Any Alternatives to Final Cut Pro for Mac User??

B

Beck_Summers

Member
Hi All ....

I am wanting to edit 24P footage shot on the Panny using my Mac but don't want to shell out a grand on Final Cut Pro in order to do this ( i won't be using all the features FCP has to offer) ... apparantly Final Cut Express doesn't handle 24P footage ...

Is there any alternative programs that i can use or do i have to splash out on Final Cut Pro?

Cheers!
 
Re: Any Alternatives to Final Cut Pro for Mac User

Re: Any Alternatives to Final Cut Pro for Mac User

Sorry,

But it looks like you're going to have to dish out the $1000. I don't understand why you're complaining. $1,000 is nothing in the grand scheme of things. You're lucky a $1,000 piece of software can deal with 24p footage. Your other alternative is to use Avid Xpress Pro and that costs $1600. So suck it up and dish out the cash. Otherwise you can use PeeCee and get Vegas. I hear that is a good program that cand do 24p.

Peace,
ScottyD
 
Re: Any Alternatives to Final Cut Pro for Mac User

Re: Any Alternatives to Final Cut Pro for Mac User

So what's the deal with final cut express? Can't it produce 24fps output? Can't it edit in a 24 fps timeline? If both of these answers are "it can", then all you need is DVFilm Maker for the MAC. Convert your 24pa footage to either 23.976 or 24 fps true progressive and edit away.

-Rodger
 
Re: Any Alternatives to Final Cut Pro for Mac User

Re: Any Alternatives to Final Cut Pro for Mac User

Hey ... thanks for the quick replies ...

Agreed that FCP is a truely remarkable product ... its just that i don't need a cadillac right now ... all i need is a Lada to get started ... the money saved could be put to good use out here in Roppongi !!

According to this http://www.dvshop.ca/software/finalcutcomp.html, Final Cut Express doesn't allow 24FPS editing ... so unless i am interpreting this incorrectly, i won't be able to capture/edit footage shot at 24PN on the DVX100 using Final Cut Express ... though, i will investigate the DVFilm Make bit a little more closely to see if this helps anyway ... thanks ! Beck
 
Re: Any Alternatives to Final Cut Pro for Mac User

Re: Any Alternatives to Final Cut Pro for Mac User

Just about any NLE out there can deal with 24PN. That's part of the beauty of the DVX.

If you just want to do work that will be going to DVD or web or whatever and aren't concerned about a true 24fps product then you can use Final Cut Express or even iMovie if you like.

Both programs will import the footage as standard 29.97fps footage and print it back out to tape (or DVD or whatever) just fine after editing.

And when you get serious, have a real budget, and are ready to move up to a true 24P editing station, you'll already be somewhat familiar with the product and how it works. yay

-Marc
 
Re: Any Alternatives to Final Cut Pro for Mac User

Re: Any Alternatives to Final Cut Pro for Mac User

Thanks for the useful info Marc ...



Just to clarify the points you made .... ,


1. The FCE vs. FCP website states the following:-

Panasonic 24p support FCE = no FCP = yes

By support, does this mean FCE can not capture footage shot at 24PN? Edit footage (using at 24FPS timeline) shot at 24PN???? Exactly what does "Panasonic 24p not supported on FCE" mean????


2. If footage is shot at 24PN, will the filmic look be preserved even though i am editing at 29.97FPS (by using FCE or iMovie according to your reply)? Otherwise, what wud be the point of shooting 24PN? may as well shoot 30.


Sorry for the confusion on this,

Cheers, Beck
 
Re: Any Alternatives to Final Cut Pro for Mac User

Re: Any Alternatives to Final Cut Pro for Mac User

The difference is that FCE and iMovie don't support editing in a 24fps timeline.

The camera stores all footage on the tape in 29.97fps anyway, whether you're shooting 24PN, 24PA, or even 60i. The difference comes when the NLE system knows how to get the footage back to the "pure" 24 frames every second or not.

You probably don't want to shoot 24PA because that means that every 5th frame is a duplicate (or 3rd frame..... whatever it is that it actually does.... there are some great explanations out there) so the motion will look odd. But if you shoot 24PN and import, you'll be editing basically film looks like when it's shown on TV.

It's not going to give you a pure final product that you would want to put out to film, but I get the impression that's not what you're interested in at this point anyway.

So, to answer your question, YES, FCE will import and let you edit footage from the DVX. NO you can not edit in a 24fps timeline (like you would do if you were making true progressive DVD or preparing for film-out), and YES the film look of 24PN is saved when editing in FCE and/or iMovie.

-Marc
 
Re: Any Alternatives to Final Cut Pro for Mac User

Re: Any Alternatives to Final Cut Pro for Mac User

You could always buy a PC and get Vegas ;)
I have a feeling I've just entered the lions den. :(
 
Re: Any Alternatives to Final Cut Pro for Mac User

Re: Any Alternatives to Final Cut Pro for Mac User

Hey Marc ... thanks for the great info!

Sorry, just two additional questions for you if I may .... namely, if i edit using FCE and thus a non 24P timeline, will there be any synch issues with the sound that was recorded during the 24PN shoot?

Furthermore, in your response you mentioned that FCE is fine for DVD output ... i just wanted to confirm if this includes BroadCast quality? In other words, is the concept of editing 24PN footage using FCE (thus non 24P timeline) and the final edited product to be of TV BroadCast Quality completely incompatible (like chalk and cheese)?

For a BroadCast Quality product, is FCP (besides great DVX100 footage!) the only way to go?

I know FCP is in the long run the way to go, however FCE is substantially cheaper and the learning curve shallower. The idea wud be to upgrade to FCP after spending 6 months or so learning FCE.


cheers, beck
 
Re: Any Alternatives to Final Cut Pro for Mac User

Re: Any Alternatives to Final Cut Pro for Mac User

Beck,

I haven't had any problems with sync when working with iMovie, FCE, or FCP, but then again, I really haven't done any really large projects.

All of my work has been for non-broadcast purposes and I'm relatively new to the video world myself, so unfortunately I'm not at all able to answer questions about the broadcast quality output from FCE.

I think you're more than fine starting out with FCE, but if you wanted to be certain you might ask in the Final Cut board where peoplel with more experience can confirm or deny what I have to say.

-Marc
 
Re: Any Alternatives to Final Cut Pro for Mac User

Re: Any Alternatives to Final Cut Pro for Mac User

Broadcast quality (referring to the image quality, as technical quality is a whole story of its own) is largely determined by the image quality that the camera can capture, the quality of the codec used in the NLE of choice, and the number of generations of compression the footage goes through before its final output.

On the mac, iMovie, FCE, and FCP all use by default the Quicktime DV codec. Therefore, the image quality will be the same across all of these editors.

Put simply: No, you do not need FCP to attain broadcast quality. If you did the same thing to your footage in all 3 of these editors, you would end up with the same quality image from all of them.

To further clarify the use of 24pN, just know that that you can shoot in this mode and edit in basically any NLE capable of editing interlaced DV footage. The "film look" is not dependent on how or with what you edit your footage, but by the camera, namely the DVX's CCD that captures at 24fps when in either 24p mode.
 
Re: Any Alternatives to Final Cut Pro for Mac User

Re: Any Alternatives to Final Cut Pro for Mac User

Hey great ... ! Thanks for the explanation and timely response ... cheers, beck
 
Re: Any Alternatives to Final Cut Pro for Mac User

Re: Any Alternatives to Final Cut Pro for Mac User

hey just a quick off topic question., if one was to shoot in 24pN and then edit in a normal 29.97 timeline, would the differences in the cadence (spelling?) be noticeable? (assuming you didn't cut on a half frame)
my guess is no since the motion stutter would be preserved from clip to clip?
 
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