BEST 4x4 ND Filters

D

DDirector

Veteran
So, I guess I'm not getting the Dana dolly right now as I probably wont be needing it now for my client, so I can stick to what I originally wanted instead. I'm buying the Tilta III mattebox and I'm looking for the BEST solid ND filters I can get (4x4).

The problem is, I need a whole range of stops from 1-9 stops. But according to B&H no filter goes high enough.
0.3, 0.6, 0.9, 1.2, 1.5, 1.8, 2.1, 2.4, 2.7

Looking at B&H:
Schneider goes to 1.8
Tiffen goes to 2.1 (but half aren't White Water Glass according to description)
Formatt goes to 2.4

The ONLY filter that I saw that goes to 2.7 is HiTech. But, I haven't heard from anyone that they were a good brand or recommended them. So, I don't think I should trust them.

Id personally like to go with Schneider filters as I heard lot of good things about them, but I'm not sure if they really ARE the best.

DOES the Scheider go up to a 2.7?
-If so, where can I get it instead? - in Canada it would probably be better, depending on price.

Should I be getting IRND's instead?
As of now, I shoot on a DSLR, but also will be working on the RED One & Scarlet, and other cameras that I am unaware of as it depends on gigs.
 
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Wow, thats a lot of stops. How fast are your lenses and do you run them wide open? I almost always shoot at around 5.6 and have 0.3-1.2 and I've never needed more. You can double them up in a matte box to get a max of 2.1 which should be enough, but you never know.
Oh, and go with Schneider. I've had others but nothing touches them!
 
DDirector,
Over the years, I've seen full-page ads for both Schneider and Tiffen filters in American Cinematographer, both with endorsements from ASC cinematographers. When I bought a 4x4 polarizing filter, I chose Schneider because of the multi-coating, even though I knew Tiffen had a great reputation. Recently I was reading through a FAQ page on the Tiffen site, and came across this:
Q: Is the Tiffen 58mm circular polarizer multicoated? .....

A: The Tiffen Circular Polarizer is not multicoated. However filters are not like multi-element camera lenses and there is virtually no performance difference between multicoated and non-multicoated filters. Furthermore, multicoatings are often fragile and a damaged coating can be worse than no coating at all....


Getting a filter with White Water glass is probably a good idea.
http://www.waterwhiteglass.com/

-- Ken
 
As a side note: if you need more ND, you can always layer filters. 1.2 + 1.5 = 2.7.

But I'm also surprised that you need that much ND.
 
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Alex H. said:
As a side not: if you need more ND, you can always layer filters. 1.2 + 1.5 = 2.7.

But I'm also surprised that you need that much ND.
Click to expand...

+1

Also if you are going to be shooting 5K in the future with Red, why are you not considering 4x5.65 instead of 4x4 filters?
 
Some cameras like my dslr I most likely won't need up to 2.7. Maybe up to 1.8 or 2.1. But other cameras have higher iso ratings such as the red at about 800, so I would need ND's at 2.7 I am shooting on the red this fall, so I know I'd need to get something that high.

I know I can stack them, but it rather not. The mattebox only has 2 filter trays, and it may be that I need a POL or another filter in there too. It may have slight colour shift too if stacked.

I just want to play it safe and have all the ND that I could possibly have without stacking or colour shifting.

Would I need IRND's or plain ND's?
 
Haven't shot RED in awhile, but IR contamination can be an issue. I seem to remember Formatt filters working well with the original sensor, but that was before the MX, & I just used Hot Mirrors in front of heavy NDs.

I'd check a forum with more RED users.
 
Rather not spend more money on a mattebox that has 4x5.65 and is large enough for larger lenses and has a swing away. They get too pricey for something so simple. Besides a 4x4 works doesn it not? Don't see the need to spend way more on a mattebox and filters to have it slightly larger if its not really needed. It May be useful at times, but I've never ran into that problem.

On a different note, I want to go up to a 2.4 if possible to be safe. That should bring things down to a f/4 or f/2.8 if on iso 320 and it gets to f/45.

Would it be best to go with Schneider and then stack if needed, or get Formatt which goes to a 2.4

Unless if I need IRND's on most cameras, not just Red.
 
If you are only ever going to use small APS-C still glass and not going to shoot 5K on the Red then a little 4x4 should be OK. If however you anticipate using any real cine glass and shooting 5K in the future, you might want to invest accordingly, rather than buying twice. Just saying, I have a 4x4 matte box that hardly ever gets used now.

Good Luck!

Dave
 
Don't put to much credence in paid endorsements, even if it comes from an ASC member. I know two of those guys sponsored by Schneider, & they use other brands when needed.

Schneider is a great glass maker, & I'm not criticizing them, but so far never heard any seriuos complaints about Formatt, or other high-end manufacturers'.

HiTech is a division of Formatt, & believe they only manufacture Resin Filters, not glass. I have (roughly) a hundred Sinar, Lee, & HiTech, resin filters from my still photography days. They are very high quality, & thin, so optically superior to many of the thicker Cine filters, but no where near as rugged, & a poor choice around rain, or ocean spray.

I still occasionally use them when traveling due to their compact, & lightweight nature, particularly the Lee ND Grads, but the compendium bellows is far to easy to rotate by mistake.
 
David W. Jones said:
If you are only ever going to use small APS-C still glass and not going to shoot 5K on the Red then a little 4x4 should be OK. If however you anticipate using any real cine glass and shooting 5K in the future, you might want to invest accordingly, rather than buying twice. Just saying, I have a 4x4 matte box that hardly ever gets used now.

Good Luck!

Dave
Click to expand...
I don't intend on using stills lenses for much. I want to eventually upgrade to cine lenses to the RPP, but I mean that's far into the future. I am just barely making enough to afford this.
But if I have funds to rent glass, I would be using cine lenses, but is it a BIG deal to use 4x5.65 instead of 4x4?
 
Consider owning a decent set of 4x4's. If you're renting an Epic and a set of primes for a budgeted production, rent the larger matte box & filters you need at the same time. It's not going to add much to the budget. I like owning the basics to have a complete kit, but there's no end to how much stuff you can end up buying. (of course, if you can afford an epic and a set of lenses, the filters aren't going to seem like that big of a deal...)
 
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