sodotoguwangus
Well-known member
First and foremost, I think I should begin this piece with a small disclaimer of sorts, so I don’t ruffle any digital feathers — especially if I decide to post this on any of the video/filmmaking forums out there. Sound good? Okay. Here it is:
DISCLAIMER: What follows are my opinions and observations after having owned the Panasonic HVX200 camcorder for nearly a year. I have had plenty of hands on experience with said cam, and think it is a wonderful tool…it’s just not for me. So, please, nobody misinterpret what I am saying and claim that I am HVX-bashing. I’m not (although at times it may sound like I am). Remember, I am focusing on the things I don’t like about the cam; not the things I do like. Regardless, the HVX certainly does have its merits!
Another tid-bit: I don’t care about tests, numbers, resolution charts, and technical jargon. I only care about what I can see, what I can perceive. So please, don’t go spouting off about the merits of DVCProHD and 4:2:2 color space, etc., as I am well aware of these features. The point I am trying to make with this argument is this: for us poor, indie filmmakers on a tight budget, the HVX may not be the best choice. There are several new cams out there (the Sony V1 included) that seem very poised to steal some of Panny’s thunder — at least for those of us who deal in shoe-strings.
This is going to be a long, long post, so let me attempt to break it down for you and give it some order.
==========
PART 1:
Panasonic HVX200 key complaints/issues:
1. The Low overall video resolution
2. The amount of apparent noise in the picture
(even when shooting in an adequately light environment — such as daylight, for crying out loud!)
3. The hassle of the P2 card workflow
PART 2:
That Sony feeling (don’t worry, I’ll explain).
==========
Well, then. Now that that’s out of the way…
Can you feel your blood-pressure rising yet? I hope not. Let’s continue. In depth.
PART 1: KEY HVX COMPLAINTS:
HVX MAJOR COMPLAINT #1 — LOW OVERALL VIDEO RESOLUTION
In visiting several of the popular video forums out there (including this one) I have noticed, on more than one occassion, posts reporting that the overall detail level and sharpness of the HVX is nothing more than SD-and-a-half. In other words, the resolution of this cam appears to be somewhere clearly above SD quality but, at the same time, clearly below HD quality. In other words, these posters place the HVX200 somewhere in the middle — hence the SD-and-a-half or SD.5 as I will call it.
So is the HVX200 only SD.5? I don’t think so. I think that assumption is a little extreme. However, I will go so far as to say that the HVX is clearly the lowest res camcorder in its class — both in terms of numbers and in real-world application. Now, a cam with slightly lower resolution than the competition isn’t always a bad thing. Some industry professionals, especially independent filmmakers, claim that the apparent softness of the HVX gives the images it produces a more dreamy, film-like appearance. I agree…to an extent. But I still feel that capturing more resolution — and thus, more information – during the shooting process gives you more to work with later.
All of this leads me to ask: why would someone want to pay $5,200 for an HVX when they can pay $4,299 for the new Sony HVR-V1U or $3,999 for a new Canon XH-A1 — both of which feature greater resolution? It just doesn’t make sense, especially for those poor, independent filmmaker types who have trouble affording the latest equipment, let alone feeding themselves. (I know, I know, the HVX has variable frame-rates, the more robust DVCProHD codec, and 4:2:2 colorspace). But remember, please, for the sake of this discussion, I am focusing specifically on resolution.
Anyway…when viewing my HVX-shot footage on my High-def 36″ Sony XBR tube-style television, and on my friends new 1080p Sharp 56″ LCD panel, I can say, without doubt, the images produced by the HVX are clearly not as sharp as the images I have seen from the Canon XL-H1, the JVC GY-HD100 or the Sony HVR-Z1U. And this bothers me a great deal. Why? Because, for the price of this cam, it should produce images of equal (if not, greater) sharpness than its competitors. I mean, for one thing, the HVX boasts true 108024p. I’ll say that again: true 108024p. But let me ask you: what good is 108024p if it’s not even as sharp as 720p (JVC GY-HD100) or 1080i (Sony HVR-Z1U) or 108024f (Canon XL-H1)? Makes me wonder…is the HVX really 108024p? Hmmm…
HVX MAJOR COMPLAINT #2 — NOISE
Now I don’t want to beat a dead horse, but the HVX certainly does have a noise issue. There’s no denying it. And for those of you who say this look is pleasing…I have news for you: it’s not. It’s not filmic, and it’s not pleasing, plain and simple. But, in all fairness, I’m not sure that noise is the proper term to describe this phenomenon, since I have never seen noise of this caliber, and with these properties before. Properties, you say? Yes. For example, the noise when shooting on the HVX likes to creep up even when shooting on a brightly-lit, sunny day. Interesting, considering noise (noticeable noise) usually only rears its ugly face in dimly-lit, darker scenes. Strange. Strange indeed. But regardless of what you want to call it, this apparent noise is a huge issue for me. And yes, this noise is extremely obvious on all three of my HD monitors — my Sony XBR, my friend’s LCD, and my Dell 2405.
HVX MAJOR COMPLAINT #3 — THE P2 CARD WORKFLOW
I know you saw this coming. This topic a tough one because, obviously, the P2 card workflow certainly has its pluses and minuses, its gives and takes, its love-its and hate-its.
A little background:
When I first purchased my HVX, the P2 workflow made perfect sense to me. Since I was going to be shooting primarily in a controlled environment (i.e. short films, feature films, etc.), it seemed like the perfect choice. The P2 workflow mirrored film, only instead of physical celluloid, I would be dealing with digital information — all in the compact form of a robust little memory card.
Brilliant!
Or so I thought…
But what happens when I change my mind? What happens when I decide suddenly, that I would like to shoot a wedding or two for some extra cash? What happens when it is my grandma’s 80th birthday and I want to capture every precious moment without having to worry about swapping cards, dumping cards, etc? I’ll tell you what happens. What happens is the camera doesn’t get used. I’ll repeat that: the camera doesn’t get used. Think about it. For someone who has very serious aspirations of becoming a feature film director (someday, I pray), this is a very, very bad thing indeed. Gone are the days when I could go out with my old Sony Handycam and shoot away to my heart’s content — experimenting, learning, and gaining that much needed, invaluable hands-on experience.
All this has taught me something. It has taught me that while the HVX is an excellent filmmaking tool in a controlled environment, it is not well-suited for situations that are uncontrolled or live. The HVX is not the best choice for those of us who just want to go out and shoot, to practice, to experiment without restrictions, and not worry about storage. For those kinds of situations, P2 just doesn’t make as much sense as a good old tape. Don’t get me wrong, I love the ability to instantly delete bad takes, and I love the nonlinear scene access of P2 (it’s magical in that it is just like moving from audio tape to CD, or VHS to DVD for the first time), but sometimes a good old tape is what you need.
So there you have it. My key HVX200 complaints.
(Better pause for a moment and check your pulse!)
If you are still reading, I hope I haven’t offended you too much. Remember, all of this is merely one user’s opinions and experiences — nothing more, nothing less.
Onward!
So, as the title of this article/post implies, I am very seriously considering trading my trusty HVX the new Sony HVR-V1U. Canon’s new entry, the XH-A1, looks promising as well – especially considering that it comes with the same imaging processor as its older, more expensive brother, the $9,000 Canon XL-H1…but I think I’m leaning toward the Sony. Which brings us to…
PART 2: THAT SONY FEELING:
What am I talking about? What exactly is that Sony feeling? Hmmm… Let me attempt to explain.
The Sony feeling is something that is hard to put into words. It’s something that you almost have to experience, rather than read about. It’s something unique. Something spcecial. Something inspirational (Yeah, you heard me: inspirational. I’m tearing up just thinking about it — jk!)
Sony users, and you know who you are, know what I’m talking about. But for the rest of you, what I am trying to describe iis the feeling I get when I use Sony camcorders — the build quality, button layout, features, design, etc. There is just something about Sony gear that works for me. Something about their products just feels right, like it was meant to be. (I warned you, this is going to be really hard to explain. Bear with me!).
So, if I looooove Sony so much, why did I buy a Panasonic HVX200? Good question. I’ll give you the reason. Three, actually:
REASON #1
The legendary DVX100 camcorder. The DVX100 was such a great, groundbreaking, affordable digital cinematic tool that I thought I couldn’t go wrong with the HVX, the DVX’s successor. Everything the DVX offered was promised and delivered (for the most part) on the HVX — only now in high-def. Magnificent!
REASON #2
At the time, Sony seemed to be going downhill in my book. The Z1 felt like cheap, hollow plastic compared to Sony’s previous offerings. And the layout and features of the Z1 didn’t “feel” like a Sony. What’s more, Sony dropped the ball of 24p recording, instead offering the inadequate, laughable Cineframe 24 mode. What were they thinking?
REASON #3
DVXuser.com. After spending so much time over at the DVXuser website, I caught the DVX fever — which mutated into the HVX fever. Now I know I’m treading on sensitive ground here but, one has to understand, when visiting a site called DVXuser, oppinions and suggestions are going to be slightly canted toward offerings from Panasonic. This is understandable. It is DVXuser after all. Unfortunately, at the time, for whatever reason, this did not occur to me.
So…why am I considering a return to Sony? Because, I believe, that the new Sony V1U marks a return to form for the company. The V1’s design is sleek, refined, and dead sexy (always a plus in my book), harkening back to the venerable VX2000 and 2100 camcorders, and Sony has finally decided to offer true 108024p recording — albiet for the first time in a camcorder at a sub-$5,000 price-point. I’m not talking about CineFrame 24, or 108024f, or 108024p to a P2 card only. I’m talking about real, true 108024p, recorded straight to a tried-and-tested, familiar tape — with none of the storage limits, time considerations (4 minutes on a 4 gig card, yuck!), or hassles associated with the P2 media format. What’s more, holding the V1 in hand feels good. It has that Sony feeling. Gone is the cheap, plastic feel of the Z1.
Now, for the sake of agrument, why don’t I choose the new Canon XH-A1 over the Sony HVR-V1U? The two cams have similiar feature-sets, similiar pricing, and the Canon has a wider stock lense and bigger chips which could, and should, equate to better low-light performance. So why not the Canon?
Quite simply this: as I said before, I believe the Sony HVR-V1 marks a return to form for Sony; a throwback to the company’s golden years. What’s more, the V1 has that magical “Sony feeling”, which Sony seemed to have lost touch with in the last generation, and that, for me, is enough.
(NOTE: you can view the original post on my website www.wondervisionpictures.com/blog . Feel free to coment there as well. Thanks.)
–Ryan Maes
DISCLAIMER: What follows are my opinions and observations after having owned the Panasonic HVX200 camcorder for nearly a year. I have had plenty of hands on experience with said cam, and think it is a wonderful tool…it’s just not for me. So, please, nobody misinterpret what I am saying and claim that I am HVX-bashing. I’m not (although at times it may sound like I am). Remember, I am focusing on the things I don’t like about the cam; not the things I do like. Regardless, the HVX certainly does have its merits!
Another tid-bit: I don’t care about tests, numbers, resolution charts, and technical jargon. I only care about what I can see, what I can perceive. So please, don’t go spouting off about the merits of DVCProHD and 4:2:2 color space, etc., as I am well aware of these features. The point I am trying to make with this argument is this: for us poor, indie filmmakers on a tight budget, the HVX may not be the best choice. There are several new cams out there (the Sony V1 included) that seem very poised to steal some of Panny’s thunder — at least for those of us who deal in shoe-strings.
This is going to be a long, long post, so let me attempt to break it down for you and give it some order.
==========
PART 1:
Panasonic HVX200 key complaints/issues:
1. The Low overall video resolution
2. The amount of apparent noise in the picture
(even when shooting in an adequately light environment — such as daylight, for crying out loud!)
3. The hassle of the P2 card workflow
PART 2:
That Sony feeling (don’t worry, I’ll explain).
==========
Well, then. Now that that’s out of the way…
Can you feel your blood-pressure rising yet? I hope not. Let’s continue. In depth.
PART 1: KEY HVX COMPLAINTS:
HVX MAJOR COMPLAINT #1 — LOW OVERALL VIDEO RESOLUTION
In visiting several of the popular video forums out there (including this one) I have noticed, on more than one occassion, posts reporting that the overall detail level and sharpness of the HVX is nothing more than SD-and-a-half. In other words, the resolution of this cam appears to be somewhere clearly above SD quality but, at the same time, clearly below HD quality. In other words, these posters place the HVX200 somewhere in the middle — hence the SD-and-a-half or SD.5 as I will call it.
So is the HVX200 only SD.5? I don’t think so. I think that assumption is a little extreme. However, I will go so far as to say that the HVX is clearly the lowest res camcorder in its class — both in terms of numbers and in real-world application. Now, a cam with slightly lower resolution than the competition isn’t always a bad thing. Some industry professionals, especially independent filmmakers, claim that the apparent softness of the HVX gives the images it produces a more dreamy, film-like appearance. I agree…to an extent. But I still feel that capturing more resolution — and thus, more information – during the shooting process gives you more to work with later.
All of this leads me to ask: why would someone want to pay $5,200 for an HVX when they can pay $4,299 for the new Sony HVR-V1U or $3,999 for a new Canon XH-A1 — both of which feature greater resolution? It just doesn’t make sense, especially for those poor, independent filmmaker types who have trouble affording the latest equipment, let alone feeding themselves. (I know, I know, the HVX has variable frame-rates, the more robust DVCProHD codec, and 4:2:2 colorspace). But remember, please, for the sake of this discussion, I am focusing specifically on resolution.
Anyway…when viewing my HVX-shot footage on my High-def 36″ Sony XBR tube-style television, and on my friends new 1080p Sharp 56″ LCD panel, I can say, without doubt, the images produced by the HVX are clearly not as sharp as the images I have seen from the Canon XL-H1, the JVC GY-HD100 or the Sony HVR-Z1U. And this bothers me a great deal. Why? Because, for the price of this cam, it should produce images of equal (if not, greater) sharpness than its competitors. I mean, for one thing, the HVX boasts true 108024p. I’ll say that again: true 108024p. But let me ask you: what good is 108024p if it’s not even as sharp as 720p (JVC GY-HD100) or 1080i (Sony HVR-Z1U) or 108024f (Canon XL-H1)? Makes me wonder…is the HVX really 108024p? Hmmm…
HVX MAJOR COMPLAINT #2 — NOISE
Now I don’t want to beat a dead horse, but the HVX certainly does have a noise issue. There’s no denying it. And for those of you who say this look is pleasing…I have news for you: it’s not. It’s not filmic, and it’s not pleasing, plain and simple. But, in all fairness, I’m not sure that noise is the proper term to describe this phenomenon, since I have never seen noise of this caliber, and with these properties before. Properties, you say? Yes. For example, the noise when shooting on the HVX likes to creep up even when shooting on a brightly-lit, sunny day. Interesting, considering noise (noticeable noise) usually only rears its ugly face in dimly-lit, darker scenes. Strange. Strange indeed. But regardless of what you want to call it, this apparent noise is a huge issue for me. And yes, this noise is extremely obvious on all three of my HD monitors — my Sony XBR, my friend’s LCD, and my Dell 2405.
HVX MAJOR COMPLAINT #3 — THE P2 CARD WORKFLOW
I know you saw this coming. This topic a tough one because, obviously, the P2 card workflow certainly has its pluses and minuses, its gives and takes, its love-its and hate-its.
A little background:
When I first purchased my HVX, the P2 workflow made perfect sense to me. Since I was going to be shooting primarily in a controlled environment (i.e. short films, feature films, etc.), it seemed like the perfect choice. The P2 workflow mirrored film, only instead of physical celluloid, I would be dealing with digital information — all in the compact form of a robust little memory card.
Brilliant!
Or so I thought…
But what happens when I change my mind? What happens when I decide suddenly, that I would like to shoot a wedding or two for some extra cash? What happens when it is my grandma’s 80th birthday and I want to capture every precious moment without having to worry about swapping cards, dumping cards, etc? I’ll tell you what happens. What happens is the camera doesn’t get used. I’ll repeat that: the camera doesn’t get used. Think about it. For someone who has very serious aspirations of becoming a feature film director (someday, I pray), this is a very, very bad thing indeed. Gone are the days when I could go out with my old Sony Handycam and shoot away to my heart’s content — experimenting, learning, and gaining that much needed, invaluable hands-on experience.
All this has taught me something. It has taught me that while the HVX is an excellent filmmaking tool in a controlled environment, it is not well-suited for situations that are uncontrolled or live. The HVX is not the best choice for those of us who just want to go out and shoot, to practice, to experiment without restrictions, and not worry about storage. For those kinds of situations, P2 just doesn’t make as much sense as a good old tape. Don’t get me wrong, I love the ability to instantly delete bad takes, and I love the nonlinear scene access of P2 (it’s magical in that it is just like moving from audio tape to CD, or VHS to DVD for the first time), but sometimes a good old tape is what you need.
So there you have it. My key HVX200 complaints.
(Better pause for a moment and check your pulse!)
If you are still reading, I hope I haven’t offended you too much. Remember, all of this is merely one user’s opinions and experiences — nothing more, nothing less.
Onward!
So, as the title of this article/post implies, I am very seriously considering trading my trusty HVX the new Sony HVR-V1U. Canon’s new entry, the XH-A1, looks promising as well – especially considering that it comes with the same imaging processor as its older, more expensive brother, the $9,000 Canon XL-H1…but I think I’m leaning toward the Sony. Which brings us to…
PART 2: THAT SONY FEELING:
What am I talking about? What exactly is that Sony feeling? Hmmm… Let me attempt to explain.
The Sony feeling is something that is hard to put into words. It’s something that you almost have to experience, rather than read about. It’s something unique. Something spcecial. Something inspirational (Yeah, you heard me: inspirational. I’m tearing up just thinking about it — jk!)
Sony users, and you know who you are, know what I’m talking about. But for the rest of you, what I am trying to describe iis the feeling I get when I use Sony camcorders — the build quality, button layout, features, design, etc. There is just something about Sony gear that works for me. Something about their products just feels right, like it was meant to be. (I warned you, this is going to be really hard to explain. Bear with me!).
So, if I looooove Sony so much, why did I buy a Panasonic HVX200? Good question. I’ll give you the reason. Three, actually:
REASON #1
The legendary DVX100 camcorder. The DVX100 was such a great, groundbreaking, affordable digital cinematic tool that I thought I couldn’t go wrong with the HVX, the DVX’s successor. Everything the DVX offered was promised and delivered (for the most part) on the HVX — only now in high-def. Magnificent!
REASON #2
At the time, Sony seemed to be going downhill in my book. The Z1 felt like cheap, hollow plastic compared to Sony’s previous offerings. And the layout and features of the Z1 didn’t “feel” like a Sony. What’s more, Sony dropped the ball of 24p recording, instead offering the inadequate, laughable Cineframe 24 mode. What were they thinking?
REASON #3
DVXuser.com. After spending so much time over at the DVXuser website, I caught the DVX fever — which mutated into the HVX fever. Now I know I’m treading on sensitive ground here but, one has to understand, when visiting a site called DVXuser, oppinions and suggestions are going to be slightly canted toward offerings from Panasonic. This is understandable. It is DVXuser after all. Unfortunately, at the time, for whatever reason, this did not occur to me.
So…why am I considering a return to Sony? Because, I believe, that the new Sony V1U marks a return to form for the company. The V1’s design is sleek, refined, and dead sexy (always a plus in my book), harkening back to the venerable VX2000 and 2100 camcorders, and Sony has finally decided to offer true 108024p recording — albiet for the first time in a camcorder at a sub-$5,000 price-point. I’m not talking about CineFrame 24, or 108024f, or 108024p to a P2 card only. I’m talking about real, true 108024p, recorded straight to a tried-and-tested, familiar tape — with none of the storage limits, time considerations (4 minutes on a 4 gig card, yuck!), or hassles associated with the P2 media format. What’s more, holding the V1 in hand feels good. It has that Sony feeling. Gone is the cheap, plastic feel of the Z1.
Now, for the sake of agrument, why don’t I choose the new Canon XH-A1 over the Sony HVR-V1U? The two cams have similiar feature-sets, similiar pricing, and the Canon has a wider stock lense and bigger chips which could, and should, equate to better low-light performance. So why not the Canon?
Quite simply this: as I said before, I believe the Sony HVR-V1 marks a return to form for Sony; a throwback to the company’s golden years. What’s more, the V1 has that magical “Sony feeling”, which Sony seemed to have lost touch with in the last generation, and that, for me, is enough.
(NOTE: you can view the original post on my website www.wondervisionpictures.com/blog . Feel free to coment there as well. Thanks.)
–Ryan Maes
