HPX170 Lens Wobble Improved

I'm really trying to see how this is a non-issue but I just don't see how the lateral image shifting should be considered a "feature" or part of the "design".
 
well, I think in light of this sad event we can only wait for news from Panasonic... no more trying to block the sun with one hand my fellow dvxusers... it's clear now that THERE IS A PROBLEM... as much as we might want to deny it
 
Not a problem with my 170. I compared the shots between my HVX200 and the 170 (no 35mm adapter attached) and the images look rock solid.

I don't ever plan on hanging a DOF adapter off my camera, so I'm not worried.

--SM
 
Panasonic need to hold their hands up to this and come clean. They have got it wrong and will do themselves no good by trying to hide this problem behind the story of 'a design feature'. Who on earth would design a camera that produces wobbly images.

For people who keep insisting that there is no problem and it's a 'non-issue', look back through this thread (and other current threads) and see the wealth of evidence that there is a serious issue with this camera. The very fact that Panasonic have acknowledged that the lens moves on the 170 is proof enough that there is an issue. If Panasonic say that the lens moves then the doubters should also acknowledge there is an issue. This camera is all about the image it produces and at the moment it produces a wobbly image unless you focus from below or stick cardboard shims into the lens (wonder how that affects the warranty).

The evidence is building by the minute and will damage the reputation of the P2 system unless Panasonic take action, quickly. Panasonic will save face and instill confidence back in loyal users and users new to P2 if they announce a solution for current owners and a modified future 170.

Come on Panasonic, do the right thing before it's too late.
 
Segarza said:
Ok guys here's some footage, quick test...

http://homepage.mac.com/segarza/hpx170/imageshift.mov

First rack focus. Then I gently tapped the int microphone, as a reference to see how much of the movement during the rack focus is due to camera shake and how much accounts for the image shifting. Then I gently tapped the focus ring. You be the judge!
Click to expand...

Am I missing something here? I'm light on experience, but this looks like footage shot from a camera on a very light tripod, or no tripod at all.

Also, we are talking about using the manual focus ring, so this shouldn't be an issue using a remote. Is that correct? Can someone verify this?
 
dcnblues said:
Am I missing something here? I'm light on experience, but this looks like footage shot from a camera on a very light tripod, or no tripod at all.

Also, we are talking about using the manual focus ring, so this shouldn't be an issue using a remote. Is that correct? Can someone verify this?
Click to expand...

The HPX170 was mounted on a Sachtler SADV8SB2S DV-8SB/2D Aluminum Tripod System (Supports up to 26.5lbs)

The HPX170, according to specs, weighs 5lbs with battery.

And yes, the rack focus was conducted manually. Shouldn't be a problem using a remote, or remote focus control.
 
dcnblues said:
Am I missing something here? I'm light on experience, but this looks like footage shot from a camera on a very light tripod, or no tripod at all.
Click to expand...

I questioned that too. Because my HPX170 does not have these issues that some others are showing and describing. This lens is designed to move in the event it gets bumped. The shock mount is for protection. This image wobble may be happening because of a faulty shock mount - I'm just guessing. Otherwise we would all have the same exact problem.

No flaw? Design flaw? Manufacturing Flaw? Let's sort this out. Waiting on Jan to report back what the Osaka people say.


dcnblues said:
Also, we are talking about using the manual focus ring, so this shouldn't be an issue using a remote. Is that correct? Can someone verify this?
Click to expand...

Correct.
 
I don't know how many units Panasonic are expecting to sell or how much (exactly) the 170 retails for but the numbers stack up quickly.

If 2000 people were going out to buy a 170 this month and 1000 of them are deterred by the lens wobble and the 170 retails for say, $5000 that's $5,000,000 lost. Not to mention accessories.

Maybe 1000 people have been put off the EX by the rolling shutter. Lets hope so.

I want people to buy a 170, I want to buy a 170 but, not at the moment.
 
I just ordered an adapter ring and zip gear from Zacuto. I'm hoping that the support system + mattebox + follow focus will give the lens more support and rigidity. Personally I would've preferred the risk of breaking the lens of I dropped or hit the camera, as opposed to the lens wobble "just in case" shockmount feature.
 
DC said:
I questioned that too. Because my HPX170 does not have these issues that some others are showing and describing. This lens is designed to move in the event it gets bumped. The shock mount is for protection. This image wobble may be happening because of a faulty shock mount - I'm just guessing. Otherwise we would all have the same exact problem.

No flaw? Design flaw? Manufacturing Flaw? Let's sort this out. Waiting on Jan to report back what the Osaka people say.
Click to expand...


Yes lets get a definitive answer on this.
I too have wondered about the lack of consistency of the movement. Would very much like a new HPX170 without the intense wobble. I would think that there is some way to retrofit it. I am thinking that returning it and getting a HVX200A or a later version of the HPX170, that has been designed better.

The shock mount seems like a good idea. It has been fine for the DVX and the HVX lines. I just think they went too far with this model.
 
Segarza said:
The HPX170 was mounted on a Sachtler SADV8SB2S DV-8SB/2D Aluminum Tripod System (Supports up to 26.5lbs)

The HPX170, according to specs, weighs 5lbs with battery...
Click to expand...

Thanks for the info, and for posting the footage. And again, I've got limited experience. But my impression is that your footage may be more a limit of fully zoomed lens on a light but rigid body camera and a tall but medium to light tripod. Physics are going to bounce that image around a bit with any light touch to the camera.

The 170 may need a little extra weight / support / stability for long locked down shots. And it may just be a limit of the light little camera's specs than a design flaw. As I said, however, I don't speak with any authority.

Do you think you could shoot some same footage but with the OIS (Optical Image Stabilizer) active?
 
cardboards? remote focus? I mean, come on... this wobble just shouldn't be there, period... the more WE try to find solutions the less chances we get to address the real problem... does that sentence makes any sense? sorry but english is my 42nd language...:beer:
 
There's a HUGE difference between tapping the mic and tapping the focus ring... Tapping the mic would be a good reference for camera shake... But then when I tap the focus ring, there's considerable image shifting... more than that of mere camera shake. Actually image shifting looks nothing like the camera shake. The effects are more than evident during the rack focus.

Some may not consider this an issue... but the FACT is there IS image shifting, at least on my camera. By my standards and my clients' this is certainly is a big issue.
 
Possibly, but I will say that given the type of shooting I do (mostly hand-held, lots of action, outdoors stuff), I'm glad to know the shock-mount is there. I'll probably be the guy on these boards who really puts it to the test.
 
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