HPX170 Lens Wobble Improved

DINO,


Forgive me, English is my 5th language...

Because you're not used to using these types of cameras with an adapter, there is going to be a learning curve for you to figure everything out. The problem you're describing...


Dino said:
... The image shifts from side to side while focusing...
Click to expand...

Is due to the OIS being enabled on the camera. If you're using an adapter or you are zoomed all the way in without the adapter, you're going to get the side-to-side jump. I dealt with this myself when I first started using my adapter.

I watched your video and went "Oh F me... now im not buying that crap" Then i tested my HVX and it does the same thing.

Turn off the OIS and it will be fine. My HVX200 has the same side-to-side play on the lens and I've won two oscars with my Redrock and HVX (just kidding) Not kidding about the side-to-side play though. It's the same as your Vimeo video. I've never had a problem.

Another alternative would be to sell me your defective HPX170 for around $3000 seeing as Panasonic's warranty won't cover this issue... making your 170 essentially worthless. Feel free to PM me if you want to sell it. MOOOOOOhahahahahaha!!!!

-Chowder.
 
Well, I wouldn't take anybody's word. Try it for yourself, lock the camera down on a tripod, zoom all the way in or even mid-way, focus and see if it's a non-issue. And this is without any kind of adapter in front of the lens or OIS.

I'll post some footage later today.

I'm certain Panasonic reps would appreciate a changing the title of the thread, but potential buyers that might be affected by this issue would even be more thankful.
 
aurantaurant said:
DINO,
Is due to the OIS being enabled on the camera. If you're using an adapter or you are zoomed all the way in without the adapter, you're going to get the side-to-side jump. I dealt with this myself when I first started using my adapter.

I watched your video and went "Oh F me... now im not buying that crap" Then i tested my HVX and it does the same thing.

Turn off the OIS and it will be fine.

-Chowder.
Click to expand...

I turned OIS off before even mounting the adapter. It has never been on.

That is NOT my video, it was posted by another owner.

This thread documents many owners who feel like the play is more than on previous Panasonic palmcorders.

We have not heard from Osaka, we have not heard from owners using Follow Focus on the built-in lens at a long focal length.

Yet, there are forum members who insist this is a non-issue, want me to change
the thread title, a well regarded expert who proclaimed the play to be exactly the same as the "identically built" previous cameras, without even having seen
a production HPX170, and of course the Panasonic rep. has evolved this front
end play into a feature, one that has been there on previous cameras for years, but was unknown until a few days ago.

If the moderators want to change the thread title or choose to lock up the
thread, that's their choice, it's their forum.
 
I'm getting considerable image shifting in regular operating mode when spinning the focus ring :( mid to full telephoto range. Like I said earlier, did a side by side test with my two HVX200's and no image shifting whatsoever under the exact same circumstances. I love the camera's image quality and all the other perks, it's just that once you offer a customer a certain standard of quality, in this case build quality, Panny can't lower the quality.

I'd rather have a solid reliable build than many of the other new features. I don't think I'll return the camera, but I'll never do any aerial shoots with it, or shoot handheld where I might need to zoom in past mid focal range.
 
ChrisA said:
Probably because some people are grabbing the lens and wiggling it a lot harder then others are, I doubt everyone is able to or wants to exert the exact same amount of force. And the camera in the vimeo video already had a 35mm adapter incorrectly mounted to the lens which could well have exacerbated the movement thereafter.
Click to expand...


What about the fact that some report NO play at all. Are their cameras defective?

I would not want to wiggle hard either, but some have said there is not any play when they try to make it wiggle.

I am waiting also until Osaka speaks, but I still would like to hear about this difference within the HPX line. It seems wierd to me.
 
For those of you who say it is a non-issue, I wondering if you mean that this "wiggle" has never effected a single frame and never will?

I'm also wondering if there was just a bad batch of cameras sent out and those of you who think the "wiggle" is a problem just happened to get this bad batch? Not sure........ we'll just have to see what Osaka says about it.
 
It is interesting that the official Panasonic line on this issue is that it is a design feature, a shock mounted lens in fact. But if that is the case, why are some forum members saying their cameras have no play at all. It sounds like if it is indeed a design feature, it works intermittently from camera to camera.

This thread should not be closed and the title should not be changed. If either happens, the freedom of speech of forum members will be eroded away.
 
Forum members are dismissing this problem as a 'non-issue'. It clearly is an issue, the camera clearly has a problem.

Panasonic have handed the baton to Sony. Lets hope it's only temporary.
 
I've just spent more than 4 hours in my dealer showroom.

We have tested 5 cameras of his batch. These are the results:

1. the amount of the play is exactly the same in all cameras: no differences
2. HVX200 adn DVX100 have a similar play, but it is less pronunciated; anyway both cameras have the same kind of play (lateral and not upside-down)
3. we have tested all kinds of devices you can put on a camera lens (additional lenses, follow focus, mattebox, 35mm adapters etc) and we have made a camera car simulation also
4. we have tried to operate normally moving focus ring (or simply touching the lens) with full zoom

in ALL these tests we've not seen any issues on recorded clips

The lens moves but we've not recorded any issue and we've tried on 6 cameras (mine + 10 in the shop).

Additionally, in the shop there were other people interested to HPX and they've bought the camera after seeing our tests: for all them this was not an issue or a reason to not buy the camera.

This is my experience and the results of the tests.

Regards

Gary
 
This wiggle is generally only an issue for people obsessing over it. Yes, you can wiggle the lens by exerting enough stress on the shock mount. Under normal and proper use, this wiggle is a non-isssue.

For those shooters that want to use it under extreme wind pressure while riding in helicopters, I can't attest that there won't be a problem. For the rest of us . . . relax and enjoy the cam. There is no need for unnecessary flaming of the company and product when "clearly" there has been no problem discovered, but merely a characteristic of the camera that by official accounts is a "feature" of the camera. Anyone that finds contention with that fact is taking a "guilty until proven innocent" stance (which I find unfair).

Unless the Osaka people state anything to the contrary, and because of my personal experience with the HPX170 as well as others' testimonials, I will continue to take the position that there is no design flaw with this camera. And this is not to say that some HPX170 cameras have no defects; that is generally up to the individual HPX170 owners to determine and report to Panasonic.
 
Right now I believe it's hard to take any definitive position on this situation.

I certainly respect Barry, Jen and all others that have been, over the years, incredibly helpful and knowledgeable, but I don't think users experiencing problems with the "wiggle" are just "creating waves" in an otherwise excellent camera release.
I've been following the thread from the beginning and Dino and others also seemed very cautious and knowledgeable.
Jen has mentioned taking the "issue" to Osaka so we'll see what they have to say.
With time there will be many other users expanding and sharing their own experiences.

I'll wait a little longer to cast any verdict.
 
Under normal and proper use, it IS an issue. Just try focusing using index finger and thumb while in mid to full telephoto range. Voila! Image shifting... considerable image shifting. No excess force or anything, a regular rack focus. And this is without ANY lens attachment or OIS. Just a plain HPX170 mounted on a tripod.

The wiggling/wobbling "feature" or whatever you want to call it is nowhere near the HVX200's or the DVX100a's.

As for me, it's not a question of whether Osaka acknowledges the flaw or defective batch, it's about WHAT are they going to do about it. Had a hard time deciding between the EX1/EX3 and HPX, jello-cam was the decisive factor and now I've got panny version of jello-cam on my HPX!

Wish I were more patient and had waited for the HPX170A.
 
gary and others who don't see the moving lens as a problem, can you please do segarza's test and put the camera on a tripod, zoom to 80-100% telephoto, and perform a rack focus between two objects? is there any visible movement in the image?

i'm reading a lot of stuff that isn't very helpful or pertinent, and everyone's tests seem inconsistent. segarza's test is simple, and should nail whether the "shock mount" lens is going to be a problem. i'd really like to know before i plonk down money on this camera.
 
In this moment I'm focusing at full telephoto: the image is firmly stable.

I've tried focusing at full telephoto with other 5 HPX: no issues

My experience is very very different from yours

Regards

Gary
 
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