HPX170 Lens Wobble Improved

Segarza's test is very simple and effective. I have tried it with a Sachtler Video 20II, pan and tilt locked down, zoomed in. The side to side image shift is very evident and difficult to not introduce, especially with a fast rack. This is much more fluid head than most use with this class camera. The shift looks nothing like camera shake from a long lens.

On a larger fluid head, which has a large mounting sled, you cannot get your hand under the lens for focusing, ditto if using rods. Focusing from the top is problematic due to the built-in mic. That leaves focusing from the side, which, before reading some posts, I thought was how manual focusing was normally accomplished.

Jus gently brushing against the lens hood at a long focal length causes the side to side shift. Focusing requires the hands of a surgeon to ensure no image shift.

Forget 35mm adapters, follow focus, this is just normal manual focus. Happily, you wouldn't
shoot hand held on a long focal length too often, but the shift is noticeable at most focal lengths, just magnified zoomed in.

The only way I can imagine operating this camera on a long lens is with a remote focus and zoom control.

Non-issue indeed.
 
so what should happen next? a lot of us discovering this have basically got a "used" camera on our hands at this point.

Should Panasonic issue a recall to those units that are greatly affected? an unconditional return ?

I would like to keep & use the camera, but I would also like it to work correctly or at least as my HVX200 does...
 
If it performs like the HVX200 does, it's a non-issue (whether you like that wording or not; I'm sure some people would object to your choice of "showstopper". I think 'showstopper' is a tad more hyperbolic than 'non-issue' anyway, don't you?)

On the HVX this is an absolute non-issue. I haven't seen a production HPX170 yet (I hope to in the next few days, mine is supposedly in transit right now). If the HPX170 performs worse than the HVX200, then maybe it's indeed an issue. We have reports of people saying there's a problem and others saying there's no problem.

For my part, the idea of improperly mounting a 35mm adapter was indeed a non-issue. However, if you're using just the stock camera and the shock mount makes telephoto rack focusing not possible, that moves into the "problem" category.

In any case, I've pointed this particular thread out to Jan and told her about the concerns with telephoto rack focusing. She is currently traveling but is aware of this and has said she will raise the issue with the factory in Osaka.

If the lens flex is more pronounced than on the HVX/DVX series, I have no doubt that they'll take whatever corrective action they need to. They don't "hide" as has been insinuated here. They fixed the battery tabs. They fixed the green 5600k preset on the HPX500. They fixed the beep. If there is a problem here they will fix it too.
 
Barry,
You said "if" the lens has more flex than the HVX/DVX series.
I am here to tell you it definitely has more on my HPX170 compared to my HVX200. There appears to be some differing levels of it throughout this thread. Mine is bad enough to be not usable for pro- level production with the stock camera (unless there are no telephoto shots).

As you say if the HPX preformed as the HVX does it would be a non-issue.

I have not hooked my adapter up as yet.
 
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Right. If. Some say it does. Others are saying it doesn't.

So the question is whether this is something that's different in all of them, or some of them? Are the flexier ones the exception or the rule? With only the very first batch of cameras out there, I don't know whether this question is even definitively answerable. But the folks in Osaka should certainly be able to tell whether what you guys are reporting is "within spec" or not.
 
Barry,

I look forward to you actually being able to comment when a production HPX170 is in your hands. No that I need anybody to tell me whether my camera is problematic in normal, everyday use. I don't, and it is.

I was under the impression that we would hear something from Osaka today. I don't care
about the HVX200 or DVX100, I care about this camera. This IS a showstopper.

I know you will help us all out if your findings are the same as many of us. I DO have faith
in Panasonic(I love my HDX900), and I know this will be made right.
 
I've held 10-15 170's in my hand, and none of them had the issue reported. I have yet to see one with the problem, so I'm inclined to say the issue is limited. I'm sure Pany will replace those of yours which are problematic. That's what a 5 year warranty is for.
 
Anyone know what the replacement process is like?

What if the replacement has the same issue?

If Brian202020 has seen 10-15 without shift I want one of those.
 
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I'm very anxious to here why some people are reporting that their HPX has no side to side movement, and others do... makes absolutely no sense to me. If everyone has the same movement, then I would have no problem with it. But now that more and more people are saying that the movement isn't there for them, it's making me incredibly nervous and very doubtful that this movement is supposed to be there...
 
DM_rider said:
I'm very anxious to here why some people are reporting that their HPX has no side to side movement, and others do... makes absolutely no sense to me. If everyone has the same movement, then I would have no problem with it. But now that more and more people are saying that the movement isn't there for them, it's making me incredibly nervous and very doubtful that this movement is supposed to be there...
Click to expand...

Again.... makes me wonder if there was a bad batch of cameras
 
I posted on my findings with manually racking focus at full zoom a couple pages back and there is definitely some image shifting even when gently handling the ring. I tried isolating the source of the shifting to other factors besides the lens, but it always contributed the most amount of shift for the least amount of effort. My experience was similar to the video previously posted and the comments from atfilmguy and segarza.

Seriously though, one shouldn't have to handle a lens THAT gently to avoid noticeable movement if all the ancillary factors have been accounted for.

I too, am surprised that there are reports of no shift at all with some lenses and am very interested in seeing whether there are tolerance variations from the factory. Hopefully we'll hear an answer from Osaka soon; this just has to be resolved at some point...
 
Set up my HPX170 today to test this out.
Unfortunately I no longer have the HVX200 to be able to do a side by side comparison.

Full telephoto
Camera is on a Bogen 516 head & Bogen Sticks
Tripod is locked off
OIS was off (as it should be when on sticks)

Focus was racked manually a couple of times - using one finger on the focus ring.
Shot at 1080/24pA, compressed to H.264

http://www.pitchproductions.com/HPX-lenstest.m4v
 
hmm, I don't like how the image shifts but I wonder if that would happen with the HVX too or not... Do you think that image shift came from the lens or did the whole camera move a little?
 
The camera was locked down, there is no way the entire body of the camera moved.
Focus was pulled very gently. I also repeated this in about 4 or 5 different clips to make certain it was not something like a camera bump.

There is definitely a lateral shifting in the image - though I would caution anyone about getting carried away about this just yet.

I posted this to show one example of one camera.
The more examples we can all see of this simple test, the better - both for us and for Panasonic, who we know is paying attention to this thread.
Ideally I'd like to also see samples from people with the DVX as well as the HVX200 and 200a.

Let's figure out what we're dealing with - and then let's see what we hear back from Panasonic.

Also - keeping in mind that we know there are people from Panasonic paying attention I would ask that we try to keep this thread on topic, focused, and without hyperbole or panic.

The less noise we have, the quicker a response and potential solution will come.
 
Luis,
I looked at your video. That was about as good as I could get mine too. I pulled very gently and still saw movement. The only way to eliminate it was a two handed ultraslow pull.

Normal pulling made it shift quite noticeably.

My HVX was solid. No shift.
 
i can say without question there was no movement on my HVX200, and considerable wobble on the HVX170. again it's simply not in the same ballpark. furthermore, there's not even close to the same amount of play in the DVX100. i've looked at all three.

the reports of there being no issue with some cameras points more and more to a bad batch. let's hope we get an answer soon. i'm sure panasonic would like nothing more than to clear this up and get back to selling (and hopefully repairing) these cameras. they are great in every other aspect.
 
davetronic - if you could post some examples of those it would be helpful to the rest of us, so we all know what we're referring to.
 
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