Why is ZOOM so popular when it is such poor quality?

I have the tascam dr-40 and zoom h4n. the dr-40's preamps are much much noisier than the zoom h4n. The tascam seems better built, has a better interface, and just seems more professional, but the preamps are a joke. The zooms are not much better, but produce a much 'smoother' noise.
 
Kind of a noob question here, but in my limited experience doing dual setup with the zoom and 5d, the biggest issue BY FAR was the high noise floor. So what I'm hearing here is that by running my mic to a good mixer and then running the mixer to the zoom, I can reduce that noise floor substantially?
 
So what I'm hearing here is that by running my mic to a good mixer and then running the mixer to the zoom, I can reduce that noise floor substantially?
Click to expand...

Using a mixer would most likely lower the noise floor, though they are much more expensive. It's also just a part of the truth, since it also depends on the noise floor and sensitivity of the mic (with low sensitivity, meaning the mic puts out a low signal, it needs to be amplified more than a mic with high sensitivity, which in turn heightens preamp noise). You might also not be putting the mic in an optimum position, which increases the noise relative to the desired signal.
 
Jema said:
Using a mixer would most likely lower the noise floor, though they are much more expensive. It's also just a part of the truth, since it also depends on the noise floor and sensitivity of the mic (with low sensitivity, meaning the mic puts out a low signal, it needs to be amplified more than a mic with high sensitivity, which in turn heightens preamp noise). You might also not be putting the mic in an optimum position, which increases the noise relative to the desired signal.
Click to expand...
how to check if the mic has high or low sensitivity..
does the spec of mic mention it??
 
These are all cheap recorders of a quality unatainable till recent years with out spending $$$$$. The pre amps are not the greatest but compared to what? A few years ago you would have been recording on Cassette, talk about noise floor! A few less years back you probably would be using one of the cheap ($800+) DAT decks with iffy preamps, mini plug inputs, no phantom and topping out at 48/16. Or may be you went for the ~~$300 range MiniDisk so you toped out at 44.1/16 in a compressed format.

So now for less than a quarter of the price of a cheap DAT your recording on a box that uses very cheap (and reusable) media tops out at 96/24 has XLR ins with Phantom power and a lower noise floor than DAT. And the problem is???

IF you can't get decent recordings with any of the micro recorders (that can use a standard mic) then it's time to look at how your using it. They are all capable of recordings that recordists with $30K of recorder twenty years ago would kill for.

Learn how to set up a good gain structure, learn where to place the mic, get in close. Better equipment doesn't give you quality recordings, it just gives you the chance to get quality recordings.

And don't be fooled by noisy headphone amps. Most of these recorders headphone amps are noisy and underpowered, that was also true for the cheap DAT recorders.
 
"And don't be fooled by noisy headphone amps."

Very true. Same issue with camcorder headphone circuits..even on pretty expensive models. And let's not forget software tools to reduce simple hiss are pretty capable these days.
 
if you have the words "I can fix that later in post" in your head, that should be a sign that something is wrong and you should not roll audio unless you absolutely have to. I get so much bad audio in my place, followed by the words "just put in that plug-in that gets the noise out of it"

hiss is not always easy to remove.
 
Well.. my experience with the Zoom has not left me so dissatisfied as some here so I'm not sure what mics or placement are being used or how much noise they are talking about. I'm not suggesting being reckless during production, assuming everything can be fixed in the mix. But my real world experience is that steady state preamp hiss is usually pretty easy to reduce with Sound Forge NR. I suspect other tools that can sample/remove steady state noise would perform similarly. It is important to reduce it before any dynamics processing is used. All this assuming the recording environment is quiet enough that preamp or mic self noise hiss is the primary offender.
 
how to check if the mic has high or low sensitivity..
does the spec of mic mention it??
Click to expand...
Yes it does.
On the following website, you can get some idea of the relationship between mic sensitivity and self noise, and preamp noise.
http://www.rane.com/note148.html

I also agree with what noiz says - you can get decent results with low-cost equipment, as long as you learn how it should be done. Higher end equipment cuts some corners and are much more reliable, but the best sound comes from good mic placement (assuming you're using a decent mic) and minimizing disturbances from the surroundings.
 
Always good to blame someone else than take responsibility for one's own decision! :)

I used a Zoom H4N solidly until I got annoyed with it and bought the Tascam. I now use the Roland R26.
 
This is the answer

This is the answer

One blindly follows another.
 

Attachments

  • wpa0649l.jpg
    wpa0649l.jpg
    34.1 KB · Views: 0
Phillip,
Considering the R26 seems modeled after the H4N, what do you see as the main differences/benefits of the Roland?
 
I'm not sure it's "poor quality" - it may be a matter of taste, my personal issue with it and the reason I ditched mine in favor of a Fostex FR2LE was due to its pre-amps sounding very thin comparatively. The link to the Wingfield audio site with the test clips is very good for making these comparisons and confirmed my in the field results. The H4N is certainly not a "bad recorder," it's really quite good for $250-300 although I think there are now a few better options in this price range (assuming you don't need 4 channel recording.)
 
Without reading the whole thread I assume the correct answer "price" has been given many times. The H4N does a decent job for a consumer grade recorder and they sell them at best Buy (the other reason it's so popular).

You really have to spend about $1K to get anything that could even remotely be called "pro" grade.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top