A1 and Audio Frame Rate Question

S

SamKam

Well-known member
Am shooting tomorrow with the A1 with separate audio (Sound Devices 702T) for the first time and need to verify something-
the frame rate on the A1 is a true 23.97, right? So, I should have the audio recorder set the same frame rate, right?
Much appreciated if anyone can verify or tell me what is the right way to go .
 
PaPa said:
i dont think its true 24, i think it fits in a 29.9blahblah timeline.
Click to expand...

Really? I looked at some footage I digitized in FCP and the frame rate says "23.98".
 
hmm, im not sure then

the only reason i say this is because when i import my A1 footage into adobe premier pro 2. i know my camera shoots at HDV 1080i, this option has a preset of 29.9blahblah frames per second, the only 23.87blah blah thats available is if its 1080P, which the footage is not.

i believe it does the same 24p conversion as the dvx100b, but i know in SD mode on that A1 you have the choice of two modes of 24F. one of tehse should be 23.87blahblah fps.
 
the who

im pretty sure, the 24f in HD mode is similar to DVX's 24p, not 24pA which is worked in a 24p project file

just like 24P mode on the dvx, you edit on a 30p timeline. something about the pulldown yadda yadda./
 
PaPa said:
the who

im pretty sure, the 24f in HD mode is similar to DVX's 24p, not 24pA which is worked in a 24p project file

just like 24P mode on the dvx, you edit on a 30p timeline. something about the pulldown yadda yadda./
Click to expand...


The canon preset for premiere pro is on a 23.967 timeline and it works great, no pulldown needed. This camera is differnt from both "24P" and "24PA" there is no needed pulldown, just pure progressive frames.
 
this raises the question then, of why is it when i start a new project in pp2. i open a 1080i timeiline, the preset is 29.blahblah fps, i import the footage, and it plays properly?

i just checked again

this cannot be true, there is no 1080i settings im pp2 that allows for 23.8687 fps

now that i see the footage, it says its 23.978 fps, but the project is not that. i cant make a 23.798 project for HDV 1080i
 
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1080f24f is 23.976 fps and progressive.

Don't pay attention to the preset settings in your NLE. Just customize the settings yourself.
 
PaPa said:
i cant

if i chose 1080i, there is either 25fps of 29
Click to expand...

papa, do you have the canon preset updates that adobe released? (this was not included in pp2) its something you have to download seprately...
 
k so i found on the adobe site, a preset for the H1, which will allow pp2 to edit 24f 30 and 60i.

however, i've followed the instructions as to where to export the files, i reopened pp2, and i still cant find those canon presets that iJUST added? help plz.
 
ahh, nm, just figured out the problem


*edit*
k now things just got worse.

now when i open a 24F project, the program says something serious has occured and must close.

it reopened a new one, it said the same thing, oipened it again in the same project and it said it could not load hte preset therefor it will load it in desktop mode.

help!
 
why does this keep crashing on me!

"The editing mode used by the project could not be loaded. The project will be opened in desktop mode."

why!!
 
Sorry, wish I could help you PaPa but I am FCP based and don't have any PPro experience with 24F editing.

SamKam--the frame rate for NTSC 60hz models in 24F mode is actually 23.976 fps. If you record your audio with this frame rate it should sync with your video.
 
SamKam--the frame rate for NTSC 60hz models in 24F mode is actually 23.976 fps. If you record your audio with this frame rate it should sync with your video.[/QUOTE]


Elton-
Thank you. Unfortuntaley my audio person, who is not very experienced, checked with a presumably more experienced person who told her to use a 29.97 frame rate on the audio recorder. Any idea what we're gonna have to do to get the audio to sych to the video?
 
I think the experienced audio person is assuming the camera will do a pullup to 29.97 fps for NTSC standards compatibility. If you capture 24F HDV in a NLE that properly supports it, you will have a 23.976 fps acquisition. Ideally, you would also edit at this timebase. Your audio shouldn't be any different.

I can understand using a better separate audio recorder (presumably with better pre-amps, etc.) but unless you are editing in an intermediate codec with uncompressed audio, your audio tracks will have to be compressed to HDV anyway.

Have you considered running a second feed to the camera's XLR just for backup?
 
For this gig we have to do separate audio recorder. Got 4 guys on wireless lavs and a stereo mic in a rehearsal room (shooting a band) feeding into a six-channel mixer which, in turn, is feeding into the recorder. Often, when doing more run-n-gun type work, I do get a temp mix feed via wireless receiver that I plug into one of the xlr inputs on the camera. Didn't have enough wireless mics this time so had to do without.
 
Audio doesn't have a "frame rate". Your audio will sync. Just not with the same timecode. If you used a clapper you should be able to sync it up perfectly just like old-school film.

The point is -- the audio will be in sync with the video, they won't drift, you're not hosed. You just have to sync 'em up without the benefit of using the same timecode.
 
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