Worth selling my HMC for the new NXCAM?

The PH mode of Pannas AVCCAM is so well done IMO- the higher encoding at 1080 never show up to my eye when comparing it to the same shot at 720. But to be fair, this was the same with color.

I will agree that at the end of the day, when the average viewer sits 10-15 feet away from a TV, this pixel peeping between the 150's 720 vs 1080 makes no real difference.
 
All these companies make me wonder what the heck they are thinking on occasion. The HMC70, without even a focus ring, as a "professional" camcorder??? Okey-dokey. The JVC JY-HD10U was pretty slick for it's time, but taking the HD1U, spit shining it, and selling that as a pro camcorder struck me as a bit cynical too.
 
Robert M Wright said:
All these companies make me wonder what the heck they are thinking on occasion. The HMC70, without even a focus ring, as a "professional" camcorder??? Okey-dokey. The JVC JY-HD10U was pretty slick for it's time, but taking the HD1U, spit shining it, and selling that as a pro camcorder struck me as a bit cynical too.
Click to expand...

Don't know about the JVC, but I'm sure people buying the HMC70 know what they are getting, after all, it is much cheaper than the HMC150. It's a cheap HD camcorder which is shoulder mounted and has XLR inputs, what's wrong with that? I wouldn't buy it, but some people might find it ideal for them.

If there's a market for that kind of camera why shouldn't panasonic make it?
 
Cranky said:
You also conveniently disregarded my comment on DV flavors.
Click to expand...

DVCPro is not DV. Neither is DVCam. Yes, they're based upon it, but they're not DV. I've never heard of a DV deck playing either format. It's also not an apples to apples comparison. DV isn't based on anything, it is it's own beast. AVCHD is based on h.264. So what you're asking for already exists in the form of AVC-Intra. Panasonic took the h.264 codec and created a high end, 4:2:2 version of it, much like they created a high end version of DV in DVCPro.
 
I was reading another thread started by someone experiencing audio problems. Reading that thread, it occurred to me that perhaps Panasonic has been planning from the get-go, to introduce an updated version of the HMC150, once there was some serious competition (for cams under $4k with solid state recording).

That could go a long way toward explaining the choices of going with a low resolution imaging block (partly), only one SDHC card slot, and no PCM audio.
 
If you stop and think about it for a bit, going with the low res chips both makes customers who don't want CMOS happy and probably didn't cost them many customers, with no competition at the HMC150's price point for solid state recording. Similarly, leaving out the second SDHC card slot and PCM audio probably didn't lose Panasonic many sales either (with the lack of competition for solid state recording - not to mention, HDV doesn't do PCM, so no better competition at all in that regard with HD cams under $4k).

This all leaves Panasonic in a pretty sweet position, where they can essentially easily assure that an updated version of the HMC150 will certainly have substantial new features, and fairly well assure maximizing turnover among current HMC150 owners, up-selling them to the successor cam - and do it without much of an R&D effort to speak of. I bet a new cam is out by this summer (if not sooner), so they can get that turnover as well as minimize losing market share to the new Sonys and presumably the new Canon (assuming that Canon prices their new cam in the same ballpark).
 
Mike Harvey said:
DVCPro is not DV. Neither is DVCam. Yes, they're based upon it, but they're not DV.
Click to expand...
What are these, VHS? These standards are based on the same codec, but minor differences. Even less differences when recorded into a file instead of tape.

Mike Harvey said:
I've never heard of a DV deck playing either format.
Click to expand...
A simple google search says that there are such decks, for example Sony DSR-1600A (Take any DV based format-recorded tape (DV, DVCPRO, and DVCAM), any tape size (including medium DVCPRO) and the DSR-1600A will play it back. (DV in SP mode only)) or DSR-2000A (The deck supports playback of all DV based formats including DVCPRO and DV recorded in both SP and LP) or PANASONIC AJ-SD930 (The SD930 not only records and plays back the DVCPRO 50 format but also will record an play back in the DVCPRO 25 format. Not only that but it will also playback either the DV or DVCAM format.) You can google for more. In any case, a question of deck compatibility is competely irrelevant in times of file-based recording. XDCAM records DV to PD, XDCAM EX records DV to SxS. Tapeless DVCPRO record it to P2. Sony's tapeless recorders write it to HDD or CF. Who cares about tapes and decks?

Mike Harvey said:
It's also not an apples to apples comparison. DV isn't based on anything, it is it's own beast. AVCHD is based on h.264. So what you're asking for already exists in the form of AVC-Intra. Panasonic took the h.264 codec and created a high end, 4:2:2 version of it, much like they created a high end version of DV in DVCPro.
Click to expand...
You are contradicting to yourself. AVC-Intra is based on AVC codec, yet Panasonic had no problems spawning it. Why should it? It is a valid AVC profile. Same with DV flavors. Same with HDV flavors. It is absolutely apples to apples. Sure, a new spec will not be called AVCHD anymore, fine. Panasonic will have a legitimate case for using AVCCAM moniker for a product that is actually different from mainstream AVCHD, and will have less inclination to cut features from consumer models.
 
Sewolla, I agree with you that the EX-1R is the only option if the upgrade is for resolution. And even then the difference is solid, but not earth shattering.

The only plus to the NXcam over the EX-1R is the cheap media (although now cheap media is officially supported in the EX1R), and 20X lens (although not as wide as the HMC-150).

Panasonic would probably update the HMC-150 (and all similar sensored cameras) sensor if there were a viable option that could be managed in 1/3". We don't see anything ground breaking from Canon or Sony, so I doubt Panasonic has any new tricks or advancements available either.

Some interesting news from Canon is here: http://www.usa.canon.com/templatedata/pressrelease/20100202_mpeg2_full_hd.html

MPG-2 in the new camera?




sewolla said:
Yeah, at this point it would seem the best upgrade would be an EX-1R, maybe the HPX300. Otherwise the other popular 1/3" cams will likely not have a big enough diff to make switching worthwhile.
Click to expand...
 
Last edited:
Robert, while you mention that 'someone complained of audio problems" i have no idea what you mean. I 've recorded excellent live audio with my 150. I have no complaints of the 150's audio quality.
 
Robert M Wright said:
This is the thread:

http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/showthread.php?t=198808

I don't know what actually caused their audio problem, but while reading that thread some thoughts came to mind, as to possibilities for why "little" things, like PCM audio and a second SDHC card slot, got left out in the design of the 150 - purely speculation on my part.
Click to expand...

The problem wasn't the HMC-150 at all. He was converting his footage to Cineform and did not have the proper AC3 codec installed for the audio. :thumbdown
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top