AG-DVX200 4K Large-Sensor Handheld Camcorder

[Barry_Green]

I've come to realise looking at the V-LOG images in post that the DVX200 really struggles sometimes with highlights - and compresses them in between 220 and 230-ish on the WFM especially the sky shots.

This doesn't make sense to me. The waveform doesn't show anything related to 220-230, it only indicates the IRE, and the IRE will never exceed 80 when using VLOG-L.

Or are you referring to those levels after a LUT has been applied?

It's very easy to clip highs on the DVx200 in V-Log. They just seem like they fall off a cliff in the waveform...

If you overexpose beyond the sensor's ability, then yes, that's exactly what will happen. If you're monitoring the waveform while shooting, white should be hitting at no more than 61 IRE. Superwhites have a range up to 79 IRE. You have to monitor exposure to not exceed those levels.

I have a lot to learn more on how to get awesome images out of the cam, but so far the 2 days I spent - I am quote fond of what I got from my footage.

Glad you're liking what you're getting! Hopefully some of these ideas about how to use VLOG-L will help you get footage you're even happier with.

 

[Barry_Green]

Thanks for your reports. How would the camera look if you did not use V-Log? Any better with highlights? Does this camera have the DRS feature?

Yes it has DRS.

 

[k0bayashi]

This doesn't make sense to me. The waveform doesn't show anything related to 220-230, it only indicates the IRE, and the IRE will never exceed 80 when using VLOG-L.

I am refering to the waveform in Premiere, not in the camera. As in luminance values in 8bit colour space 16-235 legal range - at least that's how the highlights looked on in my NLE;s waveform in the grade. There was a really harsh thick line between 220ish and 232-3ish.

In reference to your previous post about KNEE - are you able to use this in V-Log or just the Scene files? I have to admit, I didn't read the manual before using the camera, and went jsut for V-Log as that;s what I wanted to test. But in upcoming tests, I'd like to look into Cine Like D, V and the Scene files. Thanks for your always valuable feedback, Barry.

 

[k0bayashi]

If you overexpose beyond the sensor's ability, then yes, that's exactly what will happen. If you're monitoring the waveform while shooting, white should be hitting at no more than 61 IRE. Superwhites have a range up to 79 IRE. You have to monitor exposure to not exceed those levels.

yes, that was what I was trying to achieve - keep the whites below the clipping point, the WFM was helpful. Speaking of exposure - is there an exposure meter (as a scale) in the LCD monitor? I swear I didn't see one, neither in the menus nor in the LCD. Maybe I am missing something? There surely should be one.

 

[k0bayashi]

Part II of the footage I posted the other day. All V-Log L 4096 x 2160 at 24p with some LUTs.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6G072kKISDU

 

[AlbertArt]

Looks great K0bayashi!

 

[Barry_Green]

I am refering to the waveform in Premiere, not in the camera. As in luminance values in 8bit colour space 16-235 legal range - at least that's how the highlights looked on in my NLE;s waveform in the grade. There was a really harsh thick line between 220ish and 232-3ish.

Without seeing what you're referencing, I'd have to guess, and I'd guess that that means you were overexposing and thus clipping the highlights perhaps?

In reference to your previous post about KNEE - are you able to use this in V-Log or just the Scene files?

Ah, no, the KNEE (and pretty much every other image control) is disabled when you use VLOG-L.

 

[Barry_Green]

Speaking of exposure - is there an exposure meter (as a scale) in the LCD monitor? I swear I didn't see one, neither in the menus nor in the LCD. Maybe I am missing something?

No, not missing anything, there is no +/- exposure meter. There's the histogram though, if that helps. But you have to remember that the histogram cuts off at 80% when using VLOG-L, so you can't just eyeball it and say that you're "exposing to the right". The best way to keep a handle on the highlights easily is to put your zebras at about 75-77, somewhere in that range, and try to keep the screen clear of zebras except for those things that you're okay having clip if necessary.

 

[k0bayashi]

....Ah, no, the KNEE (and pretty much every other image control) is disabled when you use VLOG-L.

ah, thought so. I do remember seeing a lot of options greyed out when I selected V-Log L. If they could add an -/+ exposure meter added to the LCD/VF with future firmware that would make a lot of people very happy. The histo, doesnt really do much for me other than general ball park to eyeball the spread of my mids, but for exposure, I'd love an exposure meter + zebra combo.

 

[greytail]

I wish you guys would get back to the scene files. There are a lot of us that need a reasonable and acceptable "baked in look". We can't just hand a customer a V Logged file and say, go to it. A lot of my work involves handing it to the customer on the spot...just the card and goodbye. I tried to use Scene file 1, twice, with disastrous results. The customer was not happy-- yellowish tinge on the images and or a magenta cast. This shouldn't be so difficult. Yes, I did read the manual and was one of the first to post about there being no exposure meter or instructions for saving and loading scene files from a card. Yes, I will be using scene file 6 from now on and yes I should have tested more thoroughly before dropping my AF101A for an interview and using the DVX200.

 

[k0bayashi]

I wish you guys would get back to the scene files. There are a lot of us that need a reasonable and acceptable "baked in look". We can't just hand a customer a V Logged file and say, go to it. A lot of my work involves handing it to the customer on the spot...just the card and goodbye. I tried to use Scene file 1, twice, with disastrous results. The customer was not happy-- yellowish tinge on the images and or a magenta cast. This shouldn't be so difficult. Yes, I did read the manual and was one of the first to post about there being no exposure meter. Yes, I will be using scene file 6 from now on and yes I should have tested more thoroughly before dropping by AF100 for an interview and using the DX200.

Scene 6 plus fiddle with the matrix - until you get the look you want . I would dedicate a few days to get the look I'd want from the Scene files if I were you, and looks like you're doing that. I think the Scene files offer flexibility, which I havent explored yet for reasons stated above, not enough time with the camera and that wasnt my goal with my tests - I purely wanted to test V-Log.

In my next outing with the DVX200 I am testing Scene files, but as it seems you already have the camera - I can only suggest - just trying out all the scene files and sub settings until you get to a look(s) that suits your work. Hope this helps,

 

[saltflyer]

Hello. Just received my DVX200 and have a few technical questions. Thanks in advance..

How do i choose which SD card i record to? on my HPX 250's there was a small button next to each card slot to select which card to record to.

Can i assign V-log to a user button so i wont have to menu dive each time?

can i assign UHD 50fr to a user button (roughly same question i know

Can i change "Gain" to "ISO" (easier to match with GH4)

It would be great to have a dedicated thread under Panasonic cameras to DVX200, or is it still early days?

 

[greytail]

Hello. Just received my DVX200 and have a few technical questions. Thanks in advance..

How do i choose which SD card i record to? on my HPX 250's there was a small button next to each card slot to select which card to record to.

Go Menu, Record Setup . You can choose which card. There is no slot select button on the camera

Can i assign V-log to a user button so i wont have to menu dive each time?
No, you can't, but you can assign VLog to a particular Scene file. When you do so, it more or less disables any of the other camera functions in that scene file.

can i assign UHD 50fr to a user button (roughly same question i know

No you can't

Can i change "Gain" to "ISO" (easier to match with GH4)
Go Menu, then display setup. Its in there

It would be great to have a dedicated thread under Panasonic cameras to DVX200, or is it still early days?

Agreed! It would also be nice if the site was converted to a responsive website so you can view it on an iPhone!

I found it helpful to transfer the full manual (part 2) to my hard drive, open as a pdf, then have it open and go Edit, Search. You can then search for any particular function that puzzles you. It would have quickly answered your gain question, for example.

Good luck, it is a lot more complicated than a GH4. I am still learning mine after three weeks!

 

[Vaughan Wood]

I've got 4 files here which may convince some that the colour science of this camera is not what it should be at release.

Still1 & 2 AG- AC160 Close up camera. The two girls with pink Tee shirts are always pink, regardless of whether the spotlight hits them or not.

Still 3 DVX 200 The two girls marked have what appear to be orange tee shirts on.

Still 4 DVX200 The one on the right gets hit by the spotlight. Instantly her Tee changes to pink, it's proper colour.

This is impossible to fix in post. It was scene file 1, basically straight out of the box.

interested to hear a response.

Cheers,

Vaughan

 

[greytail]

I agree, there definitely something wrong with scene file 1 and perhaps some of the others too. I pointed this out to a level two support technician at Panasonic but my complaint was dismissed as user error. It is too late now, but have you tried other scene files, particularly scene 6?

 

[saltflyer]

I found it helpful to transfer the full manual (part 2) to my hard drive, open as a pdf, then have it open and go Edit, Search. You can then search for any particular function that puzzles you. It would have quickly answered your gain question, for example.

Good luck, it is a lot more complicated than a GH4. I am still learning mine after three weeks!

Its really a shame that it's not possible to assign V-log or UHD 50fr to user buttons. Part of being a "run'n gun" style camera is to change modes in a split second, but i suppose there is some sort of reason behind it. It just works so great on the GH4 with the top dial, so was hoping the DVX200 was something you could operate quickly as well.
Apart from that i must say i'm highly impressed so far...
Thanks

 

[Bassman2003]

Vaughan, that is some serious color mess! Have you tried to go to town on the color matrix and color correction settings to match the DVX200 to the 160? Lock yourself in a room with tungsten lighting, a good broadcast monitor, a color chart, a bunch of difficult colors like true purple and the two cameras. Run the settings up and down and see what the camera can give you before writing it off.

 

[Barry_Green]

Been experimenting with some settings on Scene File 1. Here's a stock Scene File 1 picture, and the adjusted one (in no particular order):



Do you prefer one over the other?

 

[Greg Smith]

Totally subjective opinion -- I didn't put this up on any scopes or a professionally calibrated monitor.

The second image looks much better to me. All the skin tones are improved, most especially in the face on the left. Also, the orange in the beach ball and in the flowered top of the second girl is richer. Big improvement overall, and I think you could even go a little further with the correction on the leftmost model.

- Greg

 

[harddrive]

Been experimenting with some settings on Scene File 1. Here's a stock Scene File 1 picture, and the adjusted one (in no particular order):

View attachment 106980View attachment 106981

Do you prefer one over the other?

Unfortunately, I prefer the skin tones of different models in different images! Starting from the girl on the left, I find the lower image more pleasing - the upper one seems on the cold side - possibly a bit magenta. Blonde girl second left the other way round - I find top image more pleasing, she looks somewhat jaundiced in the lower image. Two girls on the right I find difficult to say. Top image makes their skin tones look a little cold, bottom image makes them (slightly) jaundiced. I also find both images a bit washed out and lacking in contrast and (possibly) saturation.

What seems odd is that although the skin tones aren't vastly different between the two images, the stripe on the beach ball changes totally - slightly washed out red on the top image, but orange on the lower. Which may be showing up some of the problem Vaughan Wood is having with the images he has posted?

If I had to choose one image or the other I'd probably go for the lower one in terms of flesh tones overall - but I'd like to compare with the original chart, especially the beach ball..... Is it pink or orange in the original?

This is also an off the cuff opinion - haven't looked at it on a vectorscope etc.