HPX250: Why still no access to audio 3 and 4???

ksteiger

ksteiger

Well-known member
What is the point of having 4 channels of audio if you are confined to using only the horrible on camera mics for 3 qnd 4 when using ext 1 and 2? And to make matters worse there is no level control. I never understood the point of giving you 4 channels when only 2 are ever truly useable. When the cameras mics are thrown to 3 and 4 the distortion is just unbearable. Maybe it is because of my audio background but GOOD GOD this is a frustration. The pre amps are there... Could you just find the space for 2 more XLR's Panasonic?? Hell I'd settle for RCA's if I could get into them...
In a pro setting it is not unusual to have several wireless and sometimes 2 booms. Just sayin'
 
The only 4-XLR camera I can think of is the HPX500.

The HPX250 allows four channels, two from XLRs and two from the internal mic. You have manual level control over two channels, and a fixed level control over the other two. This is the same as it was on the HVX200 and HPX170, but the HPX250 does take it a couple of steps further by allowing fully automatic level control on any of the channels, and also individual limiter control over each of the channels.

I can't think of any handheld model, anywhere, that has four XLRs... and very few handhelds offer four channels at all in any capacity. The HPX250 at least offers four channels, and does have some provision for finally controlling channels 3 & 4 a little bit; previously they were only ever brought in at a fixed level and with no limiter control.
 
I got spoiled years ago when the old XL1 would give you inputs to all 4 tracks, albeit in 12 bit. I would settle for -10 RCA inputs but I think it would be a nice
addition to this form factor of camera. I appreciate your comments, but manufacturers have a way of saying "No one else does this at this level" My point is that it
is a feature that is as important as any optical/codec, etc. issue (to me anyway) and would require very little extra cost. Just my two cents anyway. I guess my other point is that
the more expensive cameras have this capability, but guys like me on a budget are more likely to use in camera audio, as opposed to separate sync audio, Diva etc. I'm not complaining as much
as asking for this for the next iteration. And I will take the RCA connectors, lol.
 
Too bad you couldn't design a module that would replace the internal mics with 2 more XLR inputs, the space is there if you don't need the built it mics. Even replacing the XLRs with two 5-pins would work. I would love a high quality stereo shotgun camera mounted AND have a mixer feed into the camera at the same time.
 
The HPX370 has three XLR inputs. Shotgun input is in the front. I think there's enough room on the 250 to have squeezed one more XLR in. Then the fourth channel could be relegated to the internal mic. I think that would have been the way to go. Also, like the 370, it would have been nice to be able to switch which mic inputs went on what channels. I'd rather have my wireless mic being recorded on two channels instead of the internal mic being recorded on two channels.
 
With the 250 is it possible to record to a shotgun, a lav and to the internal mic at the same time? A Panasonic rep said that this couldn't be done, but I don't understand why.

The rep did say that you could record each xlr on two channels set to different sensitivities. I could see this being useful especially for docs. For instance, in a situation like a sports game if you were trying to record someone talking the audio would likely end up peaking and blowing out whenever there was loud cheering. In this situation it could be nice to set the levels on the shotgun and lav for dialogue on two of the channels and then record at a lower sensitivity on the other two channels so that cheering crowds wouldn't totally blow out your audio. Is this in fact a possibility? If so, I'd be curious to know how to set this up.
 
No, I don't believe that's true. CH1 Can be internal mic, input 1 or 2, CH2 can be internal mic or input 2 and CH3 and 4 are internal mic. So if you have your LAV on INPUT 2 you could record it to channel 1 and 2 at different levels or sensitivities and use the internal mic on CH 3 and 4 for ambient noise. But you would lose your shotgun mic. Now what you want to do is possible on the HPX370. There you can route any input to any of the four audio channels.
 
I was under the impression that channel 3/4 are always recorded and separate from Channels 1/2. I always record channel 1 using an external shotgun and channel 2 potted down. Or I'm using both 1/2 with a outboard mixer. So is it possible to have, say my shotgun on ch1, a lav on ch2, plus have the internal mic record ambient on ch 3/4? I wish I had my camera on me when these questions come up.Before I bought my camera the panny rep at work said it could be done, it's just that the internal mics would be recorded with auto gain enabled. And you can do whatever with the XLRsThis is confusing
 
All four channels are recorded separately. Yes, you can have a shotgun on 1, and a lav on 2 and record internal mic to 3 and 4. I do this all the time.
 
Davoosie said:
Too bad you couldn't design a module that would replace the internal mics with 2 more XLR inputs
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Someone actually did this way back in the day on an HVX200; they dismantled the internal microphone and rewired it to create two more XLR inputs. It was a one-off do-it-yourself project, and there was basically no demand for it, but it did seem like an interesting thing to do.

Even replacing the XLRs with two 5-pins would work.
Click to expand...
If the 5-pin and 3-pin XLR ports were compatible with each other, that would have been an excellent solution, but I certainly wouldn't give up 3-pin compatibility for it.

Now, what if they were to use combo XLR/TRS jacks? That might be an idea... could take 3-pin XLRs, but for stereo it could take a tip/ring/sleeve 1/4" jack... not ideal, but could be a way to get a shotgun or lav on one port and a stereo mixer feed on the other, or you could make a breakout box from the TRS to two 3-pin XLRs maybe...
220px-XLR-phone_jack_combo_connector.jpg
 
Barry_Green said:
Hey, me too... what if the RCA audio outputs could be turned into inputs for channels 3 & 4? That'd be much more usable than having 3 & 4 wasted to being only the internal mic...
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They would probably replace the two rca jacks with two mini jacks one stereo in and the other stereo out.
 
Replacing the on board mic with 2 XLRs would be an interesting project, and probably well worth the time. But I'm not to keen on popping open a $5000 camera and start poking around, especially without a schematic, or repair manual. But if someone made a kit I would most likely look into it.

Maybe a better option would be to remove the two RCA outs, which I will never use anyway, and maybe add 2 mini XLR's (Kind on the Red) hard wired to the front mic inputs. And while I'm at it take that pesky RCA video out and add a proper BNC connector, Hummmmm
 
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I thought way back when I read somewhere about some camera or piece of equipment using the 3/4 tracks to allow dubbing in of audio over top of an existing recording without disturbing the other tracks? I may be misremembering that, but it was the first thing that came to mind when I saw the question about the other tracks.

I don't think I've ever used the 4-channel mode of DV/HDV, preferring the higher quality of the 2-channel mode.
 
fde101 said:
I thought way back when I read somewhere about some camera or piece of equipment using the 3/4 tracks to allow dubbing in of audio over top of an existing recording without disturbing the other tracks?
Click to expand...
That was possible back in the DV tape days; DV had a 4-channel 12-bit mode and you could re-record onto the tape using just the audio to dub in channels 3 & 4.
 
Barry thanks for your feedback on this topic. I could certainly make do with RCA inputs for 3 and 4. Admittedly I am a bit fussy because of my background as an audio guy for
25 years before I got heavily into video. Cheers!!
 
Yes, well, we can hope... but some of us have been hoping for this for a long time (since the original HVX, anyway). Still, the 4-channel recording as is is better than 2 channel, and on at least two occasions has proved very useful... but yes, the ability to switch the RCA outs into additional inputs would be great! Combo jacks... I'd say NO! Hooking up four mics could get very complicated. Having the built-in mic be removable, and, say, replaceable with an extra-cost input module would be the way to go, I'd say. Borrow the tech from the HMC40's optional XLRs?
 
Yes lets follow this. I am also very much in favour of an option to use channels 3+4 for external input, even if its just a fixed -10db line input on the cinch sockets. Lets hope somebody comes up with a sensible solution.
 
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