F3: Why I Bought an F3

Hi Andrew,

I would love a B4 adapter for my F3, but that HDx35 is very expensive. I believe Sony are doing one themselves, but it could be for FZ mount. Your right, the PL mount makes it far more future proof. Another one that comes to mind is the MTF adapter http://www.mtfservices.com/index.php/b4-2-3-to-sony-f3-adaptor-package-detail

That Sony lens would be nice for me, but a big investment. I'd prefer a 18-85mm, if Sony ever did a second version. I still think it may be wise for me to get a used EX3 if I want a zoom lensed camera that looks similar to the F3.

Osslund said:
The F3 have a pretty bad form as is but it can be turned into something elegant and easy to use. Since I got the ET plates on my F3 it's very uncomplicated to use and next week I'll make it even more slimmed down. It's a pretty bad form as is but it can be turned into something elegant and easy to use.
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+1

My friend asked me the other day if the F3 will become a classic camera, I said yes, I think it will. What do you guys think? By classic I think he means like the PD150 or 170, which are still going for around a £1000 on eBay, and shot a indie films like Open Water, which still looks very good in my opinion, as does 28 Days Latter, which was done on the horrid, but much loved Canon XL1 s. I still think SD looks rather good, infact more realistic than HD, if that makes sense.
 
I've used the HD35 converter and it performs very well. The form factor makes the F3's already poor ergonomics even worse, but if you're off sticks it doesn't matter and the image is great. The stop loss not a big deal with the F3. I chose to buy the Sony zoom instead, and it's not bad optically. I find the stabilization degrades the image sufficiently so I no longer use it. The auto focus works great but it takes around 5 seconds to lock on, so it's of no use following a subject. The drop off in f stop as you zoom is hardly noticeable. With the lack of alternatives, the lens is really not a bad deal, and I believe Sony is doing OK with 5 and 55 owners buying some. I agree it is probably not a great investment, but then neither is the F3. I rarely use it now that I have filled out my prime set, but when you need a lens with good zoom range, it's nice to have.
 
JackCarter said:
My friend asked me the other day if the F3 will become a classic camera, I said yes, I think it will. What do you guys think? By classic I think he means like the PD150 or 170, which are still going for around a £1000 on eBay, and shot a indie films like Open Water, which still looks very good in my opinion, as does 28 Days Latter, which was done on the horrid, but much loved Canon XL1 s. I still think SD looks rather good, infact more realistic than HD, if that makes sense.
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+1
Armored F3 SLog = secret weapon
 
JackCarter said:
Will anybody really buy this? http://cvp.com/index.php?t=product/ib||2fe+optics_hdx35mk2

£4,698.00, I don't think so. You could buy a second camera for that.

Now this lens doesn't look as bad an investment after seeing the above. http://cvp.com/index.php?t=product/sony_scl-z18x140

Hey sparky, are you trying to be the next Philip Bloom? Did you really buy that adapter?
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Philip who?! No I didn't buy the adapter but think I might. VMI are actually sending me one to do a few more tests with which I am looking forward to. I only had the chance to use the one in the review for a couple of hours. I want to post the results of the full zoom range on the wide and zoom eng lenses, and see if there is less softening around the edges with one or another.
People mention that for the price you pay for the adapter etc, you could buy an EX1. This to me is a silly argument. Although the lens will be slower, you are still getting a much greater dynamic range to work with in SLOG and lovely skin tones from the F3's sensor - you just can't compare the two.
 
Sparky874 said:
Philip who?! No I didn't buy the adapter but think I might. VMI are actually sending me one to do a few more tests with which I am looking forward to. I only had the chance to use the one in the review for a couple of hours. I want to post the results of the full zoom range on the wide and zoom eng lenses, and see if there is less softening around the edges with one or another.
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Hi Sparky,

Philip Bloom is a legend, even though he's a Canon fan boy :beer:


Do you think you could test the MTF adapter? It's far more affordable. http://www.mtfservices.com/index.php...package-detail

Sparky874 said:
People mention that for the price you pay for the adapter etc, you could buy an EX1. This to me is a silly argument. Although the lens will be slower, you are still getting a much greater dynamic range to work with in SLOG and lovely skin tones from the F3's sensor - you just can't compare the two.
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I would have to disagree with you on this one, an EX1/3 is far more versatile for run and gun work, than an F3 with a lens that's not designed for it, with S-log. The F3 was designed for cinematic narrative work, which is what I use it for. Now I'm thinking about using my F3 for filming a wedding etc, but for what it cost's to turn it in to a run and gun type camera, a TV lens and an expensive B4 adapter, I think it's a bad idea. My second camera should be an EX3 to get those close-ups etc. The EX3's image is very similar to the F3's, only in Low light does the F3 kill it. How could I use S-log in a wedding situation? Set up a grey card next to the brides dress, and keep adjusting exposure during the event? Sorry, not for me, as much as I love how S-log makes whites look beautiful, I wouldn't risk it in a situation like that. For me S-log is for a cinematic narrative work, controlled lighting, or a harsh sunny day, for a take, not a long event.

Don't mean to sound harsh, I like these boards as people give me new ideas on kit etc, so keep your reviews coming. If your really going to spend nearly £5000 on an adapter, why not sell your TV lens and buy the Sony SCL-Z18X140? You know your going to get an F55 in a few years time anyway :)

All the best
 
Lol, Bloom is a legend?? He's a wedding video/photo guy who got famous on the internet within the camera nerd crowds for doing average work but talking about it non-stop. He is smart though because he now makes money off of people visiting his little website. Give me a break.

I agree, the F3 with the adapter is a horrible idea. Buy an EX or look into another career. The F3 doesn't work for run and gun, end of story.
 
I have an ex1 but am still interested in the adapter - too pricey for me but ininteresting.

it is a hard trade off but certainly I have jobs that are some running and gunning often followed by a few calmer set ups.

maybe I should take both cams or us the f3 and a zoom and then move to primes when the action slows or it gets dark.

With the Fs100 the horrid kit lens and some primes made for a versatile package that was man portable.

every thing is a trade off and navigating the correct trade off for each job is part of the art..
 
It would be so nice having the luxury of having both an F3 and a PMW-200. I'm surprised people use the Canon C100 for run and gun interviews. Tough to follow focus as a single man operator with a chip that big. Yeah, F3 with an Odyssey or Gemini is best used when you have a camera crew, AC's and maybe even a DIT. Then you can rock.
 
Shoots56 said:
Lol, Bloom is a legend?? He's a wedding video/photo guy who got famous on the internet within the camera nerd crowds for doing average work but talking about it non-stop. He is smart though because he now makes money off of people visiting his little website. Give me a break.
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I believe Phil was a cameraman for Sky News for about 17 years, then he got famous. I'd rather watch Bloom's reviews than any of the crap on the BBC, ITV etc. I mean, am I really interested in the staged life of some talentless celebrity? Or am I going to watch one of Bloom's camera reviews? The review of the FS700 was excellent, as are many others. At least Bloom is funny, and says it as it is, '' No peaking on a nine thousand pound camera?..... Come on Canon!'', from his review of the 1DC, or words to that effect. I've noticed a lot of the pro guys dislike him for some reason?

Shoots56 said:
I agree, the F3 with the adapter is a horrible idea. Buy an EX or look into another career. The F3 doesn't work for run and gun, end of story.
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Shoots56, what do you make of the Sony SCL-Z18X140? I can sense that your a Sony fan, but would like your thought on the lens. Besides, you say it as it is, haha.

Doctor Wu said:
It would be so nice having the luxury of having both an F3 and a PMW-200.
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Did you see Philip's review of the PMW200? http://philipbloom.net/2012/08/07/pmw200/

I like the look of this beast, http://www.sony.co.uk/pro/product/broadcast-products-camcorders-xdcam/pmw-300k1/ I wonder if I could use that EVF on the F3 also?

Morgan, I'd use your EX1 for all the run and gun stuff, and use the F3 for your shorts etc. Or use both, but carrying all that would be a nightmare without a second person. Your F3/5N short I saw was very well done, the one with the motorbike chase. Nothing beats prime lenses, I'm very happy with my CP.2's, but sometimes I get bored, and want to experiment. Recently I've been looking at SD cameras for some reason, and even one of these http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/531-vinta...ctronics_Video_Camcorders&hash=item19e59152a8

I really fancy playing with a tube camera, but could I get it to work? What would I record to? It would make a nice ornament anyway :grin:
 
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JackCarter said:
Morgan, I'd use your EX1 for all the run and gun stuff, and use the F3 for your shorts etc. Or use both, but carrying all that would be a nightmare without a second person. Your F3/5N short I saw was very well done, the one with the motorbike chase. Nothing beats prime lenses, I'm very happy with my CP.2's, but sometimes I get bored, and want to experiment. Recently I've been looking at SD cameras for some reason, and even one of these http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/531-vinta...ctronics_Video_Camcorders&hash=item19e59152a8

I really fancy playing with a tube camera, but could I get it to work? What would I record to? It would make a nice ornament anyway :grin:
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I'm a little the same way at the moment, I'm in love with the image CP.2s and the F3 in SLOG put out - it's crisp, cool and modern, it just looks slick and precise. Which is great for anything that needs to looks punchy and modern - but it's easy to get antsy wanting to shoot things that look warm, soft, imprecise and flawed instead - it's just hard to get clients to fork out extra so that I can shoot on Cookes or Anamorphics, on lenses that will offer different aesthetic qualities.

So I think the answer lies in filtration. In different diffusion and warming filters. I'm trying to find some effective combinations at the moment to help spice up my lens-life a little.
 
I find the ex1 to look putrid. I am in this business to create nice images where possible.

I keep it because some jobs are such chaos that it is the only option - or certainly was when I had the fs100 and no time for swapping Nd and lenses.

It is also useful to sling up at the back of a conference filming a locked off wide and gathering audio from the mixing desk.

Personally I find cp2 lenses comical. So over sized.

my current solo shooting lens package with the f3 is 18/4 35-70/3.5 35/2.5 and 135/2.8 nikkors. This lot goes in a small bag and with the average cost of each lens at $200 used I don't have to baby sit them too much.

A lens like the 35/2.5 is tiny.

As for pulling my own focus it is hard but work is hard.
My lenses are picked for appropriate throw - not like modern horror af lenses. I use a dp6 which has good resolution and most important of all just concentrate while working

i was very pleased with the focus pull from driver to bike in my short - the high point of the film for me- thanks for watching
 
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Grug said:
I'm a little the same way at the moment, I'm in love with the image CP.2s and the F3 in SLOG put out - it's crisp, cool and modern, it just looks slick and precise. Which is great for anything that needs to looks punchy and modern - but it's easy to get antsy wanting to shoot things that look warm, soft, imprecise and flawed instead - it's just hard to get clients to fork out extra so that I can shoot on Cookes or Anamorphics, on lenses that will offer different aesthetic qualities.

So I think the answer lies in filtration. In different diffusion and warming filters. I'm trying to find some effective combinations at the moment to help spice up my lens-life a little.
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Hi Grug,

I bought some Canon FD's, to try get a retro feel, but to my amazement, they look very good! Nothing like I imagined. Let me know how you get on with the filters, could be another option for doing something different.

morgan_moore said:
I find the ex1 to look putrid. I am in this business to create nice images where possible.
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I always thought the EX1 looked rather good, here is a trailer for a U.K feature shot on an EX1, doesn't look too bad to me https://vimeo.com/27051128

Another shot on the EX3 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QmR-l3y_coo This actually played at my local Cineworld, I wish I had seen it now on the big screen.

Grug said:
Personally I find cp2 lenses comical. So over sized.
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Love the CP.2's, it's the one set of equipment I know I will never sell, unless a set of Arri Ultra Primes come my way. They are worth the money, the size actually helps with using a follow focus, and they are very light weight.
 
morgan_moore said:
I find the ex1 to look putrid. I am in this business to create nice images where possible.
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Not that i want to divert the thread, but i look back on EX1 footage and am alway surprised how much detail and how good it can look. Then i watched Monsters a few weeks back, and that was shot on an EX3. So i think 'putrid' a little over the top :) Monsters IHMO looked fantastic.

Liked the short you did though, loved the rig!

cheers
Paul
 
Every one has different needs. My 4 nikkors and the FS100 easy go 'carry on', (the f3 will be a new challenge!) Im constantly trying to shave size and grams. The smaller and lighter the more one concentrates on the image, not the kit.

Any concept that old nikkors are not sharp or suchlike is turkey.

S
 
Monsters was shot with EX and 35mm lens adapter, so I think when talking about the "look" of the EX it is mostly meant 1/2" vs s35, etc..
 
Of course with the right lights/toys. I mean day to day naked I'm not too keen on the camera - If I was it would kind of defeat the purpose of the having an F3!

S
 
Hi All,

Just wanted to share my F3 rig building experience, for those looking for some options...I ended up buying a used F3 for a project, but I was looking for a good way to rig it for more run and gun applications, while still retaining the ability to go film-style when need be. ENG would mean viewfinder/zoom lens/wireless mic/off the shoulder ability. The shoulder mount was the hard part. There are so many systems, but I wanted something that would lock into the Sony wedge mount plates we used with 2/3" cameras. I looked at Tilta, then at one made by Shape, but they seemed a little bulky. Then I stumbled on to one made by Movcam. The MOV-303-1206. Lightweight, low profile, and it came with rails! It was expensive....for me anyways...($499), but it just seemed like a better option. From there, I went with a Kinotehnik EVF, Ergocine handgrip , cheapy Chinese power distro plate, and an MTF FZ to B4 adapter to round it out. All in all, it has turned out to be a flexible, fairly well organized, and dependable setup. the downside is the rig is long (not much longer than a 2/3" camera though...) and there's no servo zoom...but it's fairly neat, which I like, and the MTF adapter works well. The Kinotechnik is really good, too. Sharp, tons of features (like peaking, waveform, audio levels etc,..also comes complete with mounting stuff, and video/power cables!).

F3 Operator Side Long.jpgF3 Outside Long.jpgF3 FIlm Style Op Side.jpgF3 Shoulder Mount.jpg

I do have the much-maligned Hyperdeck 2, which works fine, despite the mini-sdi's (and has also served me well!) and it fits right in with the rig as a whole. So, that's what I got. It's a work in progress, but it's working well....hope this helps you folks who are building your own!
 
Both grabs from the cam, tight shots are my super scratched 85/2 at 2 very wooly/flary lens !

S
shimmer2.jpg
 
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