23.976 or 23.98?? (from brochure)

[iFilm7]

*1: 24p=23.98p, 30p=29.97p, 60p=59.94p and 60i=59.94i

it says on Pg. 7 in the brochure of the HMC150
ftp://ftp.panasonic.com/pub/Panasonic/Drivers/PBTS/manuals/AG-HMC150_brochure.pdf

is it 23.98? or 23.976?! argh.... i hate these...

 

[Mike Harvey]

is it 23.98? or 23.976?!

The answer is "Yes".

All 23.98 is, is 23.976 rounded up... kinda like Pi. The clips I'm supposed to be editing as I write this are all saying 23.976.

Pi. Pie. Apple pie. Dang it, now I'm hungry...

 

[Cranky]

Pi. Pie. Apple pie. Dang it, now I'm hungry...

Actually, it is "pee".

 

[Barry_Green]

Correct, it's rounded.

The actual frame rates are 0.1% slower than the nominal frame rates. So:

24 fps - 0.1% = 24.000fps - .024 = 23.976 fps. If you've only got two decimal places to store that in, it becomes 23.98 fps.

30 fps - 0.1% = 30.000 fps -.030 = 29.970 fps.

60i = 60 fields per second = 60 - 0.1% = 60-.060 = 59.94 fields per second

60p = 60 frames per second = 60 - 0.1% = 60-.060 = 59.94 frames per second

 

[KenP]

Actually, it is "pee".

Not sure what that means as the correct spelling is Pi but maybe I missed the joke. :smile:

 

[Cranky]

Not sure what that means as the correct spelling is Pi but maybe I missed the joke. :smile:

English spelling is [pai], but the proper name of the Greek letter is [pi].

 

[iFilm7]

so 29.976 and 23.976 are the EXACT correct framerate?
thxx

 

[PDR]

so 29.976 and 23.976 are the EXACT correct framerate?
thxx

Nope. The decimal numbers are just approximations

The exact rates for "29.97" is 30000/1001 , and for "23.976" is 24000/1001

 

[iFilm7]

oh... well for the HMC150, 24p = 23.976
while in my sony HDR-SR10 the 60i = 29.97? or 29.976?

 

[PDR]

oh... well for the HMC150, 24p = 23.976
while in my sony HDR-SR10 the 60i = 29.97? or 29.976?

I think you're confused. There is no common frame rate 29.976, it's 29.970

The "60i" is 29.97 frames per second (really 30000/1001) or 59.94 fields per second (really 60000/1001)

 

[Barry_Green]

There is no such thing as 29.976.

 

[iFilm7]

oh okay, thanks for correcting me

 

[rich_r]

The exact rates for "29.97" is 30000/1001 , and for "23.976" is 24000/1001

I don't think this is correct. The frequency is reduced by 0.1% so:

30fps -> 30 - 30 * 0.1% -> 0.999 * 30 -> 29.97
24fps -> 24 - 24 * 0.1% -> 0.999 * 24 -> 23.976

 

[PDR]

I don't think this is correct. The frequency is reduced by 0.1% so:

30fps -> 30 - 30 * 0.1% -> 0.999 * 30 -> 29.97
24fps -> 24 - 24 * 0.1% -> 0.999 * 24 -> 23.976

Perhaps that is what the camera shoots, I'm not sure.

But the correct "exact" frame rate for NTSC video and film is 30000/1001 and 24000/1001 , respectively.

 

[Cranky]

I don't think this is correct. The frequency is reduced by 0.1% so:

30fps -> 30 - 30 * 0.1% -> 0.999 * 30 -> 29.97
24fps -> 24 - 24 * 0.1% -> 0.999 * 24 -> 23.976

It is the same thing, though the relation that PDR refers to is the canonical one.

30000/1001 = 30 (1001-1) /1001 = 30 - 30/1001 ~ 30 - 30*0.001

 

[rich_r]

Perhaps that is what the camera shoots, I'm not sure.

But the correct "exact" frame rate for NTSC video and film is 30000/1001 and 24000/1001 , respectively.

Yup, I stand corrected. The correct conversion is as you stated. :embarasse

 

[RaviSun3D]

Lucky me...:happy:

I am out of confusing territory, living in PAL system.
Only 25p and 50i here, nothing more or deep inside.

 

[iFilm7]

29.97
and
23.976
EXACT for my composition settings ya?

 

[Gauranga]

Avoiding simple confusion aside, is there any practical reason why this matters?

 

[Everts]

Dont know about other nle's but in premiere it can cause ugly frame blending .