151 or 171 - good enough for the bbc?

T

tanv28

Member
hi all!
newly registered but have been reading the forums for a while now!
main reason for reading the forums is that ive been pulling my hair out trying to read up as much as i can about these two cameras.

im relatively new to the more pro end of making videos / films but have been making mini music videos / editing for years. mainly for my own pleasure rather than anything else.

a friend of mine who has a band has asked me to make a music video for him which he hopes to send to broadcasters.

i signed up straight away! been doing my research but not really been able to come up with a definitive answer.

if i got the hmc 151, would shooting on that with a redrock be able to produce a music video that broadcasters could potentially accept for airing?

i know it uses avchd and the picture quality is good but is that enough?

say if i wanted to submit it to the likes of the bbc for example.

also if i wanted to make a feature film using a 151 and redrock, would that be acceptable standard to be played in a cinema?

i know i probably sound like a total noob wih utterly delusional ambitions, but would appreciate if someone could advise me on this whole standards issue which has been doing my head in for months now!
 
I'd like to know that myself.


We have a thread around here somewhere that list the most updated programming specs for the Discovery Channel. 2005! The 150/170 weren't even born back then.
http://dhd.discovery.com/guidelines/guidelines.html
I find that trying to find this information is harder than it needs to be.


Also I think that the 150/170 could be good enough for broadcast “Silver” but because they are "new" and AVCHD in the high AVCCAM is still viewed as a wild-card until other Pro class cameras use that codec, I'm not sure if/when it will break the broadcast "Old Boys Club".

My 2 cents.
 
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I've shot music video with HVX200 which was shown on dish network and various TV stations in India, and UK.. so image quality of these cams are fine.. codec should be fine as well from what I know the HMC's PH mode. Granted we delivered in SD, not HD, so I'm clueless as to what HD codec these broadcast stations accept.
 
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seems like people dont have much to say on this front.

maybe the 151 is just a camera for wedding videos rather than broadcast / cinema
 
I don't remember where I read this, but I think Discover channel is using the HPX300's for one of their shows, with a set of 170's as their 'run and go' cameras. I think anything can go to broadcast as long as you keep on eye on your vector scope.

But I've never actually done this - solely my observations. Should wait until someone actually knows...
 
A music video shot on the HMC150 is fine for broadcast. The key is to figure out what format the station accepts the video in. In any case, you can always shoot your video and worry about the proper delivery format later on.. Do a google on production notes for shows like Surivivor Man, Man vs Wild.. they use HVX, Sony HDV, AVC, and even crappy youtube style cameras... The acceptable level of image quality for broadcast is totally dependent on the content of the video.. if it's footage of late breaking news, it could be shot on a cell phone, but a 2 hour long prime time movie shot on cell phone probably will not get a chance to be broadcasted..
 
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tanv28 said:
seems like people dont have much to say on this front.

maybe the 151 is just a camera for wedding videos rather than broadcast / cinema
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The hmc is really new, and most people probably are already set in their ways with their other cameras. Give it time. Have you seen the footage? It's definitely on par with at least television. And since I haven't seen the hmc on the big screen, I can't comment on that, but with 35mm adapters and being on my 42" lcd I'm still incredibly impressed with the images.
 
green thumb said:
The hmc is really new, and most people probably are already set in their ways with their other cameras. Give it time. Have you seen the footage? It's definitely on par with at least television. And since I haven't seen the hmc on the big screen, I can't comment on that, but with 35mm adapters and being on my 42" lcd I'm still incredibly impressed with the images.
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appreciate the input.

dont get me wrong ive seen the footage and it looks amazing.
guess my main worry is that i dont wanna invest in avchd 151 if its a dead end in terms of what broadcasters accept.

guess my dilemma is that ideally i want to go down the 151 route as the image quality seems great and its more financially viable for me.

but if i need to go down the 171 p2 dvcprohd route then i will have to do it. but it would stretch my wallet to say the least!!

any thoughts on this? does anyone know the answer?
 
booggerg2 said:
A music video shot on the HMC150 is fine for broadcast. The key is to figure out what format the station accepts the video in. In any case, you can always shoot your video and worry about the proper delivery format later on.. Do a google on production notes for shows like Surivivor Man, Man vs Wild.. they use HVX, Sony HDV, AVC, and even crappy youtube style cameras... The acceptable level of image quality for broadcast is totally dependent on the content of the video.. if it's footage of late breaking news, it could be shot on a cell phone, but a 2 hour long prime time movie shot on cell phone probably will not get a chance to be broadcasted..
Click to expand...


hey thats helpful. feel a bit more reassured by that.
from what i understand the image quality between 171 and 151 is identical. its just the codec and media. i really wanna avoid putting money in P2 when it could be spent in other areas.

i appreciate that the quality is probably better at dvcprohd and not gonna get into the avchd / dvcprohd or sd / p2 debate.
i really need to get the camera now and cant wait for avc intra to be affordable

if people are saying that the 151 is adequate and its just a matter of transcoding it to whatever format a tv station accepts then thats ideal!

could something shot on the 151 at 720p25 be high enough quality to be shown at the cinema?

im sorry if im starting to sound like a broken record!
 
In your case I would go with the 171, P2 (dvcpro hd) is a widely accepted format among broadcasters and I'm sure that you'll have far more chances to get your footage in the system. Other tha that, you can also shot with the hmc and convert it to dvcpro hd, you can even buy P2 card and use a pcmcia reader and put the converted hmc footage into that card.......lets see what people say..... that would be an interesting test.....

But that's just my opinion, and I have a HMC151 and I'm way more than happy with it.
 
The truth is that broadcasters will broadcast whatever they think will sell.

And of course they'd prefer if it was shot on a higher end camera/format, but if they think the product is going to engage their viewers, who cares?

Both DV cameras, and later low-end HDV model's like the Sony Z1 have been - and still are - used on thousands of TV productions the world over. If the HMC151 is as good or better it will be broadcast quality.

If you ask them beforehand, they may say they'd rather have DVCPROHD than AVCHD because it has more of a track record. But if you hand them a film that they like, which is well made and looks good on your TV at home, they're unlikely to worry about which camera it was shot on.

As far as mainstream TV goes, In the UK at least, it may be easier to get a low end production broadcast outside of peak viewing hours.

But good television is good TV, regardless of the camera/codec etc. And this camera is certainly up for the job. In the right hands at least.:thumbup:
 
this is all quite reassuring to hear.
think i will go down this route after all

im new here so i dont know who the bigwigs are in these forms but wld sure apprecite their opinions too.

thanks all.
 
I just recently shot a major commercial project with several 150s and over 400 spots were created for multiple markets across the US. All the spots were delivered on beta sp or digibeta.
 
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