F35: 12-bit Uncompressed is Possible!
- Thread starter Film Scientist
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SJX
Veteran
Don't know. Uncompressed sound good on paper but real life is other thing. Huuuge files, only image sequence, must convert for everything. How about slow motion? Gemini does 50p?
Used gemini is not so cheap and plus price of lut box and extra cumbersome set up and is not much cheaper than 7Q.
But lut box is more cables and more things to power and more things to hang on camera more things to fail and just extra part. For now I stay with hyperdeck but I think best option for F35 is still SR-R1. Slow motion, gives 3 options for recording and 880 is as good as uncompressed and doubt gemini look better even in hard grading. No need for extra box hanging on F35 too.
But good work film scientist.
Used gemini is not so cheap and plus price of lut box and extra cumbersome set up and is not much cheaper than 7Q.
But lut box is more cables and more things to power and more things to hang on camera more things to fail and just extra part. For now I stay with hyperdeck but I think best option for F35 is still SR-R1. Slow motion, gives 3 options for recording and 880 is as good as uncompressed and doubt gemini look better even in hard grading. No need for extra box hanging on F35 too.
But good work film scientist.
Film Scientist
Active member
Hi SJX,
I guess I just prefer capturing uncompressed as a means to secure an archival digital negative. We spend so many resources (money/time) on locations, lighting, and actors why not try to record it the best way possible, with the fewest compression limitations. An archival negative is what film allowed us before digital capture came along. Recently bagan to use Davinci as an online editor, it reads the DPX sequences perfectly no need to recompress or transcode if the hard drives are fast enough. I tend to do short form content, so I rarely exceed 4-6 hours of media. The Gemini can do 4:2:2 @ 50P no problem.
The Gemini is still pricy but very reliable, as a recorder, that quality means the most for peace of mind concerning clients. Most film cameras I am used to have quite a few accessories mounted to them. Digital follow focus, cinetape, wireless monitoring, etc... If I want less cumbersome I'll reach for a different camera like the Blackmagic. In terms of cost, the Gemini media is probably the only thing that is cheaper. As I get more comfortable shooting S-Log, I am starting to rely more on light meters and judging things by eye, so I have less need for the latest features the Odyssey provides.
I guess it's all a series of compromises, we all definitely pick the qualities are most important. For me it's about trying to retain the highest image quality throughout the process. I come from the film world where 1000 foot mags and 7 minute takes were our constant limitations. While we no longer have those limitations in digital, but I try to keep my teams disciplined so we aren't constantly roling and blowing through unnecessary footage for editors to needlessly review. In the entire production equation I am okay spending a little extra money on storage (my 'digital negative'), because if anything, it definitely gets much cheaper by the day, and you can't always go back to recapture in a 'higher' codec.
Thanks!
SJX,
Do you realize the Aja LUT box should also work with the 7Q? It should solve the 12 bit 444 recording issues. To me that is worth the added weight of the LUT box. I agree the Gemini is too exspensive for what it is, the 7Q offers the best of both worlds with Prores and uncompressed. They also have come down quite a bit in price.
Film Scientist,
What does your data flow look like for a project like this? Do you transfer all the files using a PC or a MAC? What about backup? Do you keep everything you shoot or just archive the final cuts?
Do you realize the Aja LUT box should also work with the 7Q? It should solve the 12 bit 444 recording issues. To me that is worth the added weight of the LUT box. I agree the Gemini is too exspensive for what it is, the 7Q offers the best of both worlds with Prores and uncompressed. They also have come down quite a bit in price.
Film Scientist,
What does your data flow look like for a project like this? Do you transfer all the files using a PC or a MAC? What about backup? Do you keep everything you shoot or just archive the final cuts?
SJX
Veteran
But I doubt any real difference from SR 880 2:1 compression. SR easier to edit and SR-R1 give other lighter codecs in same recorder if you need.
But advantage of film archival is not this. Is that film last 100 years. Is about storage.
Yes this is why I don't need 1 more piece.
This give you less size but less image. Not good trade. I think F35 with less part is better trade.
SJX
Veteran
Hi yachacha. Yes maybe work with 7Q too but nobody know. Yes gemini too expensive for what it is agree.
Film Scientist
Active member
Hi Yachacha,
The workflow is Mac Based (17" laptop) I basically copy the DPX files to a Samsung SSD using a seagate USB3 or Thunderbolt transfer shuttle (each 512 GB mag takes about a half hour).
I switched to Davinci to edit because it handles image sequences so well. Lately the media for each project I work with is typically contained within one 1TB SSD which I edit from.
In the past I worked from a 8TB Raid, for projects that exceeded 1 TB. I usually archive everything, original raw data, sequences, final outputs etc.
Data backup is done on cheap mobile drives if project is under 2TB. or 3.5" SATA drive if it's 4TB or greater. Projects rarely exceed 4TB overall, I tend to be pretty efficient with how I shoot.