7D or Mysterium X
- Thread starter Perry Wilson
- Start date
William_Robinette
Shallow Member
Of course your 7D could shoot all those shots, but RED will look better on every single one.
Really you guys need to get your hands on some raw R3D clips and play with them. You will discover how much it kills a DSLR very quickly.
(not an argument for or against)
At the moment I'm going through RED-material that was shot of an event that played with lights. It was very badly underexposed and raw doesn't really help there.
I could've done a better job with my 7d and it's hörrible h264 encoding.
Is the mysterium-X the sensor for both the epic and scarlet? Lookind pretty good. I would've wanted to see a couple of really hard shots (handheld action) to see if the skew is any better.
Perry Wilson
Well-known member
The 7D can def. shoot above 800iso and be usable look at the post about the 7D at 6400 ISO using neat video 3200 is usable. The only downside I have to say about the 7D is the absence of RAW codec (but maybe that will be addressed ; ) ...
ethan cooper
Well-known member
Ok, I've had enough of this 7D vs Scarlet talk. Stop it, just stop, the two aren't in competition with one another, they're targeted at two totally different segments and have vastly different feature sets and price points.
It's been said 1000 times already but I'll rehash the differences one more time:
Scarlet - Expensive (realistically it'll easily cost 3x as much as a 7D, but for good reason)
- REDCODE (far superior in post to h.264)
- Targeted for true 2k delivery/resolution
- A 'proper' video camera with the option of XLR's and SDI and just about anything
else you would see on a traditional video/cinema camera
- Less skew than a 7D
- Bigger, heavier, requiring more expensive tripods/stedicams than the 7D
- Multiple lens mounts available
- Less capable as a stills camera
- Options, options, options... for a price
- Designed from the ground up as a video camera that also does stills
7D/5D - Cheaper, more accessible for indies/hobbyists/students/cheapskates like me
- Far superior stills camera
- 5D should be better in low light than Scarlet, but that's a guess
- Allows for more guerrilla style shoots, will draw far less attention if used in public
- Limited to 12mins continuous recording
- Designed from the ground up as a still camera that can shoot video
It's been said 1000 times already but I'll rehash the differences one more time:
Scarlet - Expensive (realistically it'll easily cost 3x as much as a 7D, but for good reason)
- REDCODE (far superior in post to h.264)
- Targeted for true 2k delivery/resolution
- A 'proper' video camera with the option of XLR's and SDI and just about anything
else you would see on a traditional video/cinema camera
- Less skew than a 7D
- Bigger, heavier, requiring more expensive tripods/stedicams than the 7D
- Multiple lens mounts available
- Less capable as a stills camera
- Options, options, options... for a price
- Designed from the ground up as a video camera that also does stills
7D/5D - Cheaper, more accessible for indies/hobbyists/students/cheapskates like me
- Far superior stills camera
- 5D should be better in low light than Scarlet, but that's a guess
- Allows for more guerrilla style shoots, will draw far less attention if used in public
- Limited to 12mins continuous recording
- Designed from the ground up as a still camera that can shoot video
Michael Olsen
Veteran
Technically speaking, it is. The M-X sensors should now have an electronic shutter pass time of 5ms. Film has 4ms. Getting pretty close.
I think it will be interesting to see how many people consider the 2/3" option undesirable now that they've used larger sensors on DSLRs. And how many people consider S35 a "stepping stone" to FF35.
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ethan cooper
Well-known member
I do a lot of event work and 2/3" will be much easier to deal with than s35 or FF35 in those types of environments while giving decently shallow DOF when compared to the 1/4" and 1/3" cameras I'm currently using. I know super crazy shallow DOF looks pretty but it's no fun at all to be pulling focus on the fly when you've only got an inch or two of wiggle room.
For me, I'll probably buy (budget willing) the interchangeable 2/3" and whatever modules I need, and just rent a s35 or FF brain for commercial shoots where I have more control over the situation.
It seems to me that most people who are talking about 2/3" not being shallow enough have never shot with a 2/3" camera. Varicams and f900's were capable of producing very nice images with shallow DOF if you used them properly. Also, for perspective, those cameras with lens, mic and batteries would have cost you $60,000 5-8 years back.
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Michael Olsen
Veteran
Hi ethan,
I quite agree with you...the current standard of actually cinematic DOF (as in, actually seen in cinema) is definitely obtainable on a 2/3" camera.
Ultimately, I'd like to own all three. And that's where the RED concept really gets to me...if I want to buy an S35 camera once I already own the 2/3" kit, it doesn't cost me $20,000 all over again, it costs me $7000. Hoorah.
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speedjunkie
Well-known member
I have to say the 7d is Awsome in the right application. I love the darn thing, But I want the RED too just for the the ability to do an about face quickly while following a subject and not distorting the verticals in an action sequence, if you try that with the 7D the Jello Factors is ridiculous. IS lenses help slightly with this and filters and Focus but not on the FLY, plus PL scarlet has PL without Hacking , I have not seen this Mentioned in the thread
RieniO
Well-known member
Amen. If I could afford buying a Scarlet I would shut up and just buy one. If I couldn't afford buying a Scarlet I would shut up and continue shooting with my 7D or GH1.
I drive a Chrysler Voyager because I can't afford buying a Lincoln Navigator.
Jester2138
Well-known member
The fact that you guys are even considering comparing a camera that costs tens of thousands of dollars to my two thousand dollar camera makes me feel reeeel good about my two thousand dollar camera.
You can compare a Honda Civic to a Lamborghini... because they both move you from point A to B...
You can also compare a set of headphones to a G.I. Joe figure.
In this thread, both versions of comparison are applicable, as neither make any sense.
The Scarlet s35 looks interesting, the 2/3 is too small a sensor for me now I've been spoiled w/the 5d, but the s35 is 7d size so should be good.
Quality wise I feel it looks good, better than the 7d/5d, though we're not talking a massive leap, more a steady improvement.
Is it worth a $10k+ investment? Will wait to see how well it preserves the detail first, if it hits a filmic dynamic range than it's worth it imo.
Red footage always looks pretty to me eyes (if shot well), same with good 5d/7d footage, certainly more than most digital cinema cameras (genesis etc).
In fact I'm pretty certain my favourite detective show of the last few years, Wallander, was shot on a red, that show was the bomb yo'.
Quality wise I feel it looks good, better than the 7d/5d, though we're not talking a massive leap, more a steady improvement.
Is it worth a $10k+ investment? Will wait to see how well it preserves the detail first, if it hits a filmic dynamic range than it's worth it imo.
Red footage always looks pretty to me eyes (if shot well), same with good 5d/7d footage, certainly more than most digital cinema cameras (genesis etc).
In fact I'm pretty certain my favourite detective show of the last few years, Wallander, was shot on a red, that show was the bomb yo'.
Rakesh Jacob
Veteran
LMFAO
Dude you need to warn me before you say s**t like that! I almost spit out my water. But you are absolutely right, 2 very different animals.
RieniO
Well-known member
If it was possible to buy one today, I would buy one today, assuming it will be around $10,000
Ian-T
Veteran
Ha ha…I have not read past your comment as yet but I found this to be funny. I’ve seen the aliasing in more than just that scene (the guy’s t-shirt in some instances etc.). Then I thought to myself…where the heck am I viewing most of this stuff…”on the computer.” What does it matter how expensive or how cheap these cameras are if…in a lot of cases…while viewing on the PC…you can’t tell what it was shot on. It’s not like 95% of us are going to get past the PC and into the theaters. Throw some “neat Video” on that DSLR footage and most folks won’t be able to tell the difference (strictly talking untrained eyes here). And if the Scarlet IQ is going to be light years ahead of DSLR videos (as I expect)…then it will also be light years ahead of most cams $10,000 and under. I say that because…regardless of how many issues these cameras have…I like how they come together in many cases better than more expensive cameras (with smaller chips). But now we are heading for something better (best of all worlds) that has so much more potential. I’m down with that (just need to rob a bank 
).
).
RieniO
Well-known member
AFAIK the Scarlet will be around ten, not tens. Or am I missing something? Will the Scarlet with Mysterium X sensor cost tens?