AC160 any Comparison between 160 zoom and jvc gy hm600 zoom? firmware update already

R

Rod Pike

Well-known member
Hi all,

I am eagerly awaiting an objective review of the JVC 23x zoom to compare to the 160. Has anyone seen anything yet?

I spotted this item today, announcing a firmware upgrade to the JVC autofocus already! What were the problems I wonder?

JVC Offers Firmware Upgrade for GY-HM600 ProHD Camera
Update adds features, improves performance
GY%20HM600.jpg
WAYNE, N.J. –JVC Professional Products Company has released a firmware upgrade for the GY-HM600 handheld ProHD camera.

The upgrade improves the autofocus, signal-to-noise ratio and flash band compensation, which minimizes or eliminates banding when using an external flash.

Its features now include preset modes to optimize settings for common shooting scenarios. “Standard” is for ideal lighting conditions, and “Extended” has maximum gain for ENG image capture for difficult. The camera also offers “AF Assist” while utilizing “Auto Focus” mode.

​
 
Hi Rod

This guy seem intent on zooming all over the place and there are a few spots where you can see the focus acting up a little slow when the light is low. It seems that it's an issue with big zoom cameras maybe??? They don't specify whether the firmware upgrade has been done or not but I doubt it!! I think the camera is far too new to expect anyone to run "tests" yet. Are you just comparing or are your eyes drifting towards the JVC now???

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GQ7Nm8ASsGU

Chris
 
Yes, that footage shows some focus behavior similar to the AC series. Looks like a nice image on par with the other cameras in the class.
 
Hi Chris,
Thanks for that. Yes it had crossed my mind, but my 160a is now having its lens and servo assemblies replaced under warranty, so I will see how it shapes up on return. (should be next week)

By the way, I shot some test footage with a sony rx100 yesterday. This is a compact with a 1" sensor. Be afraid, be very afraid!! The quality is mind blowing. I enlarged the shots 300% and dual tracked it with my 160a material shot in the same street- It is sharper than anything my 160a could produce. Low light is just awesome, with a bloody great sensor and an f1.8 lens! Bokeh DOF control to die for! I know this is something that interests you for weddings. (no street cred of course on a job because it is so tiny- you would have to appear to use it as a sort of stills/video notebook, and then plug it in to your main shoot material.)
There is some really good footage on the sony "any other cameras " section on this DVXuser site. This is one scary camera which can go anywhere with you and take amazing 1080/50p which reviewers are saying can easily be mixed with footage from our so called pro cameras- FS100 and FS700 are quoted.

Two other points: The OIS is truly stunning: and one last thing- the screen has a spirit level axis indicator like a flight simulator- how cool is that? Holding such a tiny camera level is always an issue. I think all cameras should have this. I am going to get one today!

Cheers!
Rod
 
Rod Pike said:
...By the way, I shot some test footage with a sony rx100 yesterday. This is a compact with a 1" sensor. Be afraid, be very afraid!! The quality is mind blowing. I enlarged the shots 300% and dual tracked it with my 160a material shot in the same street- It is sharper than anything my 160a could produce. ...
Cheers!
Rod
Click to expand...
Sad and pathetic all wrapped up in one. that sony has a 9x larger cmos compared to 130/160 series. If you cut up the sony's rx100 ($600-650) cmos into 9 pieces... you could then put them into three 130/160 cameras ($4200+ each camera). Us Pros are getting financially raped. This explains why the GH2 was so popular. A little hacking and bamm... a bunch of features unearthed.
If I was doing film style production I wouldn't be wasting my money on "video" cameras. I would get a large single chip camera and a nice lens and punching out gorgeous footage. A 1" chip must be amazing in lower lighting situations.
 
ELN614 said:
that sony has a 9x larger cmos compared to 130/160 series.
Click to expand...
Yes. And it has a 3x lens instead of a 22x lens, specifically because its sensor is that much bigger. There are tradeoffs in all engineering decisions, and there's no free lunch. Pick what works best for you, but don't go thinking that "because x product can do this, then all products should be able to do it".
If you cut up the sony's rx100 ($600-650) cmos into 9 pieces... you could then put them into three 130/160 cameras ($4200+ each camera).
Click to expand...
Yeah, three cameras that were all less than half standard-def. How would that be a good idea? Your contention makes no sense.

If I was doing film style production I wouldn't be wasting my money on "video" cameras. I would get a large single chip camera and a nice lens and punching out gorgeous footage. A 1" chip must be amazing in lower lighting situations.
Click to expand...
Well, yeah -- that's the point. Some types of cameras are more appropriate for film-style productions, and are totally inappropriate (or certainly much less desirable) for those that need what a video camera can do. That's why both products exist.
 
Hi ELN614, Yes you've got it in one! When I first saw the reviews I just didn't believe it. So I went to my local photo warehouse and shot some footage. I was immediately depressed and overwhelmed when I got back home with the footage. My $8000 camera can of course do lots of clever stuff but it just doesn't resolve like this little $900 Sony with the massive sensor. Nor does the Panny OIS come within miles of this little masterpiece. I use a Steadicam Pilot full harness rig occasionally and this camera really does come damn close to it- in my opinion much better than the AC90.

And yes , its low light performance is staggering. Full manual control on everything too. All from a camera no bigger than a cigarette packet! You could shoot docos, walkabouts, Music vids (especially with the 1.8 lens and DOF control- make your own arrangements for sound though) .

Barry as usual is right of course, we have choices and this cannot do all of the things that a 160a can do. But for me, it is the perfect solution to a high quality video camera that can be with me at all times

I will have one within the next two hours and it will go everywhere with me from now on.
Cheers!
Rod
 
I have read people saying the RX100 would be a better "Go Pro" type of camera due to the IS and the quality. The still cameras are reeking havoc with the established camcorder market.
 
Hi Guys

There comes a point also where you need practicality and a palm sized camera just won't work well for weddings unless you put it in a huge rig (which is quite possible too) I really don't understand Sony at all!! They bring out a sub $1K camera with a huge sensor and awesome low light and OIS and then they launch a really practical sized shoulder mount camera (the NEX - EA-50) with a huge APS sensor and then a zoom lens that barely manages F3.5 at wide so the advantages of the big sensor are basically crushed by the slow lens!! It would have been a really nice run 'n gun camera. At events you also still have to have a camera or two that have some "respect" which normally means they need to look like pro cameras and not tiny toys that guests are using.

Let's have some footage Rod of this new marvel of yours????

Chris
 
Hi Chris,
Yes you bet! I will get something put together for viewing. Not sure if I should start a thread in the Sony section- I shouldn't really hijack my own thread! Still, I will post here until told to move, to save anyone having to search.

I am charging the battery as we speak. And I'm with you on the Sony EA50. WHY do they do it?? Great innovation on shape, big sensor, slow lens and I believe no ND?- give me strength! I was seriously interested in that and I think everyone and his dog would have been happy to have paid a bit more for er-- a bit more!
 
Thanks Rod

Also nice to know that the Panny is being repaired for you!!! Yeah the EA50 doesn't even have internal auto ND's like the AC-90 ..it is purely shutter and iris for control so shooting outdoors with the camera as is will mean aperture will always be tiny and shutter will be high.... I was contemplating a change for weddings but apart from the nearly $5K price, you would need at the very least, a wide fast lens (sorta 16mm F1.8) and a fast mediun (50mm F1.8) so that would tag on an extra couple of grand to the price at least.

Hmmm maybe wedding videos soon will involve an adventure cam on a head mount and you holding an iPad and controlling the view .... On the RX100 I think panning with a big 25mm sensor might cause a lot of skew???? I wait for your footage...I;m guessing the wife won't be seeing you for the rest of the day??

Chris
 
Rod Pike said:
Be afraid, be very afraid!! The quality is mind blowing. I enlarged the shots 300% and dual tracked it with my 160a material shot in the same street- It is sharper than anything my 160a could produce.
Click to expand...

Although I don't have a 160a, I think it's capable of being sharper than the rx100. Adam Wilt measured the resolution at 1000 tv lines, which puts it near the nyquist limit of the format. Meanwhile, single sensor dslr's have bayer sensors and line skipping. EOSHD put the resolution of the rx100 at behind the gh2, which already is only about 800 lines, while also noting some of the usual dslr issues of moire, aliasing and chroma noise.
 
Hi Tom,
Yes technically I'm sure you are right and wouldn't question objective technical data, in fact objective tests are what proved my panny had an auto focus issue.(perfect in manual of course)
However, I do have both cameras and my observations are purely based on what I can see, real world. I have since expanded both shots to 400% and the panny is relying on some edge acutance whereas the little Sony doesn't appear to be. My panny was set at default with no enhancement to accutance. And remember you can put this camera in your top pocket!

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder they say! ( that's why my wife married me, she has appalling eyesight!). I am not panny bashing ( I have spent a fortune buying one!). I have no brand loyalty at all, I just want the best tools for the job and as an extremely mobile camera this SOny answers my dreams of being able to take a camera anywhere. Hey , I will be posting some vdeo from this Sony later.
Cheers!
Rod
 
Hi all,
here is my very first outing with the Sony rx100. It is not meant to have any artistic merit, but just to give me an idea of what this gem is capable of. It is a deceptively complex bit of kit and will take some getting used to. The Youtube vid is at 720p and it doesn't do justice to the original at 1080/50p 28m ps. But it should give some idea anyway. The detail in the seagull is incredible. enjoy! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eXAnbgoxJs4
 
Hi Terry,
I have not carried out any objective tests yet other than what you can see here. However, there were a couple of occasions where I thought it to be a tad slow when going from near to far (here we go again!) but this may well have been the mapped area of focus chosen. Certainly my shots with the moving vehicles and follow focus were bang on - I was thinking of our colleague ELN614 and his beautiful horses for those shots. Much more objective work to be done yet, but for the money , it is truly astounding in my opinion.
 
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