White Salt or Battery Acid looking substance on both my AF-101

Keep in mind also that being stored in a case with out Desiccant is like storing it in a humidor. the humidity level at the time it was closed stays roughly the same in the case unless dried out by something, and with out desiccant it is basically locking in humidity right along with the gear with no ventilation or air flow.
 
Yes and although I already had that notion, the comments here have made me even more aware of that. In the future, desiccant will always be present inside my cases.
 
unpainted metal

unpainted metal

Ok, my camera just got delivered today- and I just opened it 27 minutes ago. As I was inspecting the camera, I noticed some discoloration around the two bolts that hold the handle on. This thread is the first thing I thought of as my chest tightened and my left arm became knumb. I got these crystals? My camera is 27 minutes old, the "odometer" reads 0000h :huh:. The only box it has been in is Panasonic's cardboard box.

SAM_0512.jpg

A I loosened the bolts I noticed it was not crystals or acid, but infact the bare metal which was not painted. From what I can see, Panasonic did not paint around the hole where the screw threads through. It's the bare magnesium that Panasonic uses in their camera bodies.

SAM_0513.jpg

I think that parts of this camera that are not painted AND that come into contact with a different metal may contribute to this issue. I don't know, i'm not a metalurgist. I have also found a few other small screw holes where bare metal can be seen around the bolt. Can anyone else confirm that their handles are not painted under the screw holes? Although I am a bit miffed about this lack of detail on Panasonic's part, I am not going to return the camera as this is probably how it comes from the factory. I want to get shootin!!! :) But if I start seeing stuff growing on this bare metal....

If you're not going to paint metal that is unseen to the customer (like the inside) that's one thing- but at least fully paint the outside. We have two HMC40 cams at work and I believe their top handles are fully painted. I will check tomorrow. Am I being too picky? Perhaps. I'm a new owner and of course I want it to be perfect. It's a $4800 investment... can you blame me? Everything else about the body seems great.
 
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Ed nothing like this finding to spoil your day :( .. but mate (and mods) ask the mods to start another thread for you. The resultant answers and solution to this might be the same as for Mikungfu .. but then again, they might not. HTH.

Cheers, anyway.
 
... and Ed and Mikungfu .. would you both post your serial nos. to see if they came from the same production run ... and maybe from the same (contaminated?) shipment.

Cheers.
 
@Ed Kishel: Yes, that's precisely what I have mentioned in one of my posts: Most of the rust I got, showed up presicely where the metal wasn't protected by paint. that's under the screws, on tiny pores/holes, etc... Obviously, despite any humidity conditions, if the metal was paint protected, it would have probably been a lot harder for rust to deposit as a result of corrosion.

@Raster: Certainly! My serial numbers for each of my camcorders are:

1- L0TDA0235
2- L0TDA0349

However, considering I'm from Portugal (Europe), it's highly unlikely that my shipment is the same as Ed's. I own AG-AF101EJ Cameras as opposed to AG-AF100 cameras from Ed, who lives in Arizona (USA). Also, mine were bought in November 25th... Not recently as Ed's. So, this is not a shipmet contamination issue.

If Ed were to start a new thread, I would strongly sugest starting a new one, without deleting your posts here. The unpainted metal is related and relevant to understanding this corrosion issue and it's causes.
 
Hi,

I have looked at all of the cameras that I have here and none of them are painted under the screw. I think the lesson to be learned here is, that this oxidation happening on the outside of the camera is showing you what is potentially happening inside the camera. I have over the years heard occassionally from the service guys that there was moisture damage on the inside of the camera and the customer swears up and down he was no were near the water, so how could that be? This thread has brought that "how" to light. Having waterproof cases that seal in moisture from humid air is the culprit. We have learned over the course of this thread that desiccant pacs are really required in these cases. The case that I am using, the Porta-Brace isn't water proof and thus this issue has not shown up on my camera and mine stays in the case 24/7 when not at a show.

The reason that the metal is not painted under the screw is because it simply would wear off with the screw head being tightened down onto the handle, repeatedly. You cannot paint screw holes as that would require the screws to accommodate the thickness of the paint and then somehow the screws would have to grow larger as the paint wore off.

Best regards,

Jan
 
makes sense Jan- it's just that at work we have DVC30s and HMC40s that also have removable top handles. These are fully painted, even under where the bolt tightens down. This comparison to much cheaper cameras is what make the AF100 handle stand out as odd. I am not going to fret over it any longer- not much of an issue to me now. I am having to much fun with it otherwise :) Besides, I use rigid softcases like Petrol bags so not much of a chance in moisture getting trapped. But just to be safe I will get some dessicant as well. Thanks.

Mikungfu and Raster- No need for me to start a seperate thread re this... thanks,
 
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@Jan: Thanks once again for the imput! :) As far as I can see and as far as I know, my flight cases are not supposed to be water proof. But I'm not saying they don't seal the air as tight as can be. I had these flight cases custom made myself by a company here. They don't make them particularly waterproof... But I'm not saying they don't end up being waterproof inadvertedly.
Also... It's precisely the fear of all the corrosion that might be inside, that is urging me to send the camera to Panasonic for checking that and fixing it.

Here are several photos of my flightcase. The last one was the scheme I sent to the case maker to explain how I wanted the cases:

flightcase00.jpgflightcase05.jpgflightcase03.jpgflightcase01.jpgflightcase06.jpgflightcase.jpg
 
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A possible moisture source; humidity

I record outdoors and have found that early morning and late evening after shooting (mostly tripod) my camera is damp with condensation. If you have high humidity, all that is needed is for the equipment to be a cool enough to start "sweating" like a glass of cold water does.

As soon as I get back indoors after these shoots the bag is opened and the camera is taken out to dry.
 
OK have you had your camera in the case in a hot car or in the hot sun in the case?
This is what I found years ago when I was just a still photographer......
I had the aluminum roller skate case in the sun in the trunk of my car on a hot day.
I opened the case about mid day and my camera was wet.......
Well the foam had held humidity from when I closed the case the day before, that day the air was about 58% humidity but the foam held water from the air. The high heat drove the humidity out of the foam and made my camera damp.
Damp makes corrosion. After that day I learned to not store my gear in foam lined cases where it will be exposed to high heat. The heat simply drives the moisture out of the foam and on to your gear.
I did slip up a time or two after that and the same thing happened again.
 
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Barry_Green said:
You can get those kinds of cases custom-manufactured at www.innerspacecases.com. I got one for my Compact Primes and just ordered another for my ZF's. They aren't inexpensive but they are top quality.
Click to expand...
Mine (the one in that View attachment 35692) was also custom made, as I explained. :) If you're in Europe, here is the website: http://mrronfx.webs.com/

Even if you're in the americas, it may compensate including shipping because, they are not that expensive... I think.
 
*Bump*

Just letting everyone know that my cameras were picked up by DHL for repair on Monday. Today I received an email saying they have been repaired and sent back to me already. I will also receive an email today or tomorrow with the description of the problem's causes and repair procedures. The same information will be sent in paper with the cameras. Cameras are expected to arrive tomorrow.

This is what I call absolute efficiency. Congratulations Panasonic UK for an outstanding customer service!!:Drogar-BigGrin(DBG)

I will post here as soon as I have that report, so that everyone will benefit from it for future similar situations.
 
I wonder if there is a way to have the removable handles anodized instead of painted? In my experience, no ATA case is provided as waterproof. Pelican / Storm / PortaBrace cases will have a very high IP rating and therefore will keep the atmosphere inside pretty steady and at whatever humidity you've closed into the box.
 
Follow Up: Utter Diapointment!..


I received my cameras within the 5 days before which Panasonic would provide me with temporary replacemnt unit. I should have guessed there was a reason for such speed...

The repair report said: Corrosion cleaned from camera. Internal PCBs checked for corrosion - All OK, no corrosion. Camera checked and tested.

It turns out that my cameras were actually returned still full of visible corrsion deposits. Panasonic seems to have merely cleaned the cameras suprficially, as I would have easily done it at home with some kind of cloth. I believe that if they had indeed been opened and the metal body parts thoroughly cleaned from the inside out, then no signs of corrosion would be visible. This was a sloppy and most incomplete corrosion cleaning, unlike what they state in the report.

I complained and Panasonic said I could send the cameras again. Is this normal?.. I mean, time is money, right? If this is the way Panasonic avoids sending replacement units, making the repairs shorter than 5 days, then it's unnacceptable... And the service itself was terrible, as you can easily see by the photos I have attached:
corrosion01.jpgcorrosion02.jpgcorrosion03.jpgcorrosion04.jpgcorrosion05.jpgcorrosion06.jpgcorrosion07.jpgcorrosion08.jpg

I feel considerably disappointed because I invested a significant amount in these two cameras as recently as last November and a couple of weeks ago I found my cameras with this corrosion, selectively depoisted on uncoated metal areas of their chassis. The cameras were normally stored in the same place as several other metal objects and none of them suffered this corrosion. In fact, not even other metals in the camera body, suffered this phenomena.

This clearly shows that there is a fabric problem with the chosen alloy for these metal parts of the camera body, in which case warrantyshould entitle me to demand a complete elimination of this problem. I don't feel any obligation of keeping the cameras with this problem and in this condition. It is my understanding that Panasonic should do whatever it's needed to completely and absolutely remove each and every last tiny sign of this substance from my cameras, or indeed replace them for new ones.

It is as obvious as it is predictable that in longer term, this will eventually end up causing damage... Either mechanical or electrical. How long after the warranty this will happen, I don't know... But that is exactly why I wish the problem to be totally eliminated now. How that is achieved, it's in Panasonic's consideration. Every time I click a button (REC, Inpu1 or 2, etc...), I hear that crispy sound as if there was sand inside. Gives me the creeps!

I will be re-sending the cameras for repair, next week.
 
Wow. Sorry you're having to go through all this. Wonder if there is a low level of voltage somehow trying or has tried to find it's way to ground. Isn't there an internal battery inside? Could be that a slight voltage difference in potential would
cause this. If so, you'd think the repair center would have checked this. It's also possible they didn't look for a culprit and assumed it was simply humidity.
 
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