EVA1: Zacuto Recoil Rig VS...?

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filmguy123

Veteran
What makes the EVA1 Zacuto Recoil Rig worth it over competition?

I like how it balances over the shoulder to carry the weight, with the grip arm extended downwards. I know rig accessories are expensive to begin with, but the for the metals and seeminly common design involved here, is the Recoil Rig w/VCT pro baseplate for the EVA1 really worth it @ $1200+?

I *do* want to be able to relocate the EVA1 grip on the arm like the Zacuto allows for - might there be another equal quality option for significantly cheaper?

If not, I will order the Recoil Rig.
 
I have tried on the past to find alternatives to Zacuto but I stopped after always coming back to it. The build is solid everything that locks stays locked nothing ever gets loose even after years of use.

QUOTE=filmguy123;1986737199]What makes the EVA1 Zacuto Recoil Rig worth it over competition?

I like how it balances over the shoulder to carry the weight, with the grip arm extended downwards. I know rig accessories are expensive to begin with, but the for the metals and seeminly common design involved here, is the Recoil Rig w/VCT pro baseplate for the EVA1 really worth it @ $1200+?

I *do* want to be able to relocate the EVA1 grip on the arm like the Zacuto allows for - might there be another equal quality option for significantly cheaper?

If not, I will order the Recoil Rig.[/QUOTE]
 
Zacuto makes a nice rig as does Arri, Vocas, Shape and several others. For low cost there's Small Rig and Tilta, but I don't know about teir quality or flexibility. I think the Arri kit is the most elegant but it's sure to be the most expensive as well.

For relocating the handgrip, Arri, Vocas, Wooden Camera and I think Shape all offer adapter pieces that will allow the handgrip to attach to an Arri rosette. This could easily be a mount on the frontrods, an arm off the baseplate or elsewhere. I personally would go for the dogbone on the frontrods, but that's just my personal comfort point.
 
if you are getting the zacuto evf I would get the zacuto battery:

https://store.zacuto.com/gripper-75w-battery-gr-75/

On a rig you will find it useful to distribute weight for balance, it will power your evf and accessories all day.



filmguy123 said:
What makes the EVA1 Zacuto Recoil Rig worth it over competition?

I like how it balances over the shoulder to carry the weight, with the grip arm extended downwards. I know rig accessories are expensive to begin with, but the for the metals and seeminly common design involved here, is the Recoil Rig w/VCT pro baseplate for the EVA1 really worth it @ $1200+?

I *do* want to be able to relocate the EVA1 grip on the arm like the Zacuto allows for - might there be another equal quality option for significantly cheaper?

If not, I will order the Recoil Rig.
Click to expand...
 
Thank you Icarus. That is a compelling reason!

I was considering the Z-Finder bundle (no power or extra weight required). Though maybe with heavy Milvus glass in front the battery in back would be a boon?

None of the alts seem much cheaper than Zacuto...

Arri is way high.

Mitch, would you recommend any particular brand preference over Zacuto (barring Arri)?
 
this how I am set up: the battery slides back and forth balancing out a heavier lens or FF or Mattebox. The great thing about this setup is that when you switch camera s down the road nothing needs to change about how you work with it it just land in the middle you side the battery back balance and go.


filmguy123 said:
Thank you Icarus. That is a compelling reason!

I was considering the Z-Finder bundle (no power or extra weight required). Though maybe with heavy Milvus glass in front the battery in back would be a boon?

None of the alts seem much cheaper than Zacuto...

Arri is way high.

Mitch, would you recommend any particular brand preference over Zacuto (barring Arri)?
Click to expand...
 

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I have a modified Recoil Rig for my C200. FWIW, I think the VCT Pro Baseplate is the best one on the market, the range of adjustability, the comfort of the gel filled foam shoulder pad is excellent. I had a couple of the Zacuto handgrip relocators for the C100/300 and bought the Wooden version too and I thought the Wooden was beefier and built better than the Zacuto relocators. My tip would be don't be afraid to mix and match, you don't have to buy ALL Zacuto pieces. Rods, the cheap Small Rig or other Chinese rods work just as well as the more expensive Zacuto rods although they don't look as nice. I bought the same Wooden Camera V-Mount plate that icarus shows on his FS-7 above. For a handle, I use the Tilta skeleton arm with the Arri rosette for my C200 handgrip with the Shape grip relocator cable, it's much beefier and more heavy duty than the Zacuto arms IMHO. I also use the Wooden dual Arri rosette attachment over the one located on the right side of the VCT Pro baseplate as I feel the one on the VCT plate is too far back for my taste, I prefer the handgrip far forward. Also, for top plates, rods and connectors, I have been impressed with the Small Rig stuff, it's really good for the money.

On a related subject, after assembling all of these cool pieces to shoot with my camera shoulder mounted, I have found that it makes a once small and light camera into a long, bulky and heavy beast, I have also been shooting a lot of my latest documentary with a stripped down C200, cradled, much better for shooting in cars, trying to stay low key and unobtrusive. Not saying that you shouldn't build up your rig for shoulder mounted shooting, just that the EVA 1 is a small, and light camera, very handy for shooting handheld/cradled and by hanging all of this crap off of it, you are turning the camera into something completely different. Perfect for narrative or corporate where size and weight are not a factor but I shoot documentaries and BTS footage where having something small and unobtrusive can be a big advantage. YMMV.
 
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I agree about mixing in components from different makers I use a berkeysystems top plate CF rods from different manufacturers and handles from ergocine. With shoulder rigs balance is more important than weight. Your hand want to be a certain distance away from your body to a void cramping. You can easily quick release the camera from the rig for small footprint work where btw it’s smart to have a dedicated battery for the accessories on the rig and a small battery for the camera itself.

puredrifting said:
I have a modified Recoil Rig for my C200. FWIW, I think the VCT Pro Baseplate is the best on one the market, the range of adjustability, the comfort of the gel filled foam shoulder pad is excellent. I had a couple of the Zacuto handgrip relocators for the C100/300 and bought the Wooden version too and I thought the Wooden was beefier and built better than the Zacuto relocators. My tip would be don't be afraid to mix and match, you don't have to buy ALL Zacuto pieces. Rods, the cheap Small Rig or other Chinese rods work just as well as the more expensive Zacuto rods although they don't look as nice. I bought the same Wooden Camera V-Mount plate that icarus shows on his FS-7 above. For a handle, I use the Tilta skeleton arm with the Arri rosette for my C200 handgrip with the Shape grip relocator cable, it's much beefier and more heavy duty than the Zacuto arms IMHO. I also use the Wooden dual Arri rosette attachment over the one located on the right side of the VCT Pro baseplate as I feel the one on the VCT plate is too far back for my taste, I prefer the handgrip far forward. Also, for top plates, rods and connectors, I have been impressed with the Small Rig stuff, it's reallt good for the money.

On a related subject, after assembling all of these cool pieces to shoot with my camera shoulder mounted, I have found that it makes a once small and light camera into a long, bulky and heavy beast, I have also been shooting a lot of my latest documentary with a stripped down C200, cradled, much better for shooting in cars, trying to stay low key and unobtrusive. Not saying that you shouldn't build up your rig for shoulder moutned shooting, just that the EVA 1 is a small, and light camera, very handy for shooting handheld/cradled and by hanging all of this crap off of it, you are turning the camera into something completely different. Perfect for narrative or corporate where size and weight are not a factor but I shoot documentaries and BTS footage where having something small and unobtrusive can be a big advantage. YMMV.
Click to expand...
 
Thank you for the help! If you were to mix and match a dream kit from BH which parts specifically would you recommend? I’m a little overwhelmed with this list not having assembled before, so a few links to the proper combo would be most helpful.

VCT or VCT pro baseplate from Zacuto? Which arm and relocator attachment? Etc.

Also, is it worth getting the more robust arm if I am aiming to keep the rig light? My ideal is to have it QRed to the shoulder rig and then swap it off for cradling, chestpod mount, dual grip mount, etc
 
I would get the Zacuto vct pro

this:
https://www.woodencamera.com/panasonic-eva1-handgrip-relocator-arri-rosette-p/257000.htm

this to attach to rods:

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1100235-REG/lanparte_arl_01t_d_double_15mm_rod_clamp.html

And then stop. See how that works and then you will know what to add.

what are you doing for view finder again?

filmguy123 said:
Thank you for the help! If you were to mix and match a dream kit from BH which parts specifically would you recommend? I’m a little overwhelmed with this list not having assembled before, so a few links to the proper combo would be most helpful.

VCT or VCT pro baseplate from Zacuto? Which arm and relocator attachment? Etc.

Also, is it worth getting the more robust arm if I am aiming to keep the rig light? My ideal is to have it QRed to the shoulder rig and then swap it off for cradling, chestpod mount, dual grip mount, etc
Click to expand...
 
I would also recommend SmallRig VCT plate. I haven't used it for the EVA1, but I know a couple of DPs who use them for their Sony FS7's and it appears to be well built and well designed. It seems like they may have copied the Zacuto VCT baseplate design in offering more space to work with at the front (see "Accessory Capable Area" diagram: http://www.zacuto.com/vct-baseplate). And like the Zacuto, it allows for the top plate to travel fairly far to get the right balance. Also, Zacuto uses it's own proprietary top plate, while SmallRig uses a Long Manfrotto plate, which is a much less expensive system to use, should you want/need to outfit other sticks, monopods, etc. with a QR baseplate. The one caveat about the SmallRig, as I recall, is that it is very particular about what exact type of VCT plate that it works with ("...is compatible with Sony VCT-14, NOT compatible with Sony VCT-U14 and Wooden Camera VCT-14," per SmallRig website).

http://www.smallrig.com/smallrig-vct-14-shoulder-plate-1954.html


With respect to the Wooden Camera handgrip relocator/rosette mount, I just found that Vocas has one for about $50 less (although it doesn't come with the $10 LANC cable, lol). It looks like they had one available early on that appears similar to the Wooden Camera model, but for whatever reason they redesigned it. I'm not sure if it is even available here in the US yet, but it's worth checking out. I'm curious to hear from anyone who has used it, myself.

Old version: http://www.vocas.com/accessories/handgrip-rosette-adapter-for-panasonic-au-eva1

New version: http://www.vocas.com/accessories/handgrip-bayonet-rosette-adapter-for-panasonic-au-eva1-1
 
Seanik said:
With respect to the Wooden Camera handgrip relocator/rosette mount, I just found that Vocas has one for about $50 less (although it doesn't come with the $10 LANC cable, lol). It looks like they had one available early on that appears similar to the Wooden Camera model, but for whatever reason they redesigned it. I'm not sure if it is even available here in the US yet, but it's worth checking out. I'm curious to hear from anyone who has used it, myself.

Old version: http://www.vocas.com/accessories/handgrip-rosette-adapter-for-panasonic-au-eva1

New version: http://www.vocas.com/accessories/handgrip-bayonet-rosette-adapter-for-panasonic-au-eva1-1
Click to expand...
The old design required dismantling the Panasonic handgrip, which we're not into, so we asked Vocas to change the design. The new design requires no alteration of the handgrip, same as the Wooden Camera, ARRI, Tilta, and others require no alteration.
 
Zacuto gear is top notch. One of the beauties with their system is that with a handful of common parts you can rig just about any camera, this can future-proof your investment should you move on to a different camera in the future. A company that I work with has the Recoil Rig for the Sony FS7 and that shoulder pad is very comfortable even after hours of use. If you haven't seen it already, here's a video that Zacuto put out a few years ago, "Rigging with Rodney Charters, ASC" demonstrating the use of a few Zacuto components with several different cameras:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i2DVysnCFjs
 
FWIW to you, here is my Zacuto-based mutant system...

Zacuto VCT 14 Camera Plate
Zacuto VCT Pro. Definitely get the Pro, the non Pro version is a PITA to move the camera to level with lens changes
Zacuto 15mm rods in front
Wooden Camera Dual Arri Rosette to 15mm rods adapter
Tilta Skeleton Arri Rosette 6.5" extension arm mounted on right side. Left (operator side of rosette is open, I occasionally throw an Arri Rosette handle on that side, if I feel I need it
SmallRig 15mm rods in the rear
Wooden Camera V-Mount Baseplate
Shape Canon C200 Handgrip coiled extension
ULCS Arm to hold Zacuto EVF Pro
Zacuto EVF Pro

Since these images were taken, I added a 1/4" 20 ULCS ball head to that extension arm, screwed into the 1/4" 20 on the C200 handle where the stock monitor arm fits and am using the stock Canon touchscreen out where the rear of the Canon LP-E6N battery is in this picture. I like the touch screen but the stock Canon arm is a lousy design, it's creaky, fidgety and just doesn't work well. I use a Hoodman H400 sun hood and boost the luminance setting up and it's pretty usable as an LCD/EVF, unless there is sunlight directly hitting it. I repeat my position that rigging your camera in this way turns it into a bulky, long, heavy, unwieldy beast, not low key, not small and not light. If I am shooting BTS on a feature or TV show and going handheld for ten hours a day, this is a great setup. For low key documentary shooting, in cars, on small boats, and trying to keep talent calm and grounded, the C200 with just a battery, handgrip, a wireless mic and the 17-55 2.8 IS has been working great lately.

CanonC200ZacutoMutant2.jpg

CanonC200ZacutoMutant.jpg
 
I use the Zacuto VCT Baseplate....not pro, but easily solved the issue of fore and aft movement for lens sizes and balancing with a long Manfrotto quick release plate that added added a bit more height I wanted for a follow focus...$69...today I would instead buy the Small Rig VCT plate at under $200....I find their stuff well made, for an excellent price...for example I use an EVF bracket with Nato rail mount for my EVF and a similar bracket with Nato rail for my Atomos Shogun...never another magic arm shall touch my rigs!!...I would also go with a more solid grip extender then the Zacuto...the Wooden extender that Puredrifting has is a much better choice IMO...and lastly +1 on mixing and matching....you can save the money of a nice lens by not just opting for the Recoil at 1200 or whatever it goes for....
 
Thank you all! This is helping me wrap my head around the parts here, having not owned one. A bit like legos for adults.

Which wooden extender then? And that comes with the proper rosette mounts to attach it to either Zacuto or smallrig VCT plates?

I have the $1500 recoil rig with z finder rig on back order which is set to arrive and ship on Tuesday via B&H, so up until that time, I can make any changes to which parts I decide on. Without a store with this stuff, I’m flying blind except for the input here.
 
On the other hand time is money just buy it as is you can't really go wrong later find out that if you spent a couple of weeks on the problem you could have saved $350...
 
True Icarus! I may do that and if I want to add or upgrade a part later I can.

Thoughts on the Zacuto z drive + tornado? Might pair nice with my Milvus lenses for extra stability, and their Long throw focus?

But I read some old posts here that seemed to indicate it was heavy, plus made the camera hard to set down (doesn’t fold up like the extension arm I assume?

Thoughts on that vs the Edelkrone Focus One?
 
Over the years I bought tried and sold at least half a dozen FF systems.
Until 3 years ago I decided to spend some money on one:
ARRI Mini Follow Focus MFF-2
And that was the end of it.

filmguy123 said:
True Icarus! I may do that and if I want to add or upgrade a part later I can.

Thoughts on the Zacuto z drive + tornado? Might pair nice with my Milvus lenses for extra stability, and their Long throw focus?

But I read some old posts here that seemed to indicate it was heavy, plus made the camera hard to set down (doesn’t fold up like the extension arm I assume?

Thoughts on that vs the Edelkrone Focus One?
Click to expand...
 
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