GH5 With raw coming to the bgh1 next week

If it had regular V-Log, usable AF, and was $1000 cheaper, I think more would definitely consider it.

But who's going to give up their Pocket 4K with a built-in screen, internal RAW and a copy of Resolve for $1295?

The Panasonic is mostly a specialty camera to be put in all kinds of non-traditional locations and left alone.
 
NorBro said:
If it had regular V-Log, usable AF, and was $1000 cheaper, I think more would definitely consider it.

The Panasonic is mostly a specialty camera to be put in all kinds of non-traditional locations and left alone.
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We use the BGH1 in a fairly normal way, but raw hasn't even entered the conversation for us.
Because we're using them primarily in a multicam studio situation we haven't been using V-Log L either.
I'm not sure why you would expect V-Log when the camera is basically a GH5s with a bunch of additional connectivity features, so it has V-Log L just as the GH5s does.
However the AF seems to be improved in the BGH1 over the GH5s (which I also have.)
Between the improved AF and the addition of real timecode and an SDI output, I've started to primarily use our third BGH1 on a Ronin-S
The cube design took a bit of getting used to, but we always have them connected to SmallHD 7" monitors, and our clients are happy with the results.
Definitely looking forward to trying out the improvements the new firmware will bring...
 
OnSet said:
I'm not sure why you would expect V-Log when the camera is basically a GH5s with a bunch of additional connectivity features, so it has V-Log L just as the GH5s does.
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So what does that mean? They can't put V-Log into a new camera three years later? (They make like 2 cameras every three years, ha.)

Breaking out of that kind of frame-of-mind is why firmware updates for cameras like the S1 happen.
 
NorBro said:
So what does that mean? They can't put V-Log into a new camera three years later? (They make like 2 cameras every three years, ha.)

Breaking out of that kind of frame-of-mind is why firmware updates for cameras like the S1 happen.
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My guess would be that they didn't think the small increase in dynamic range coming off the BGH1 sensor as opposed to the GH5s sensor required (or would benefit from) the increased dynamic range recording that V-Log provides. Remember, the S1 with its far larger sensor has more than an additional stop of DR as compared to the MFT cameras.
I think the market for the BGH1 is more aligned with people who already owned and liked the GH series cameras, probably also owned some MFT lenses, and wanted the advantages of multiple simultaneous outputs, timecode and genlock connectors, larger batteries (I share them with my EVA1), better remote capabilities and a compact, easily mountable form factor. It just seemed to make sense for our needs so we ordered two as soon as it came out, and after using them for a while we bought another one.
 
I suppose...but this product in general seems like it should have been released several years ago.
 
V-log L was designed for lower dynamic range sensors. Its designed in such a way to use the same Luts while two stops are missing at the top end of the curve.

I just don't think it is possible to add the full V-log to a lower stop camera.

Now with that said I wish Panasonic would abandon the concept of V-log L and just use a curve designed for the 12-13 stop sensors. Sony has S-Log, S-log2 and S-log3 and there is no reason to have a different variant for m43 cameras that use a different Panasonic lut.

I do find it a bit disappointing that Panasonic isn't providing the same raw update to the GH5S. That camera still is very expensive for what it is and I don't think sold very well at all. Panasonic could have breathed some life back into that camera and maybe sparked some new sales if it had the option for external raw. The sensor is perfect for it at 1:1 4k resolution. They could have thrown a bone to those that did invest in the camera. The bgh1 uses the same sensor. Maybe its a processing thing but I doubt it.

I can understand not adding raw to the GH5 since its a much older camera model now and it has a 5.2k sensor which means some funny crop business for raw making it much less desirable.

If I was in the market for a camera however I highly doubt a GH5S plus external recorder is going to appeal to a lot over a P4k for $1,300 which includes a full version of Resolve and does not need an external recorder.

Panasonic is going to have to do a lot to appeal to the film makers again. I'm not talking video production in general but film making. For corporate video and so forth I still think Panasonic has many advantages under its belt.
 
Maybe Panasonic will enable Raw output on the GH5S around the launch of the GH6? The purpose being to keep recent buyers of the still-expensive GH5S happy, should the GH6 be a compelling update (likely) or comparably priced (less likely).

As a GH5S owner, I do wish there was an elegant way to get around the V-Log L nonsense. I haven’t tested carefully, but I’m almost sure that doesn’t preserve the sensor’s full dynamic range and noise performance. By throwing away headroom in the 10-bit file, it becomes more like 9 bits of information.
 
Yeah the GH5S just seems like a waste of money when you can get a used S1 for not much more, which has the lovely IBIS. The S1 sensor is just a lot better. The HD on the GH5S and GH5 is a lot better than the S1/S1H, that's the only real advantage. I've seen used GH5's for $800 which is still a good value, wouldn't get one new though.

I do like the BGH1 body a lot and SDI's are a big plus. They need to take that design and put a S1 sensor inside. I guess the low rolling shutter on the BGH1 is appealing.
 
sgttom said:
Yeah the GH5S just seems like a waste of money when you can get a used S1 for not much more, which has the lovely IBIS. The S1 sensor is just a lot better. The HD on the GH5S and GH5 is a lot better than the S1/S1H, that's the only real advantage.
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sgttom said:
I guess the low rolling shutter on the BGH1 is appealing.
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But the GH5S has the same low rolling shutter as the BGH1 (~11 ms readout time). A lot better than most full-frame sensors except the α7S III (~8.5 ms). Even the new α1 that I thought would be a big leap forward does not seem to use its speed in video mode, for reasons I cannot guess. (Anyone understand that?) The α7S III remains top dog.

Meanwhile, cameras with shockingly bad rolling shutter, e.g. the Canon R6, sell well, so evidently a lot of people don’t care. I track moving subjects so do care. Hence the GH5S.
 
Samuel Dilworth said:
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But the GH5S has the same low rolling shutter as the BGH1 (~11 ms readout time). A lot better than most full-frame sensors except the α7S III (~8.5 ms). Even the new α1 that I thought would be a big leap forward does not seem to use its speed in video mode, for reasons I cannot guess. (Anyone understand that?) The α7S III remains top dog.

Meanwhile, cameras with shockingly bad rolling shutter, e.g. the Canon R6, sell well, so evidently a lot of people don’t care. I track moving subjects so do care. Hence the GH5S.
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I care to a point. When you get to the 30ms territory like the Canon R6 or A6 series Sony cameras it becomes noticeable for me. I haven't noticed it on the S1 yet which is around 20ms in FF 4k. It certainly is a selling point though and I envy the A7S3 sensor. I am debating getting a BGH1 as a B-cam if I see one for a decent price used. The form factor is top notch and the GH5S sensor is certainly good enough and stellar when it comes to RS.

I am kind of holding off to see if Pana puts out a GH6. I am hoping for something with 4k 120.
 
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