Red: not for indie film makers

Tainted said:
My take on this is that the new "Indie" is becoming a little less "guerilla" than it used to be, and I personally think that isn't a bad thing. For me, I make a distinction between no-budget (aka guerilla), low-budget (aka indie), and big-budget (aka studio). Now maybe I've taken some liberties with that breakdown, but I think the days of bucketing all lower-budget projects as "indie" might be numbered, which paves the way for a new breakout in semantics between indie and guerilla. Anyway, just a few thoughts on that front from a total amateur... :)
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And you also have the indies who have big budgets.
 
vamshi said:
independent film makers most budget starts from 7000$ to 20000$.
anything beyond 20000$ is a big budgets.
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what? Name 3 indie feature films that made it to theatres that cost under $100,000. Name 5 that cost under $500,000.

I was dissapointed the price wasn't lower because i can't afford 30k for the whole package. But this isn't for us who make shorts for fun and practice, but in a year or 2 when i want to make my feature, I won't have to worry about paying for the 35mm package, or compromising with substandard equipment. Red will be there, thank god
 
Cheesesailor77 said:
what? Name 3 indie feature films that made it to theatres that cost under $100,000. Name 5 that cost under $500,000.

I was dissapointed the price wasn't lower because i can't afford 30k for the whole package. But this isn't for us who make shorts for fun and practice, but in a year or 2 when i want to make my feature, I won't have to worry about paying for the 35mm package, or compromising with substandard equipment. Red will be there, thank god
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My Date with Drew - $1,100, distributed in Theatres.

Blairwitch Project - $35,000 (Production Budget)

November (Starring Courtney Cox) - $250,000 (production budget) 250,000 (advertising budget.)

Pieces of April - 300,000 Production Budget.

4 out of 5. Not all indie I'd suppose, but still low-budget. The only thiing that makes them not indie is the studio name. Money's in question, though, right?


Aside from that-- To the topic started

I said it once, and I'm backing the evil John Hudson on this:

Stop focusing on the tools if you REALLY want to make this your profession. You can accomplish plenty with a DVX + Mini35 adapter... even more with an HVX or another HDV camera

Rent if you aren't an enthusiast....

Stop complaining about the more than reasonable price tag.
 
Really, I don't get this complaining about the price...

I can't afford this camera also, but geesh... The camera is 4x times as good as a Cinealta and 5 times (I repeat... 5 TIMES!) as cheap as one.
It's almost the same price as a SDX900 from Panasonic.
And people still complain about price?
This camera has been made as cheap as possible, concerning the price. Be happy, people, you would never get this from one of the big companies!

ps: first post here :)
 
jrv3034 said:
Well, most of hollywood considers low-budget independent filmmaking tro be in the $500,000 to $7,000,000 budget range. What you're talking about is NO-Budget filmmaking. $0 to $99,999 is no-budget filmmaking.
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Exactly.
 
Sidderke said:
Really, I don't get this complaining about the price...

I can't afford this camera also, but geesh... The camera is 4x times as good as a Cinealta and 5 times (I repeat... 5 TIMES!) as cheap as one.
It's almost the same price as a SDX900 from Panasonic.
And people still complain about price?
This camera has been made as cheap as possible, concerning the price. Be happy, people, you would never get this from one of the big companies!

ps: first post here :)
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Top beginning.

EDIT -- You're welcome!
 
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Besides my previous two posts above, I understand the principle, so please Jim Jannard be gentle with the accessories price (I'm in the list -- #111) and if we're supporting you it's because we believe that you have the best deal to offer -- a real indie one.

EDIT -- Sure, we'd like to have yet budget to our projects...
 
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This thread should be locked or something.

Edit: (For Civility) No need to say all of that. Stop whining about the reasonable price of a camera that ain't even out yet. Get a camera and go make a movie.
 
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Would I love to have one of these cameras that could hypothetically be a possibility in a couple years. Yes! Will I be able to afford it, if it ever does happen? No!
I find all this obsessing over a camera that doesn't exist yet, sucking the minutes of my life away. I always get caught up in these forums, and the only thing I have to show for it is carpal tunnel.
Sometime I wonder if I should change the title of my occupation from "videographer" or "filmmaker" to "Guy who likes to Fart around on the Computer all day drooling over production equipment that I will either A)never have or B)finally purchase it, and then start making excuses why my film won't work...only to start searching out that next big thing that will finally make me a creative success!"
Nah, videographer is shorter! :)

Sometimes I wonder if these forums are secretly a support group for people who like to research and shop for videography equipment. It's like the kid who says they want to be a filmmaker, but secretly he just likes watching movies.
 
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Newsbreak: as John so succinctly put it, independent filmmakers are already competing with "the majors" with the cameras we have now. In television - especially documentary and reality - there is a major saturation of 1/3" imager cameras where 16mm used to reside exclusively.

To what financial extent they are competing is another discussion altogether.

Owning a camera system doesn't make you a filmmaker - it makes you a camera owner. The camera doesn't create, it simply enables creation for anyone who endeavors to do so.

I hope that all the rental houses jump on this RED thing if it does what we've been told. Why most independent filmmakers or operators would buy it is beyond me. Same goes for the Sony CineAlta cameras - I know several operators who pay that $4000 / month bill to the leasing company and work the camera for ten days a month at cut-rate prices.

The market is simply over-saturated with these devices. I expect that our new HVX will have a rental life of 18 months before market saturation interrupts it. At this price-point, it still represents a relatively sound investment.

e
 
"Owning a camera system doesn't make you a filmmaker - it makes you a camera owner. "

Absolutely brilliant !

suppose even if the inde-filmmaker has a budet of $100,000/- does he spends 35-45000/- on camera alone? hell no!

vamshi
 
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Well, I wouldn't mortgage the house if I was a no-budget filmmaker, which is who we're discussing here really.

Sharpen your skills with the HDV/P2 cameras and then rent RED when you're ready. If you don't have a good business plan, or some revenue stream allocated then wait to rent, IMO.

Beyond that, this cam has the specs that the indie world has been asking for to compete with larger productions/distribution channels for a long time. Hence all the excitement.

Of course (talent, story) being equal of course. All indie filmmakers ask for is to be on a fairly level technological playing field and a decent shot at the distribution channels. RED seems to be a step in the right direction, in that regard. :beer:


PS - I think the title of the thread should be RED: not for no-budget filmmakers.
 
"PS - I think the title of the thread should be RED: not for no-budget filmmakers."

That is what i am saying Red is not for independent film makers(no budget or low budget ..whatever is called)...friend!

thanx
vamshi
 
brother good idea...you dont have any plans to start blue...if you have an idea ..please see my specifications..i a'int want any 4k.. just give me 1080p or 2k,23.98, kodak t100/200 film quality equivalent to super16mm.and pl mount. under $5000/- can you do it bro?

vamshi
 
John_Hudson said:
This camera will be very affordable for the SERIOUS independent filmmaker

One film comes to mind for me and to this day is the film that 're-inspired' my filmmaking dream:

28 Days Later

Filmed on the Canon XL1. If one cannot be inspired by this single film then no camera no matter the price will work for you. Stop focusing on the limitations of your own creativity and get busy making your dreams come true.

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What about Pieces of April ? Filmed on the Sony PD-150 ? This film got Patricia Clarkson an Oscar Nod

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How about Open Water shot with the VX2000 ? It didn't look all that spectacular but it sure did the job. I bet with a more skilled helmer behind the lens this film would have looked great!

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What about November and the DVX100 ?

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Let's not blame RED nor any other camera for that matter for your inability to find motivation and success. Something tells me if we gave you an Arri 535 you'd still complain
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Perfect examples John. Each of these movies, while not perfect, did what they set out to do perfectly. It's been said before, but it's not the gear you use. I think most people, including myself keep thinking that some technology is going to come along and free our creativity, but I'm afraid that's not how it works.
 
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