GH4 Alternative to a MOVI rig?

V

vincent thomas

Well-known member
For most of us who can't justify buying the movi 5 or 10 what would be the next best options ? In a kind of one man show configuration...
It's not the same but what about a Glidecam 4000?

Thanks


________________________________________________________________
Vincent Thomas
Creative Art Director & VFX supervisor / Senior Lighter & DigiMatte Painter / Concept Designer
http://fr.linkedin.com/in/vincentthomas
http://www.stranger-than-paradise.book.fr/
 
I cancelled my order for a Mōvi M5 and, instead, ordered the Helix from LetusDirect.

http://letushelix.com/

There are a few reasons I did this, aside from the fact that it is less expensive than the Mōvi (Letus < $4K). The main reason we want to work with the Helix is that I have read and heard various horror stories about setting up the Mōvi and adjusting it. Adjusting any one axis seems to send the user into a fit of readjusting the whole rig, and the process apparently (I have not tried it) can take a long time when you are on a shoot where time is precious.

The Helix is optically centered and balanced, sets up in minutes, and replacement of lenses can take only seconds. In addition, while the Mōvi cannot be set down except on a special stand you carry around with you (I don't have an extra person to do this), the Helix is designed to sit on the ground when not in use.

The Helix is not designed down from a helicopter system, but designed up from a tripod/ground approach. If you have not seen how the Helix works, you will be interested to see how easy it sets up and balances – very well done. For our work, being able to balance quickly is very important. My plans for the Mōvi included buying into a huge Pelican-like case to carry it around already assembled, and thus avoid the tedious process of all that balancing. The case is 20-inches x 30-inches x 15-inches, which takes up a lot of room in any vehicle. The Helix can be assembled from a flat form in minutes and be up and running.

There are many 3-axis gimbal systems out now, but most of them IMO are not viable, just thrown together. Letus has been around for years, and if you study their form and function, you will see what a brilliant approach they have taken to balancing the system.

I do not work for Letus. I need an easy-to-use 3-axis system for documentary work, where we have to be up and going quickly. Check it out. It may not be your cup of tea, but you will see how it is unique, just as the Mōvi is.
 
+1 on the Letus. I have ordered one. I tried all the Gimbals at NAB. The two that stood out where the Letus and the Ronin.
 
Most of the gimbals can be set up and balanced where the lens is sitting in the center of the vertical and roll axis pivot points by using a little extra weight in the right places or by moving equipment around. When balanced this way, if near perfection, you will only have to slide the camera forwards or backwards to rebalance the tilt axis after a lens swap. Apart from the Movi and the DJI Ronin, which has not been thoroughly tested, all of the other gimbals are using AlexMos control boards or some variant of that board. Learning to tune these boards can be a nightmare for a lot of people. Changing lenses often requires some retuning a takes a little time unless you have already used that lens and have the numbers written down to speed up the process. I custom build my own gimbals and I use AlexMos 32bit control boards with great results, but I have ton of experience with gimbals in general.

I hope this helps.


Wayne Mann
www.HeliCamHDmedia.com
 
Which rig in your opinion would be the most friendly for person would are mostly interested in working with ideas, actors and cinematography than pure technical camera tuning?

thanks

WayneMann said:
Most of the gimbals can be set up and balanced where the lens is sitting in the center of the vertical and roll axis pivot points by using a little extra weight in the right places or by moving equipment around. When balanced this way, if near perfection, you will only have to slide the camera forwards or backwards to rebalance the tilt axis after a lens swap. Apart from the Movi and the DJI Ronin, which has not been thoroughly tested, all of the other gimbals are using AlexMos control boards or some variant of that board. Learning to tune these boards can be a nightmare for a lot of people. Changing lenses often requires some retuning a takes a little time unless you have already used that lens and have the numbers written down to speed up the process. I custom build my own gimbals and I use AlexMos 32bit control boards with great results, but I have ton of experience with gimbals in general.

I hope this helps.


Wayne Mann
www.HeliCamHDmedia.com
Click to expand...
 
Hi Vincent,

It depends on what cameras you want to use. If you are talking Epics then there are only two choices; the Movi M10 and DJIs Ronin. I am not a fan of carbon tubes or aluminum tubes for gimbal frame structures. They require pinch collars to keep things from slipping and the mere act of tightening the clamps will cause movement. My self made large gimbal is built this way and I will never design a gimbal that way again. I was at NAB this year and I was really impressed with the DJI Ronin from a design standpoint. DJI gimbals stabilize very well, but often have horizon issues just like Movis do and Alexmos based gimbals do. DJI gimbals are also notorious for having a lot of QC issues. However I will be renting one as soon as they are available to rent and depending on how that goes along with how reliable they prove to be over the first couple months, I will own one.

Like I said earlier, Alexmos gimbals are or can be extremely difficult to tune, especially for the inexperienced.


Wayne Mann
www.HeliCamHDmedia.com
 
WayneMann said:
Hi Vincent,

It depends on what cameras you want to use. If you are talking Epics then there are only two choices; the Movi M10 and DJIs Ronin. I am not a fan of carbon tubes or aluminum tubes for gimbal frame structures. They require pinch collars to keep things from slipping and the mere act of tightening the clamps will cause movement. My self made large gimbal is built this way and I will never design a gimbal that way again. I was at NAB this year and I was really impressed with the DJI Ronin from a design standpoint. DJI gimbals stabilize very well, but often have horizon issues just like Movis do and Alexmos based gimbals do. DJI gimbals are also notorious for having a lot of QC issues. However I will be renting one as soon as they are available to rent and depending on how that goes along with how reliable they prove to be over the first couple months, I will own one.

Like I said earlier, Alexmos gimbals are or can be extremely difficult to tune, especially for the inexperienced.


Wayne Mann
www.HeliCamHDmedia.com
Click to expand...
What do you think about Allsready 7 from TurboAce? They claim the most robust structure/frame of all devices like this including problems you mentioned above. What's interesting I've heard some criticism from TurboAce regarding Ronin. Not sure what they meant though.
 
It has carbon tubes for the two most critical support beams with pinch clamps so it is not an option for me. They have and claim a ton of marketing BS in their description of the gimbal. NOBODY that I have seen so far has anywhere near the structural rigidity that the Ronin has. It is a beautiful piece of engineerng. Nobody else has frame structures like that because they are very expensive to manufacture. And please don't think for one second that I am a DJI fanboy, because I am far from it. I use one of their Wookong flight controllers to fly one of my Octocopters, but that is the only piece of DJI equipment that I own. I do not know who TurboAce is, but like I said, DJI has had a ton of QC issues over the past few years with their gimbals and flight controllers. I have not seen any new info on the Ronin. Please send a link if you have one.


Wayne Mann
www.HeliCamHDmedia.com
 
WayneMann said:
It has carbon tubes for the two most critical support beams with pinch clamps so it is not an option for me. They have and claim a ton of marketing BS in their description of the gimbal. NOBODY that I have seen so far has anywhere near the structural rigidity that the Ronin has. It is a beautiful piece of engineerng. Nobody else has frame structures like that because they are very expensive to manufacture. And please don't think for one second that I am a DJI fanboy, because I am far from it. I use one of their Wookong flight controllers to fly one of my Octocopters, but that is the only piece of DJI equipment that I own. I do not know who TurboAce is, but like I said, DJI has had a ton of QC issues over the past few years with their gimbals and flight controllers. I have not seen any new info on the Ronin. Please send a link if you have one.


Wayne Mann
www.HeliCamHDmedia.com
Click to expand...
TuroboAce is the company behind Allsteady 7
https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1686295822/allsteady-7-dslr-and-red-epic-3-axis-stabilizer-gi
I will try to find a link where these guys talk about DJI.
 
From AllSteady Kickstarter see update #23
https://www.kickstarter.com/project...nd-red-epic-3-axis-stabilizer-gi/posts?page=2
"Just got back from NAB after dinner. Lots of new products were introduced at the show and we tried to visit each competitor and evaluated their gimbals. Basically there were no surprises, most we already know before the show and our design has already been improved upon to make it better. The only surprise was DJI. We had a chance to test their gimbal at the show and I have pointed out their current issues. Not saying they won't be able to fix it because they will eventually."

It sounds like according to Allsteady guys there are some issues with DJI gimbal.
 
Hi Silyn,

I have mentioned my views on DJIs quality control issues. So, you have one manufacture making negative comments about another manufactures products, that is a freaking surprise. Everybody is copying everybody. It is a dog eat dog world in any business and you have to look at the marketing material for a given product and evaluate whether they are giving you the basic facts about their product or are they using every marketing buzz word and phrase to try and sell you something.

If you see and hold one of the Ronin gimbals you will see what I am talking about. If the Ronin turns out to NOT be reliable I will investigate the possibility of using one of my Alexmos controllers with that gimbal.


Wayne Mann
www.HeliCamHDmedia.com
 
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