How's about we talk about the camera again?

S

SF Geek

Active member
Mac. PC. Save that for another forum. Can we get back to talking about the camera and viewfinder please?

On the camera, is the display still slated to be on the back? I was hoping you'd consider putting it on the operator side of the camera so that the 1st AC can see it. It also seems that there will be a fair amount of mounting going on on the back of the camera. As for readouts that are diplayed while shooting and in standby, could they include timecode, frame rate, shutter speed and gamma setting or LUT #? That would be very helpful.

In the viewfinder could we have 720p res, frame markers, waveform/vectorscope, peaking and a zoom in function? Please. Could you include other film viefinder add-ons like, eyepiece extender, heated eyepiece, and a leveling rod mount?

Many of these things have bee addressed by Jim in the past but I just want to know what the newest update is. I also want to hear if anyone has any more suggestions on the camera design before it gets too solidified.
 
The LCD/OLED/whatever on-camera monitor is external and mountable wherever you like. There's also what's presumably a data-only display shown on the camera body itself.
 
I'm not talking about the LCD display, I'm talking about the display that's on the camera itself. You just have to look at the picture to see it. It doesn't show an image. It's the one you use to navigate the menu. That's the one I want on the operator side.

These are the replies i get? Two? Everyone here just wants to talk about what computer system they think is better? How many times do Graeme and Jim have to say that the software will work on both platforms. How about we talk about something that matters.
 
SF Geek said:
I'm not talking about the LCD display, I'm talking about the display that's on the camera itself.
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That's what Haakon's talking about. It was asked and answered months ago. The question was asked specifically regarding the REDCAGE. It was answered at that time that the display would be able to be taken off the camera and moved.

SF Geek said:
These are the replies i get? Two? Everyone here just wants to talk about what computer system they think is better? How many times do Graeme and Jim have to say that the software will work on both platforms. How about we talk about something that matters.
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And how many times do that have to answer your question?
 
What else is there to talk about? We haven't been told anything new lately. Until we see more footage from RED that they're willing to certify as "Near Final Quality". All we can do is mumble about ourselves... "well the current footage has some problems but I have faith they'll get it fixed for the final hardware."

We still can't make final judgments about the image quality. We pretty much know all of the specifications. Or if we don't know, they haven't told us yet, so there's nothing to talk about. However you slice it, talking about what sort of pipeline we're going to use to handle 4k footage in general is about the only course of discussion relevant and fresh to the RED Camera.
 
Everyone is a bit grummpy it seems. We should have plenty to talk about on November 1st.
I'm packing up for ashoot on Maui but I'm sending in a second reservation before I go.. tha kids education will just have to wait !
Aloha
-A
 
All along we have said the specs are subject to change. We are trying to put the best package together we can. I'm sure someone will be disappointed with something when we are done. Can't please everyone. We are trying to keep that list (of things people are not happy with) as short as possible.

Remember, we started 9 months ago from scratch. And this is an "impossible project". To satisfy every request from every point of view is not realistic. One thing no one will be disappointed with is the footage that it can deliver.

Jim
 
Jannard said:
One thing no one will be disappointed with is the footage that it can deliver.
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That's my top priority. Whether or not it has ribbing for the user's pleasure is next to irrellevant.
 
Whether or not it has ribbing for the user's pleasure is next to irrellevant.
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I would like mine with ribbing for serious heat dissapation, the picture is for all of our pleasure.
 
Jarred Land said:
it can be argued that the back is the operator side....
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Arguments aside, if there's crucial information on that small display it only makes sense to be able to mirror it to the viewfinder, too. Everyone happy.

Barend.
 
Jarred Land said:
it can be argued that the back is the operator side....
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It sure is better to be on "that side" of the camera than the other one...:Drogar-BigGrin(DBG)
 
Wow! These forums sure go off on tangents. Yes it can be argued that the back is operator side. It's just AC terminology that describes the left side of the camera (if you're looking at it from the rear), in easier terms than how I just said it. It's normally the side that you thread the film on, the side that the counter is on, and the side that the lens markings are oriented to. But that's not important. That was just one thing I was suggesting.

Come on guys. My post was asking if anyone had their own suggestions about things in the actual design of the camera. Sure over all the threads in the past few months most things had been brought up somewhere in the myriads of threads and responses, but the camera is getting closer and closer to completion. And I was hoping that people would reiterate their requests for things they would like in the camera pertaining to what the camera is specified to be, a digital cinema camera. I'm not asking Jim to give us definate answers, but just to listen to peple's suggestions like he's been kind enough to do. Maybe he could give us an update on what he feels is important to have on the camera, viewfinder, lcd, rail, and cage and we can reply back in a respectful manner what our concerns are. He doesn't have to do what people ask but at least that way he can hear about what's really important to everybody. You know, kind of like what we've been doing some of the time.

For instance, I feel that we should have sufficient 12volt power plugs on camera to supply what is needed for most steadicam, jib and other remote mounts. With those setups you usually need power for a zoom drive, remote follow focus, and even for a cinetape type device. Are you planning on having those ports or at least a single port that can be split for all of these things?
 
Displays and things

Displays and things

The rear display is primarily for camera status - things like timecode, frame rate, sensor sensitivity, shutter angle. They also appear in the viewfinder and the LCD monitor along with frame markers etc. The LCD monitor can mount anywhere you wish (within reason). Plus yes to 12V aux power output.

I'm sure we have you covered, but as we are focussed on the practical demands of mechanical engineering and software writing, apologies if our answers are too brief.
 
SF Geek said:
My post was asking if anyone had their own suggestions about things in the actual design of the camera. I was hoping that people would reiterate their requests for things they would like in the camera.
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When I first saw this forum I ran up a list of hundreds of things in my mind that would be cool to have on "the best camera ever". I wrote a list for myself and followed the threads. It was amazing to see how so many people where thinking about the same things. Someone even suggested "the RED hive mind". So after a while all of my concerns where addressed without even having to post them.

Two things remained unanswered until recently. One was about making sure that somehow it is possible to use a laptop to preview and work with the files . This to enable the whole setup to fit in a backpack, this way you can take the 4k quality anywhere and know what you are doing. This is discussed and answered here:

http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/showthread.php?t=76487&page=2

So the one thing remaining is about the evolution of the camera and its ability to upgrade. It seems to me the RED hardware is so sturdy that it will last forever. But sensors and cpu capabilities evolve rapidly. Not that the Mysterium sensor isn't amazing as it is, the screening sure proved that, but the technology will evolve. So in a couple of years when they have made a new sensor "the Obscureum sensor" that has the beginning ISO of 6400 or "the Rapidium sensor" capable of a million frames a second or maybe the "the Orgasmium sensor" capable of reading any wavelength of energy used mostly for scientific purposes of course.

Anyway it hasn't really been discussed if it will be an easy bayonet or slide in slide out function of say the sensor, cpu and ram like you can do on a digital medium format camera and a desktop computer respectively.

It is easy to see that there are many reasons for not building the camera this way, but as you asked if there where any suggestions around, I thought I throw these ones back into the mix.
 
mac and pc

mac and pc

SF Geek said:
Come on guys. My post was asking if anyone had their own suggestions about things in the actual design of the camera. Sure over all the threads in the past few months most things had been brought up somewhere in the myriads of threads and responses, but the camera is getting closer and closer to completion. And I was hoping that people would reiterate their requests for things they would like in the camera pertaining to what the camera is specified to be, a digital cinema camera. I'm not asking Jim to give us definate answers, but just to listen to peple's suggestions like he's been kind enough to do. Maybe he could give us an update on what he feels is important to have on the camera, viewfinder, lcd, rail, and cage and we can reply back in a respectful manner what our concerns are. He doesn't have to do what people ask but at least that way he can hear about what's really important to everybody. You know, kind of like what we've been doing some of the time.
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and that's the point of a mac vs. pc poll. as a mac user, i'm glad to see a majority in this forum. and as we all know, red isn't comprised of a very large development team so i wouldn't be surprised if some phases of development lag slightly behind others based upon customer base. now we and red know where we stand as far as user breakdown.

now feel free to go off on tangents.
 
Thanks for replying Stuart. Would it be possible to have the rear display on the operator side instead of the back? It seems that I will be frequently rear mounting things like drives and batteries on the rear of the camera rig and would like the display more accessible and visible for my AC. If it's just me working alone I can put all the info on the Image display :viewfinder, monitor. When I'm working with an AC I'd like my monitor free of all that stuff so I can have only the image. If that info was viewable from where the 1st AC stands on the operator side, then they can make sure everything is how it should be.

Thanks.
 
Maybe the back panel could pop off with a little bungie like some Sony VTRs' control panels. Then you could velcro it wherever you want for your AC.
 
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