As a single camera operator, I don't prefer how they have moved the lcd display to the other side where I can't see it.
Amazing New SONY VENICE Music Video Footage (Lewis Capaldi)
- Thread starter AlienRock
- Start date
As a single camera operator, I don't prefer how they have moved the lcd display to the other side where I can't see it.
The reason is the Venice most likely wasn't designed for single operators.
Yeah, it's super easy and runs in real-time in Premiere Pro (and will do the same in FCP X, Resolve, etc.):
https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=premiere+pro+diffusion
https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=premiere+pro+simulate+diffusion
Simple example: copy video track above original. Add Gaussian Blur to top track. Change Blend Mode to Overlay. Experiment with Blur amount and Opacity % of top track (as well as Blend Mode). Many variants based on this concept (including working on highlights only)- see links.
Also a cool plugin (have tested- seems to work pretty well): https://digitalanarchy.com/beautyVID/main.html . Another trick for skin issues is to use Neat Video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KeXhzmcdsQ4
Grug
Veteran
It's a $90,000 camera, it really isn't intended for single-operators. That said, you appear to be able to access everything you'd need to in the moment, from the operators side. And you can have full menu control via wifi on your phone, if needed - which saves you the trip to the other side of the camera.
Other features like the internal NDs and 5-second boot time, would actually make life vastly easier for a solo operator.
Operationally, I think the Venice is probably tied for first place alongside the Panavision DXL2 now. Sony did a fantastic job of listening the the features that would make camera operation easier on set.
The five-second boot time and internal NDs alone, would cumulatively probably save me about 15-20 minutes (at minimum) on-set EVERY SINGLE DAY. That's a substantial injection of shoot time back into the schedule. Which is fantastic.
Wifi I use now on my F55, full operational menu control from the phone is possible but not the parameter readouts. Would be nice if it were possible to monitor the live recording as well.
If the camera operator could access everything needed with wifi, the AC would have been able to do the same thing had the LCD been on the operator side. 5 second boot time would be wonderful. (I'm not getting one..:embarasse
JPNola
Veteran
I get your criticism. I mean, would it have been that difficult to design the camera with the full lcd display on both sides? One reason they may not have is that it is somewhat redundant since the cam op has all that info in the VF.
The dumb-side display and control is so that an AC can access items in the camera menu without having to get into the Operator's space or ask them to move. Cam Ops on features are almost always sitting at the camera. And what with the hierarchy it is kinda uncool for the AC to make the Operator move from his position. The Cam Op might be watching rehearsal or thinking out his move. You don't want an AC to have to interrupt that for his tinkerings in the camera menu. He or she can do that from the dumb-side controls and menu display.
JPNola
Veteran
Or, Sony just didn't see any need? Sony didn't put an in-body display on the fs7 at all. Was that to keep the weight of the camera down, to keep the price down, or motivated by the knowledge that use of an on-board monitor is pretty much standard practice these days? Hmmm. We may never know.
NorBro
Major Contributor
I think most people wouldn't mind a small screen on the body on both sides. You don't need a state-of-the-art 4K panel to critically analyze your image with. But having something to see the picture and make changes is pretty convenient if you ask me. The ole "standard practice" where someone HAS to be HERE or THERE is just silly outdated thinking.
It's 2019; put a monitor on both sides.
It's 2019; put a monitor on both sides.
I think this is part of the problem why discipline is going to the dumpster on sets today. What you call outdated thinking is what has made it worked like a well oiled machine all these years. Only people I come across who have a problem with the old discipline are mostly people who have never worked in the system before. The system works. No need to change it IMO.
It's also a big part of why the Alexa is still smashing every other camera in the production world, specially mainstream Hollywood after being in production for basically 10 years. Arri understands the system and plays within its rules. While other companies trying to be post modern and reinvent the wheel don't have the penetration Arri has.
NorBro
Major Contributor
I don't have a problem with how others work and what's best for them; I have a problem with not creating something or thinking it shouldn't exist because of a single, stubborn mindset (and not saying Sony did that).
I totally understand why one may refrain from fixing something when it's not broken, but I also think everyone has the right to experiment and work how they see fit.
And ARRI's success has everything to do with making the right camera at the right time just as much as with their technology and system.
If you (anyone) is familiar with other industries (really how the world works in general), many people choose what's known and trusted. From simple things like the cleats athletes may wear out on the field to more complex choices like which instruments medical professionals may use, the decision is almost always made by default to go with a familiar and trusted company/brand that's been around for a long time even if a competitor is clearly offering something just as good or even better (but different).
ARRI is a snowball rolling down an endless hill...it's a borderline monopoly, in my opinion. Just like Apple, in my opinion. Realistically, what other choices do they really have besides RED? Besides Samsung? (In the mobile industry there are a few others for consideration based on the geographical location.)
Change can be daunting, but it doesn't mean everything has to stay the same for everyone. There is no reason why two screens can't exist on this or any camera that has the space for them.
I totally understand why one may refrain from fixing something when it's not broken, but I also think everyone has the right to experiment and work how they see fit.
And ARRI's success has everything to do with making the right camera at the right time just as much as with their technology and system.
If you (anyone) is familiar with other industries (really how the world works in general), many people choose what's known and trusted. From simple things like the cleats athletes may wear out on the field to more complex choices like which instruments medical professionals may use, the decision is almost always made by default to go with a familiar and trusted company/brand that's been around for a long time even if a competitor is clearly offering something just as good or even better (but different).
ARRI is a snowball rolling down an endless hill...it's a borderline monopoly, in my opinion. Just like Apple, in my opinion. Realistically, what other choices do they really have besides RED? Besides Samsung? (In the mobile industry there are a few others for consideration based on the geographical location.)
Change can be daunting, but it doesn't mean everything has to stay the same for everyone. There is no reason why two screens can't exist on this or any camera that has the space for them.
In a way I'm rooting for ARRI, since they are a tiny company and competition is good for everyone. In the final analysis it's clear Sony wins- already so close with color, DR, low light, AI AF, IBIS (needs work but they can do it), and most importantly: manufacturing scale (and in so many other markets. ARRI doesn't have a chance long term- maybe Sony will buy them as a brand?).
Then there's something no one outside of the AI industry is talking about: AI color. It's coming and probably everyone will have it (different variants, but it's relatively easy to do; training and tuning is the expensive part, inferencing is fast and relatively low cost per Watt). So Canon and ARRI's main advantages will be gone (cameras are already pretty excellent right now in general. Mixed/varied lighting still tricky- AI color will have no problem with it). AI "compression" will also shake things up (not really compression: deconstruction/reconstruction- early methods already being used for AI upscaling in Samsung and Sony 8K TVs).
Thus everyone will have to spend more time making content vs. forum talking about camera issues or talk more about story, camera techniques, lighting, acting, directing, managing, etc.
NorBro
Major Contributor
ARRI may not "have a chance" on paper, but in my opinion 'no one' is going to be using the Venice, lol.
I mean that's just how it is...the ALEXA LF/65 will continue to dominate no matter what.
Just like we have seen with the F55/65, all of the REDs, and the Varicams...a few major figures may decide to use them (and half of them seem like they may be paid ambassadors) and everything else will be shot on ARRI cameras.
It doesn't matter what a few nerds (you, I, and others) analyze about an image on DVXuser...many decision-makers with millions on the line will choose ARRI by default.
Times are a changin' (Nor)bro, major shifts in technology and media/broadcasting are coming. AI is the tech equalizer, interesting times we live in: a new creative renaissance?
Zsigmond James
Member
Having owned the F65 since pre-release (yes, even prior to Otto Nemez - as the first U.S. bound F65 was purchased at a heavily discounted price by Vilmos - a price that is still under NDA, although I can say, was comparable to what the F65 started to sell for used, two years later.) and now being an early adopter of the Venice. I can say, it’s true, my Sony cameras hardly rent out. Incidentally, the saving grace is, that as a cinematographer I have the privilege to hire on my own gear. However, it still goes without saying that it takes much longer for Sony gear to pay itself off for the owner/operator(if ever it does), in contrast, owning an Alexa - although that too is model specific, as my LF still isn’t renting out anywhere near as frequently the ubiquitous mini’s are that various friends own, in spite of the fact that those little bastards don’t shoot 4K. I get the sense - although its still too early to say - that the LF may in fact be relatively DOA, as it seems that since the advent of the Mini, DP’s are simply not interested in renting a large and heavy camera anymore... not unless it’s big blockbuster production... but then, said production would likely go with an Alexa 65 over the LF..... Arri is likely feeling pressured to release a Mini LF, which will all but kill the LF standard completely.... it’s a troubling time to buy and own cameras......
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NorBro
Major Contributor
This was such an unusual sequence of posts for me...I somehow started to defend change and then said no one's changing (no one's using anything but ARRI), lol.
(Obviously relating to different things, but just funny.)
___
And I am fully on-board with AI, AR and VR...I mention it once a week.
I started saving for a Lytro years ago...this is right up your alley!
https://www.bhphotovideo.com/explor...focus-and-determine-depth-field-after-capture
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4qXE4sA-hLQ
Too bad they are out-of-business (acquired by Google, naturally).
NorBro
Major Contributor
That's a great example...and it's because people are too comfortable!
The Mini just works. Such a simple and straightforward, proven camera.
But a LF Mini would be amazing.
Re: Lytro/computational cameras- it will happen in time; still too early. AI focus (A6400 and soon A9, A7 III, A7S III etc.) is here and will get much better. Got massive downvotes in the audio forum talking about advanced-tech/AI for sound lol.
Right this minute Sony could put tech in the A7S III that renders the comparatively ginormous VENICE (and ARRI LF/65) all obsolete. Small, lightweight cameras are the future; the main reason I sold the C300 II and want to sell the 1DX II as soon as there's a suitable replacement.
The most used tools are the ones which are the most flexible and adaptable. The Alexa Mini (and Reds) are fairly compact, and can be used stripped or built up to something quite large. The comment about VENICE tech in an A7S III body is that in 2019 there's no technical reason to require a large, heavy, power hungry camera component (the computing power in the latest iPhones vastly exceeds all cameras by a significant margin). Cinema lenses are still big/heavy and will be for some time, and thus a larger built-up rig makes sense in that case. As for crews WRT camera settings, monitoring, and focus- wireless has been and will be used even more.
Note that the VENICE has a removable sensor block to make the camera effectively much smaller: more flexibility = more usefulness and more value.
For cinema, all a camera really needs is a PL/EF/E mount in the smallest form factor possible with wireless control of everything and flexible power options. For example the VENICE sensor block (or even smaller) as the entire camera. Can be used as is or built into something larger when needed.