need to be in order to be out of frame! People are lazy... booming is yoga with weights.
Again let me repeat... get the longest, lightest pole you can afford. From what I've seen so far that means the Gitzo g7680c.
Painter's pole? Forget it! If you absolutely can't afford a real pole then I sympathize... we all start somewhere... make due with what you have to... but don't kid yourself about the value in professional tools.
Capt Quirk
Veteran
Hey Wabbit, as soon as I get a chance to use it, I'll let you know. Having never used a boom mic before, I can't compare mine to a pro, so I can't ***** about how heavy, loud, or short it is. I have done a lot of shoots without one though, and can comment on what it's like with nothing but a cam mounted mic... again, better than nothing at all 
Interesting thread! Did we find a nerve there Matt??? I'm a newbie too, just putting together my first real audio kit and yes bucks are tight. In the stuff we've shot to date we frequently used a extendable paint stick (litewt knurled aluminium) as a boom with decent results.
Totally agree with Matt that freehand booming is major exercise and every gram counts. We've been fortunate to date since the majority of our boomed shot scenes didn't really involve much actor movement and the boom guy was able to use a crutch. Ours is basically a stick just over 7 ft with angled dowels stuck in it forming pockets that the boom op can rest the pole in at various heights. Left hand holds the stick and the right raises/lowers the pole. (think see-saw) Obviously no good for moving action, but really seems to help inexperienced ops keep the altitude steady and not drop into the shot, plus really saves wear & tear on the back muscles.
Our ops were totally inexperienced high school kids and the flashlight stuck in the mount trick was incredible practice and a real confidence builder for them. The light also strangely seemed to help the student actors learn to focus on their delivery and block distractions.
As Matt has said in other posts, once you get your pole you won't believe you ever shot without it, but in the meantime other things can be made to work. I think we got the Alu pole out of the busted bin at harbor freight - I think it was originally for changing litebulbs in high ceilings and someone had busted the light grabbie thing on the end. Think I paid $6. First shock mount was made from pvc pipe and a cut up bicycle tube. You do what u need to do. . . .
Good Luck!
Totally agree with Matt that freehand booming is major exercise and every gram counts. We've been fortunate to date since the majority of our boomed shot scenes didn't really involve much actor movement and the boom guy was able to use a crutch. Ours is basically a stick just over 7 ft with angled dowels stuck in it forming pockets that the boom op can rest the pole in at various heights. Left hand holds the stick and the right raises/lowers the pole. (think see-saw) Obviously no good for moving action, but really seems to help inexperienced ops keep the altitude steady and not drop into the shot, plus really saves wear & tear on the back muscles.
Our ops were totally inexperienced high school kids and the flashlight stuck in the mount trick was incredible practice and a real confidence builder for them. The light also strangely seemed to help the student actors learn to focus on their delivery and block distractions.
As Matt has said in other posts, once you get your pole you won't believe you ever shot without it, but in the meantime other things can be made to work. I think we got the Alu pole out of the busted bin at harbor freight - I think it was originally for changing litebulbs in high ceilings and someone had busted the light grabbie thing on the end. Think I paid $6. First shock mount was made from pvc pipe and a cut up bicycle tube. You do what u need to do. . . .
Good Luck!
ScoobySounds
Well-known member
i've never seen a painters pole used for a boom before, so can't make any useful comments. i'd imagine there's a bit of false economy going on. I could never afford to cut corners like that.. anyhting that i'm not SURE will work on set I am very hesitant to use, because its the worst when you hold up production for equipment reasons. I've done it, we've all done it. the clouds are perfect, the camera is set, the actors makup is fresh and the AD is staring at you, then something doesn't work. ..and it still doesn't work. wheather that be a squeeky boom, that you onbly just noticed is squeeking because now everybody is quiet, or its something else equally under-prepared to be on a professional shoot, it is holding up a lot of people and spening a lot of money by doing so. so if in that situation you went on with the shot and didn't say anything, then you are only wasting even more money in post trying to sort it out.
if this is a less professional shoot and you and your buddies can afford to lay about while something is sorted, then power to ya.. but multiply that by all the other bits of dodgy kit you might be relying on.
but, like I said i've never seen it done.
I can say though that I bought a cheap 2nd boom to cut corners and save money and the thing is completely useless apart from stationary on a c-stand. its the rode one thats all over ebay for £50 or so, and when I got it I was so pleased with it, it actually feels really well made, slides smoothly and tightens very nicely. Its heavier than my 1st boom, but longer to make up for that.. i thought great! until the day it started creaking.
Aaaarghh!
I sacked it there and then. i said sort yourself out, go and get a drink of WD40 and see how you are.. it had one job to do and could even to that. Hold mic quietly.
if this is a less professional shoot and you and your buddies can afford to lay about while something is sorted, then power to ya.. but multiply that by all the other bits of dodgy kit you might be relying on.
but, like I said i've never seen it done.
I can say though that I bought a cheap 2nd boom to cut corners and save money and the thing is completely useless apart from stationary on a c-stand. its the rode one thats all over ebay for £50 or so, and when I got it I was so pleased with it, it actually feels really well made, slides smoothly and tightens very nicely. Its heavier than my 1st boom, but longer to make up for that.. i thought great! until the day it started creaking.
Aaaarghh!
I sacked it there and then. i said sort yourself out, go and get a drink of WD40 and see how you are.. it had one job to do and could even to that. Hold mic quietly.
TyFord
Well-known member
MattinSTL said:
I use a 16ft K-tek. Manfred also sells aluminum poles for those who don't want to spend the money on carbon fiber.
I chose the 16ft figuring that if I bought the 12ft, I'd need the 16ft within 24 hours (my karma). I have rarely used all 16 ft. The length does come in handy for counterbalancing though.
Don't kill the messenger, but "Look at the dork with the painters pole." That's what the rest of the crew (and others) are saying, even though you may not hear them. Painters poles are like showing up with a 1990 Magnavox VHS camcorder.
Regards,
Ty Ford
Capt Quirk
Veteran
That old VHS might be really sweet if you don't have anything but an old betamax...tyreeford said:
wabbit
Evil has Ears
I am not under the impression we are talking a professional set here. Someone talking about a painter's pole solution is going to be a group of guys/gals (no one using the word professional here) putting together their first film. When this is the case, whatever works to get the job done is the philsophy.
The first part of being a professional is setting up a budget. If you are putting together a piecemeal kit and have not budgeted for everything needed then you are by definition not a professional....yet.
I think a painter's pole is probably a great learning tool. Better to blow $10 bucks on an unfit solution and discover the value of a $500 tool then to blow $200 on a half-assed solution that works but does not work well.
On Matt's posting:
Could not agree more. There is huge supply/demand problem with good boom ops. The budget for boom op is almost always too low. I will boom for my fellow mixers in town but the times those calls do come the day rate is too low to waste my time. Boom gigs with low pay always mean low respect too. I got better things to do with my time then work for $200 a day and be treated like someone's whipping boy. Poor pay, high demand, leads to inferior product.
Inexperienced producers assume the boom op is Mcjob that anyone can fill so they slash the budget down to a McDonald's rate. So, of course, anyone with experience and talent won't bite.
I have worked with a ton of boom ops over the years, most of them bad. The problem is the good ones quickly learn not to work for peanuts so I have to find someone else. When a production comes along that pays an appropriate wage I have zero problems getting a good boom op.
Just like the DP and the camera dept, a mixer does not do his job in a vacuum. It is a team effort and if the production can't raise the dough to hire a talented team then they get what they paid for.
Cheers
The first part of being a professional is setting up a budget. If you are putting together a piecemeal kit and have not budgeted for everything needed then you are by definition not a professional....yet.
I think a painter's pole is probably a great learning tool. Better to blow $10 bucks on an unfit solution and discover the value of a $500 tool then to blow $200 on a half-assed solution that works but does not work well.
On Matt's posting:
Could not agree more. There is huge supply/demand problem with good boom ops. The budget for boom op is almost always too low. I will boom for my fellow mixers in town but the times those calls do come the day rate is too low to waste my time. Boom gigs with low pay always mean low respect too. I got better things to do with my time then work for $200 a day and be treated like someone's whipping boy. Poor pay, high demand, leads to inferior product.
Inexperienced producers assume the boom op is Mcjob that anyone can fill so they slash the budget down to a McDonald's rate. So, of course, anyone with experience and talent won't bite.
I have worked with a ton of boom ops over the years, most of them bad. The problem is the good ones quickly learn not to work for peanuts so I have to find someone else. When a production comes along that pays an appropriate wage I have zero problems getting a good boom op.
Just like the DP and the camera dept, a mixer does not do his job in a vacuum. It is a team effort and if the production can't raise the dough to hire a talented team then they get what they paid for.
Cheers
Oh amen. Wabbit's caught both the spirit of the original post and the lesson(s) to be learned. Hear hear.
As for the "dork with the pole" comments - it is also unfortunately reality, but you're still being snobs. One of the finest animal portrait photographers in the world uses a Brownie Box camera (wonder where she gets the film???). I'm sorry, but this is about the art, not "my lens is bigger than your lens". - minnie rant, my bad.
timapter
Veteran
sorry, but while boom operating is undoubtably an incredibly difficult skill to learn, and when accurately and well done can feel like poetry, its still science and not art.
your analogy doesnt quite work for me, because using a brownie box camera might be considered technique, whereas using a painters pole can only be considered a limitation on the grounds of budget. NO ONE would ever CHOOSE to use a painters pole.
your analogy doesnt quite work for me, because using a brownie box camera might be considered technique, whereas using a painters pole can only be considered a limitation on the grounds of budget. NO ONE would ever CHOOSE to use a painters pole.
timapter
Veteran
My Ktek gear arrived a couple days ago - K-Zep and a carbon pole with internal cabling. Love it, well made stuff - Manfred and co are tops on my list. Going to be using it extensively when I get back on the ENG/EFP scene next year.
Im lucky at the moment to be working with an ACE boom op - a guy with the perfect sort of attitude: he wont become a mixer until he's boomed himself to death for at least 4 years. He's on year 3 at the moment, and I really respect his will to walk the line. He really does make my job easy, and on top of that, Wabbit is so right about the whole team thing on a drama/feature shoot - it matters.
Im lucky at the moment to be working with an ACE boom op - a guy with the perfect sort of attitude: he wont become a mixer until he's boomed himself to death for at least 4 years. He's on year 3 at the moment, and I really respect his will to walk the line. He really does make my job easy, and on top of that, Wabbit is so right about the whole team thing on a drama/feature shoot - it matters.