Wireless Monitor Solution for the FS700 / 7Q???

G

Gene Sung

Veteran
I saw this semi-DIY wireless monitoring solution on Nofilmschool.com using the Nyrius Aries Paralinx Arrow and I was wondering how to fit it to either my FS700 or 7Q. It’s very cheap @ around $300 for everything (including several batteries).

Article

http://nofilmschool.com/2014/02/cheapest-wireless-hdmi-video-monitoring-nyrius-aries-paralinx-arrow/

Product on Amazon

http://www.amazon.com/Nyrius-Transmitter-Streaming-Satellite-NPCS550/dp/B0092T3E3A/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1396538769&sr=8-1&keywords=nyrius+aries

My questions are:

1) Do you think this would work on the FS700 + 7Q combo?

2) Should I try to attach it to the HDMI connector on the back of the FS700 or on the HDMI port on the 7Q? Which would work better?

3) What your guy’s opinion of this solution?

Thanks
 
That is an amazing price. The next cheapest for me was a teradek clip, but to an ipad.

two different uses maybe. 7q on camera, iPad directors monitor with lut eventually applied to hdmi out.

if I wanted a reliable stream to record though or for a live event not on sticks, I'd need to fork out for a bolt receiver.

at the moment I'd go sdi pro one as it has an sdi loop.

the proper solution is two bolts, but pricer.

At the moment though hdmi will limit you to 30p input on the 7q unless anyone can get hdmi<>sdi cross conversion to work.

expecting an atomos connect tomorrow. I can report back here if it works.

so 1), don't see why not, you may be limited to 1080i if you have your 7q remote using the receiver.

2) if you are talking about the transmitter, from fs700 you get 1080p up to 50/60. From oddessy you are limited to 1080 30p but you may eventually get a nice output lut for a video village.

3) I tried a consumer grade hdmi on a previous music video shoot I was steadicaming when I didn't get enough notice to rent a bolt. Biggest issues was non reconnect at edges of range. Teradek and arrow (which yours claims to be like) probably have reconnect protocols (teradek do). So you can probably just check peoples reconnection experience with that setup. If you were on sticks and going to a monitor at a fixed distance. Probably fine. That article also mentions issues powering the receiver. Probably solveable . Again, if you have fixed power where you are receiving. No issue.

reallly liking it totally rigged though, on camera transmitter, 7q elsewhere with battery receiver and hdmi<>did recording and directors monitor, no reconnect issues for the price. But probably a dream, I think your mileage might vary, but it's the most likely one to succeed. If use it for shorts/testing and hire a bolt on paid gigs for $100pd

very interested to see how this pans out. I can tell you if I showed up to a shoot where I can hand the director/dp a wireless lut on/off to 7q and or big screen with 4k2hd Extreme kudos! Instant rehire every other gig (assuming all else is well).

There was a new 7q cage on another thread with sneak peak before nab. That with this..... Ooooooh :)
 
timmytimetravel said:
2) if you are talking about the transmitter, from fs700 you get 1080p up to 50/60. From oddessy you are limited to 1080 30p but you may eventually get a nice output lut for a video village.
Click to expand...

Dang. I was hoping the 7Q would be able to just transmit anything that's on the screen, including when in higher frame rate modes, obviously not in slow motion, just the real time image. I wonder if this will be addressed in a firmware update. Down on the priority of course, since there's way more important things for Mitch and crew to deal with.

Well, up to 60p from the camera should be fine for most cases.
 
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Will having a transmitter in the HDMI port on the FS700 have any conflicts with the 4K signal being sent over the 3G-SDI, if done simultaneously? Seems like a lot of info would be going out of the camera.
 
gene_can_sing said:
Will having a transmitter in the HDMI port on the FS700 have any conflicts with the 4K signal being sent over the 3G-SDI, if done simultaneously? Seems like a lot of info would be going out of the camera.
Click to expand...

should be fine. I regularly monitor from the camera HDMI port while feeding raw over the SDI.
 
If you want to record to the Odyssey7Q, then do not go wireless, especially if you want to use one of the RAW modes. Just not going to happen. If you wish to use the Odyssey7Q just for monitoring and record internally on the FS700 or a different external recorder, then this will work fine. Some of you may find this rig interesting for use with multiple cameras:

http://www.convergent-design.com/Su...bId/209/VideoId/24/Wireless-Multi-Stream.aspx


If you would like to place the transmitter on the Odyssey7Q to then feed the signal out to other monitors, then this will work just fine as the HDMI output is a standardized HD signal. I think that's what Gene was referring to.
 
Mitch Gross said:
If you would like to place the transmitter on the Odyssey7Q to then feed the signal out to other monitors, then this will work just fine as the HDMI output is a standardized HD signal. I think that's what Gene was referring to.
Click to expand...

Thanks Mitch for chiming in. Yes, only for transmitting purposes. Trying to get it straight from the horses mouth, so will the 7Q transmit whatever is on the 7Q screen? Meaning, frame rates from 24fps to even 240fps slow motion? Or will the 7Q only transmit up to 30fps as Timmy stated above?

Thanks!
 
Mitch, is it possible that some SDI transmitters will come out that can send the RAW signal to the 7Q wirelessly? Or is that unrealistic for the near future?

I have no experience with these wireless solutions, so I don't know what their actual transmission rate is compared to 3G-SDI. I assume they do their own compression/decompression?
 
gene_can_sing said:
Thanks Mitch for chiming in. Yes, only for transmitting purposes. Trying to get it straight from the horses mouth, so will the 7Q transmit whatever is on the 7Q screen? Meaning, frame rates from 24fps to even 240fps slow motion? Or will the 7Q only transmit up to 30fps as Timmy stated above?

Thanks!
Click to expand...
Well, what you see on the screen is what you see on the screen, but it isn't 240fps. It's not refreshing at some crazy rate, it's showing you the image in realtime but as a video standard, and that means 30p. The other frames are dropped for monitoring, but they are recorded. Think about it, if you run a video cable from the Odyssey output to another monitor then what is carried on it? It has to be a video standard that the monitor can accept and read. So that's 1080p/30. In the case of a video transmitter it's exactly the same thing, you're just replacing a wire with a wireless connection.
 
jshbckr said:
Mitch, is it possible that some SDI transmitters will come out that can send the RAW signal to the 7Q wirelessly? Or is that unrealistic for the near future?

I have no experience with these wireless solutions, so I don't know what their actual transmission rate is compared to 3G-SDI. I assume they do their own compression/decompression?
Click to expand...
It's a stunning bad idea to attempt. You just do not want to go wireless with what you capture; wireless should be for monitoring, not recording.

That said it is also currently impossible. The signal carrier is SDI, but the signal looks nothing like video over SDI. The video transmitters are looking for a particular structure that is a video format, and the RAW data really doesn't look like that. So they will simply not function. You'd be better off using Gigabit Ethernet, and there are precious few devices that can really properly keep up and saturate that pipe properly.

We have Gig-E on the new Athena to push 4K data around. But I wouldn't plan on doing it wirelessly. Google is only just beginning to build Gig-E networks. It's a huge pipe.
 
Mitch, Does that mean in terms of the 7q being first in the chain for recording of say a 60p sdi signal, the next thing in the chain is 30p? Athena the same? Cheers
 
I will chime in with wireless monitoring I'd either go Paralinx or Teradek. At the end of the day the bolt is my favorite. I've found it the most reliable.

For wireless recording.... do not do it. I cannot stress that enough. The people I have seen try it have always had an issue where they looked bad in front of a client because they went too far or there was interference. They ended up using cables. I cannot stress enough to do that.
 
The only reason im interested in wireless monitoring is when using wireless follow focus.. maybe when the lenzhound is getting launched :)
 
timmytimetravel said:
Mitch, Does that mean in terms of the 7q being first in the chain for recording of say a 60p sdi signal, the next thing in the chain is 30p? Athena the same? Cheers
Click to expand...
I don't think I said this clearly.

You can set the playback rate ofthe Odyssey, by choosing the Project Framerate. This is under
[*]-->[RECORD]-->[PROJECT]-->[FRAME RATE].

You can choose to follow the speed of whatever is coming in, or set a different frame rate for the project.

These are the frame rates at which the material will play back on the Odyssey7Q.

Set the project frame rate to 23.98 and shoot 59.97, and the material will take 2.5 times longer than realtime to play back. You can see that 60p is an option for the playback speed.

You are not trapped by this. Every frame is always recorded, it is simply a question as to what speed you will view them. And this can always be changed in post.
 
Ah. Thanks Mitch. I missed it as for fs700 it only seems to be a dpx setting. On 4:2:2 >prores hd and 4k2hd and fs700 raw it only shows up as follow input.

So for 200fps raw, when you play it back its playing on the 7q as 100? 200fps?
Is it output over sdi as ?
Is it output live (eg if you had a bigger monitor downstream)?

I'm presuming for raw, unless something downstream could recognise the raw anyway (unless like someone else was using the 7q as a backup copy of a R5 recorder), its a moot point. Once we have some HFR in other modes though, what will be our sdi framerate limitation for output.....?

When you are recording 60p on sdi say as 4:2:2 prores hd, is it output downstream live on sdi as 60p? 30p?.

And at this stage you can have it follow input, but not change say 60p to 30p in 4:2:2 prores straight if your downstream monitor (like one I was using the other day, only took 30p or 60i not 60p.

I'm guessing playback over hdmi (to say a big wall plasma) is also limited to 30p on 7q but maybe 60p on the Athena? (hdmi 2)

Does it also follow that playback rate setting upto a value of 30p?

Cheers
 
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