Do I need to shoot in 720p?

pmpworks

pmpworks

Well-known member
I've got an HVX, and new powermac on the way. I'm starting out doing a few weddings that will be put on DVD. By looking at 720p footage it looks as if downrezing it for DVD would be much better than just shooting to dvtape. Trying to decide on firestore... Is it going to be worth it? I'm also planning on doing a music video for a local band so I may also get a 4gb p2. The video will also go to DVD.
 
Absolutely shoot HD. Archive the video, and in a year or two when more people have BluRay or HD DVD players, sell them an HD version of their wedding.

The tools are actually available now, but the market doesn't exist.
 
MovieSwede said:
well are they gonna pay for it ;)

If you want the best looking DVDs shoot DVCPRO50.
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In our experience, shooting 720/24pn and taking it to DVD looks better the DVCPro50.
 
According to my own tests, 720pN looks slightly (very slightly), better than DVCPro50 when downcoverted. According to Barry Green's tests (who wrote the book on this camera and knows a hell of a lot more than I do and probably anyone else on this board), DVCPro50 looks slightly (once again very slightly) better than 720pN. They both however look quite a bit better than standard DV (which is what you'd get if you shot to tape).

So, the point is, shooting 720p and DVCPro50 is going to look about the same. However, 720p is going to give you more space in native mode, 2.5 minutes per gig over 2 minutes. You will also be able to take advantage of the variable frame rates (people will love cheesy slow mo for weddings) and you have an HD master which means better looking motion stablization. DVCPro50, on the other hand, will take up less space if you're recording to a FS100 since you can't use Native mode.
 
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The main determining factors are these:

1) do you need a high-def master? If so, use 720/24pN unquestionably without a doubt. Even though I find that DVCPRO50 looks slightly better (and it is slight) than downconverted 720p, the benefit of having an HD master is absolutely worth it.

2) does your edit system handle 720/24pN? If you're using Premiere Pro or Vegas, you may find it so much easier to just edit dvcpro50.

3) the firestore point is a good one, you'd get twice as much storage space in DV50 over 720p.

For most purposes I think shooting 720/24pN is the better choice than DV50. But if it's for a strictly-DVD-only project I can't see the argument for shooting 720p and downrezzing; DV50 is going to be easier to work with, faster, and just looks a little bit better.
 
Ok, sounds like I will want to shoot DV50 for the DVD and if I get a p2 card also I could do the cheesy slow motion. I will be editing on FCP (switching from avid) so will I be able to mix DV50 and the HD stuff in the same project? I will also be shooting some SD with other cams from different angles, can I mix that as well?I've used avid for SD projects but my pc is too slow for HD so I bought a mac after long decision, I hope it was a good one. I'm assuming you can't mix 24p with 60i so if I can mix them should I shoot all cams at 60i?
 
David S. said:
Remember that DVCPro50 takes up more space the 720p/24.

And with the HD master, you are future proofing.
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DVCPRO50 takes up more space only if you are shooting 720pn/24. Regular old 720p/24 is in a 60i stream and takes quite a bit more space. Approx 8 min on a 4gig card.:)

Firestore or any external option cannot do 24pn except cineporter...
 
I thought the firestore could do 720p 24p, but I read now where it only does 720p 60i. Thanks David you just saved me. Should I just get an 8GB P2 card for now? How much 720pn 24p can you get on an 8GB P2 card? sorry for all the questions I just need a little direction here.
 
Thanks. and can you offload the p2 to an older laptop just for storage reasons, say a p3 with 60gb of harddrive space, or do you need a powerful laptop to store footage to.
 
pmpworks said:
Thanks. and can you offload the p2 to an older laptop just for storage reasons, say a p3 with 60gb of harddrive space, or do you need a powerful laptop to store footage to.
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That should work as long as you have a PCMCIA slot and I would recomend the use of an external Hard drive. Makes it easier when transfering to the edit bay and for organization.
 
Cool, it does have a PCMCIA slot, I think I'll just get 2 8gb cards and forget about the cineporter. I think that the p2 cards will work for what I plan on doing and I really don't need to add more weight to the steady cam I built, by adding a cineporter (besides that I can't wait) , it already weighs 15lbs with camera and all. Thanks for everones help, you've all convinced me on the P2.
 
pmpworks said:
I thought the firestore could do 720p 24p, but I read now where it only does 720p 60i. Thanks David you just saved me. Should I just get an 8GB P2 card for now? How much 720pn 24p can you get on an 8GB P2 card? sorry for all the questions I just need a little direction here.
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clarification: A firestore can do 720 24p in the "Over 60" mode and you would then convert the duplicate frame rates in post (as in the DVX). It can not do 720 24pn (meaning no variable frame rate and space saving on cards) Having said that, the firestore seems to be gettng mixed reviews.

The Cineporter will be able to do 720 24pn because it connects to the P2 slots not the 1394 cable.

I don't know what laptop you have, but if it is an HP or Compaq model, don't count on it being able to handle the 8G cards.
 
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convert the duplicate frame rates in post
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Will you get the exact same output (24p) if you record this way, and is it a pain to convert the duplicate frame rate in post (new to FCP). The laptop I have is a Dell Latitude.
 
Yes it would be 24p, i am pretty sure theire is a program in FCP that removes the duplicate frames very easily (Framerate Converter Utility) although I have never used it. The Dell should be okay, but no guarantees, it really depends on the pcmcia driver they have used. I bought an acer recently bc I wanted to use P2 viewer and my old Dell couldn't play the clips back properly.
 
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