Leave the World Behind

[ahalpert]

I don't believe I ever said that I was fundamentally different. I would say that I'm marginally more generous than some.

If I were a German citizen during the third Reich, would I personally have the courage and conviction to risk the lives of my family to harbor Jews in my home? I doubt it. That's my honest self-assessment. But I would do everything in my power that didn't imperil my family to halt the rise of Nazism.

Would a civilized, industrialized European society collectively turn on its minorities and methodically murder millions of them? Clearly the answer is yes. And many other genocides of various sizes and methods have happened in various places since then.

Would Americans allow 45k working age Americans to die every year for lack of health insurance? Clearly the answer is yes

 

[Doug Jensen]

I don't believe I ever said that I was fundamentally different. I would say that I'm marginally more generous than some.

But I don't even need people to be saintly. I just don't want them to be demons. People are sadistic. They like to blow people up, to torture them. They do it gratuitously and it brings them joy. People used to picnic at lynchings in America. At a bare minimum, we should not cause harm to innocent people nor take pleasure from it. And the fact that we cause so much harm and do it with so much glee and people who otherwise seem quite good and civil will lead that charge... it's depressing and frightening.

I've heard boomers explicitly say that they don't really care about climate change because they'll be dead before the worst effects are felt.

Wah-wah. Thanks, Debbie Downer.
I'm glad I have a much more optimistic view of my fellow humans. How do you get anything done with that attitude? I'll bet you could write the sequel to this film. It might be cathartic to get it all out.

well, at least 2 people on this thread liked the movie and you said it was a movie made for morons. am I missing something?.

Yes. Stop and think real hard about it and maybe the difference will come to you. If you want a hint, I already gave you the answer in previous posts.

 

[jmone]

I've never heard that term before. But I feel like your post here is pretty characteristic of the head-in-the-sand mentality that the film critiques.

But all the issues you listed are clear and present dangers that we're currently dealing with. To suggest otherwise is laughable

You have jumped to a conclusion on my view of these particular issues which I did not express.

Human and Human Civilization is amazing. Civilization is about 6,000 years old, so there have been around 240 generations in that time. Each generation has faced challenges and delt with them. The current situation is no different. These "clear and present dangers" they will either be overcome, will turn out not to be as dire, or we will adapt (or some combination of these). Just because we are alive in this specific slice of time does not make us, or this particular slice of time, "special". The world is not going to end on your watch. We will collectively solve the current issues and move onto the next. Civilization is an amazing problem solver.

 

[Doug Jensen]

You have jumped to a conclusion on my view of these particular issues which I did not express.

Human and Human Civilization is amazing. Civilization is about 6,000 years old, so there have been around 240 generations in that time. Each generation has faced challenges and delt with them. The current situation is no different. These "clear and present dangers" they will either be overcome, will turn out not to be as dire, or we will adapt (or some combination of these). Just because we are alive in this specific slice of time does not make us, or this particular slice of time, "special". The world is not going to end on your watch. We will collectively solve the current issues and move onto the next. Civilization is an amazing problem solver.

I agree 100%.

 

[alaskacameradude]

well, at least 2 people on this thread liked the movie and you said it was a movie made for morons. am I missing something?

Well he has been pretty clear about this from the start.....I think I have read at least 3 times that he clarified that he is
NOT saying you are a moron if you like the movie. I'm not sure if you missed those posts or not but you might go reread the
whole thread because he talks about the exceptions a fair bit.....as in 'Just because it was a movie made to appeal
to morons does not mean you are a moron if it appeals to you.' Huge hint, maybe look at one post where he mentions
a singer otherwise known as 'The Boss.' Hope that helps.

 

[alaskacameradude]

You have jumped to a conclusion on my view of these particular issues which I did not express.

Human and Human Civilization is amazing. Civilization is about 6,000 years old, so there have been around 240 generations in that time. Each generation has faced challenges and delt with them. The current situation is no different. These "clear and present dangers" they will either be overcome, will turn out not to be as dire, or we will adapt (or some combination of these). Just because we are alive in this specific slice of time does not make us, or this particular slice of time, "special". The world is not going to end on your watch. We will collectively solve the current issues and move onto the next. Civilization is an amazing problem solver.

Word. My dad told me how when he was a child in public school, he was told the Great Lakes would not be around
any longer by the time he was 30, because of some 'emergency' or another of the day.
He is 70 now and guess what? Yup, I went swimming in these non existent lakes last summer.....and the
pilings that he used to see poking above the water, are so far below the surface now that you must dive
down about 20 feet to even see them....

 

[ahalpert]

Wah-wah. Thanks, Debbie Downer.
I'm glad I have a much more optimistic view of my fellow humans. How do you get anything done with that attitude? I'll bet you could write the sequel to this film. It might be cathartic to get it all out.

Debbie Downer? I'm a realist. Read some history. Read a newspaper.

I don't thank humanity is on the brink of extinction or civilizational collapse. But we are facing a massive environmental shock; each half of the country thinks the other half is trying to end democracy as we know it; and human beings are capable of unspeakable evil when circumstances become dire. Saying that doesn't mean I'm not optimistic about the future or that I don't like to sing and dance with my kids and photograph nature.

In the past, there were other big problems that people fixated on. Communism and nuclear annihilation. Different era, different problems.

Yes. Stop and think real hard about it and maybe the difference will come to you. If you want a hint, I already gave you the answer in previous posts.

I saw your answer but I don't think it lessens the insult. It would be one thing if I agreed with you and said yes this is a stupid movie but I enjoyed it anyway for thoughtless reasons. But I didn't say that and your implication was that most people who like it will be morons. ("Some non-morons might enjoy it.") Not sure how you can claim that this comment isn't an insult.

Also, what do you have against Springsteen?

 

[Doug Jensen]

Also, what do you have against Springsteen?

It's what Seth Meyers would call a "side burn". Ya burnt!

 

[Doug Jensen]

In the past, there were other big problems that people fixated on. Communism and nuclear annihilation. Different era, different problems.

Hmm, I didn't realize the first two had been solved. Now I can rest easy. Thank you.
I'd say it is more like: Different era, different fixations. So, if you want to let yourself get all ginned up my a dumb movie made by a producer who admits he is just yanking the audience's chain, have at it. I'd rather spend my time watching something that actually respects the audience's intelligence.

 

[ahalpert]

Hmm, I didn't realize the first two had been solved. Now I can rest easy. Thank you.
I'd say it is more like: Different era, different fixations. So, if you want to let yourself get all ginned up my a dumb movie made by a producer who admits he is just yanking the audience's chain, have at it. I'd rather spend my time watching something that actually respects the audience's intelligence.

It's a surrealist movie. Maybe someday you'll appreciate high-brow art and not just popcorn films.

Surrealism aims to revolutionise human experience. It balances a rational vision of life with one that asserts the power of the unconscious and dreams. The movement's artists find magic and strange beauty in the unexpected and the uncanny, the disregarded and the unconventional.

https://www.tate.org.uk/art/art-ter... human,the disregarded and the unconventional.

People used to worry about the "domino effect" of communist spread. Not so now. USSR is dead. China is doing a weird capitalism.

Nuclear annihilation is definitely still a threat, but not novel. And somewhat subdued by the fall of the USSR.

Climate change wasn't happening before. And we didn't have concerns about the peaceful transfer of power following an election in the US. We hadn't banned any candidates from the ballot. Different era, different problems.

People keep acting like my connection to the movie is a consequence of my demographic. What does that mean? Liberal? Young? (Technically i think I'm middle-aged now depending on where you draw the line.)

Conservatives are just as worked up by modern problems. Here's a chart I've seen going around lately:



I still don’t get the Springsteen connection or what you have against him but I guess it will remain a mystery.

 

[Doug Jensen]

I still don’t get the Springsteen connection or what you have against him but I guess it will remain a mystery.

You'd think that someone who went to Brown would have better reading comprehension skills. I never said anything about Springsteen. For all I know he is the Jesus Christ of his generation. But his "music" is awful. Because you like this movie, I suspected you might like his moronic repetitious music too, so I thought I'd throw a line in the water and see if you bit. I'm trying to get a better feel for your tastes fo I can factor it into all your posts. What are your thoughts on "Dancing with the Stars" and "Naked and Afraid"?

 

[jmone]

Maybe someday you'll appreciate high-brow art and not just popcorn films.

It's not high-brow art. It's not Cinematic. I don't think it is going to sweep the Awards.

It's a mid budget TEOTWAWKI B-Grade flick that plays on current worries that clearly resonates deeply with some and not others. Nothing wrong with that. Nothing wrong with enjoying it, singling it's praises, or suggesting others should watch it. Likewise thinking it is vapid, moronic, or whatever is equally valid. The genre has been around forever. I'm sure more of these flicks will be made in the future with updated themes for their time.

Shall we start a list of what Awards it will win?

 

[Doug Jensen]

Shall we start a list of what Awards it will win?

In today's environment, I honestly believe it could be a strong contender for Best Picture at the Oscars. It would not surprise me at all.

 

[jmone]

That would be funny!

 

[Paul F]

Shall we start a list of what Awards it will win?

Perhaps so, but more importantly, we should bet as to whether or not Jimmy Kimmel will get assaulted at the Oscars.

 

[Doug Jensen]

Perhaps so, but more importantly, we should bet as to whether or not Jimmy Kimmel will get assaulted at the Oscars.

By Aaron Rodgers or a spansh-speaking woman banging on the window?

 

[Paul F]

By Aaron Rodgers or a spansh-speaking woman banging on the window?

Oh, they should invite Rogers to the Oscars just for the buzz. They need to boost ratings. Maybe Sofia Vergara will re-enact her slapping Jimmy Kimmel in the face on his show.

Whatever they do, they need to boost ratings big time.

I didn't get the woman banging on the window reference. Please enlighten an ignorant old man.

 

[Doug Jensen]

I didn't get the woman banging on the window reference. Please enlighten an ignorant old man.

Oh, I guess you haven't seen this great new flick called "Leave the World Behind". Ever heard of it? It's a big hit with an impressive 34% approval rating on RT and gets 1.9 stars out of 5. There's even few ardent supporters right here on DVX who absolutely loved it. So much so that one of the movie's biggest fans stared a whole new thread just to sing its praises. Some people are saying its as good as Dunkirk, so naturally there is Oscar talk.

If you have the right values, I highly recommend you watch it. Check it out and then the reference to a crazy spanish speaking woman will make total sense. Maybe Jimmy can look her right in the eye, get all weepy, and then walk away as an homage to the film. You remember how Billy Crystal used to do elaborate spoofs of the nominated films? Sort of like that but with a cool Technocrane upside-down twisting camera move that reveals airplane wreckage all over the stage that wasn't there 2 seconds before. And then Kevin Bacon can hand out bottles of water and handfuls of rice to everyone in the audience. I understand he has plenty to go around, plus some special medicine that cures radiation poisoning, tick bites, hearing loss, or whatever ails ya. Every nominee gets a bottle in their swag bag. It's gonna be great a telecast this year.

Better watch it soon though, it's on one of those streaming services that is probably going under soon due to green lighting too many art films like this, so better move fast.

 

[ahalpert]

You'd think that someone who went to Brown would have better reading comprehension skills. I never said anything about Springsteen. For all I know he is the Jesus Christ of his generation. But his "music" is awful. Because you like this movie, I suspected you might like his moronic repetitious music too, so I thought I'd throw a line in the water and see if you bit. I'm trying to get a better feel for your tastes fo I can factor it into all your posts. What are your thoughts on "Dancing with the Stars" and "Naked and Afraid"?

I meant what do you have against his music. And that's what I find so confusing. Both because I already said I'm not a fan and because I don't see any connection to this movie. I can only name 2 of his songs and only 1 of them do I ever listen to (Dancing in the Dark -- great song). I don't think his music is more repetitious than rock and roll generally, and I don't think anyone accused this movie of being repetitious. Quite the opposite- it was an unusual film.

I listen to everything but country (well, a little country such as greats like the Gambler or Country Roads). I currently listen to mostly swing at home (such as Peggy Lee, the Ink Spots, Louis Armstrong) and classical in the car. But I've been listening to I Wanna Get Next to You by Rose Royce a lot when I need to relax.

Classic rock is probably the genre I most closely identify with. But my favorite all-time albums are Paul Simon's Graceland, American Beauty by The Grateful Dead, and Rage Against the Machine's self-titled album.

I've never seen either of those shows. Earlier I listed all the movies I've seen in the last month. Lately I've been watching the West Wing, which is great for settling into bed. Great dialogue, great shooting. I disagree with its depiction of the president and his entourage as well-meaning public servants who strive for greatness and are only prevented from doing good by political obstacles. I think they're usually amoral and self-serving.

I like a lot of different movies for a lot of different reasons. Realism is not always that important to me. I'm looking for at least one aspect of value and for a strong emotional or intellectual reaction. I particularly value novelty and experimentation because I feel like I keep seeing the same movies over and over again, so boredom is my biggest enemy.

One movie i really enjoyed that sort of felt like this movie was Park Chan-wook's Stoker. I don't remember the story that well but I remember the dark, brooding vibes and the psychological mystery. I enjoyed that feeling and I enjoyed the scenework. Had some sensuous visuals and sound.

Two movies that for me are the opposite of this movie are Inception and Interstellar. I thought I would love them both but I didn't enjoy either. I didn't experience strong feelings from the scenes and I thought they were generally convoluted. I say they're the opposite because my understanding is that Nolan tried to plan them out precisely so that everything would add up and adhere to the rules of the story. I've seen the charts mapping out the action and timelines. That's all well and good but I didn't get invested enough in the stories to care about figuring things out.

 

[Tom Roper]

probably about 10-20% of people are actually concerned with behaving virtuously

Do you consider yourself to be a virtuous person?