Which NLE you recommend.

K

kfkok

Member
Dear all experience users,

I'd like to know what's the NLE you'd recommend for professional use and why. I'm currently using Premier 6.5. And I'm wondering if I want to upgrade to Premier Pro or Avid Express (I'm using PC instead of Mac, so, Final Cut Pro is out of the question--I saw demo on Final Cut Pro before, and it has much better features than Premier 6.5!)

Dear Editor, I couldn't find a sub-forum for generic NLE discussion in this forum. So, I post it here. If it's not appropriate, please let me know.

Thanks!
 
Re: Which NLE you recommend.

If you're working with DV, vegas should be your choice, it kicks premiere butt. I like the interface better, and its audio capablities are better than prem. You can also incorporate vegas with sound forge, a major advantage.

Premiere has way more third party plugins than vegas, thats about it. If you're gonna work mostly with straight cuts, vegas is the way to go.

DV is still DV at the end
 
Re: Which NLE you recommend.

I'm biased here as I'm a vegas user but Vegas just doesn't need as many plugins as Premiere, there's actually more than most Vegas users realise (myslef included!). And of course Ver 5 is just around the corner.
Certainly the audio side of Vegas leaves premiere for dead, in fact Vegas started life as an audio only editor and is still used as a very serious multitrack system. Combined with Sound Forge you've got a toolkit that'll do almost anything, for your money you not only get a decent NLE, mulitrack recording system and DAW but also tools such as Noise Reduction, Wave Hammer and Acoustic Mirror.
 
Re: Which NLE you recommend.

I have not used Vegas, but I did have Premiere 6.5 which didn't recognize the new camera, so I upgraded for Premiere Pro, and I'm very happy with it. It is the interface I'm used to. Simply with the load of work I have now, I have no time to learn yet another NLE. Vegas would have been #6.
 
Re: Which NLE you recommend.

Douglas Spotted Eagle points out that Vegas doesn't have a lot of plug-ins because that functionality is already built into Vegas. You don't need a compositing plug-in because it has compositing built in. You don't need StageTools because it already has that capability built in. And if you want 2d & 3d compositing, morphing, particles, fire, smoke, etc., you can download Wax for free.

Vegas truly is "the bomb."
 
Re: Which NLE you recommend.

I was a long time Premiere user. Started with 5.0 went to 6.0 and then to premiere pro. Premiere pro is good, but it just doesn't cut it if you are working with the DVX. I like to be able to edit natively in 24p without having to worry about a thing. It took me about a day and a half to make the conversion from premiere to vegas, it is very intuitive and can be picked up very quickly. I have found that I can actually work much faster in vegas than I ever could before in premiere. I have also found that on my 2.4 Ghz P4 1gig of ram vaio, Vegas outperforms Premiere by a long shot, in the realtime preview catagory especially when working with any kind of color correction. Vegas is also more stable than premiere, even though Ppro is by far the most stable version of Premiere to date. I also can't live without a project trimmer, which vegas has and Adobe dropped for some reason in Ppro. I still use Premiere for various little projects here and there, bu Vegas is definatly my main NLE, and with Vegas 5 just around the corner, it might just be time for me to say goodby to Premiere forever.
 
Re: Which NLE you recommend.

Wow! I really need to look closer into Vegas then! Thanks guys!

Haven't heard anyone comments on Avid? What about Avid Express?
 
Re: Which NLE you recommend.

[quote author=kfkok link=board=nws;num=1081502471;start=0#6 date=04/09/04 at 12:33:22]Wow! I really need to look closer into Vegas then! [/quote]

Aww dude, you are wading chest deep in Vegas country here. And yes, you should indeed give it a look. I had never heard of it before I got interested in the DVX, and I was even considering not getting the DVX if I was going to have to invest in a new NLE(with my meager budget) but then I tried it and have been grateful ever since. It is bad ass.
 
Re: Which NLE you recommend.

It's darn near the official NLE of DVXUser.com.

Near.

Even though hardcore Macheads insist it's a "joke." ::)
 
Re: Which NLE you recommend.

Man, that attitude gets so old. It's like, modern society has attempted to exterminate religion from people's consciousness, so people are taking that underlying psychological need and applying it to Mac vs. PC, Bill Gates vs. Steve Jobs, FCP vs. Vegas, XL1 vs. DVX, etc.

We look at what's going on in the Arab world and wonder how people can get so passionate that they do the things they do, which offend our sensibilities, and then we get just as worked up over a Macintosh. It's absurd. Some guy posted a tongue-in-cheek article about how he "fixed" his Mac G5, by ripping out the guts and installing a Wintel motherboard... he actually received death threats for having done so.

They're just tools. There should be no fervor associated with them. I've never used FCP, never had an opportunity to compare, never had a reason to -- Vegas does everything I need and I'm happy with it. I believe it's a much superior tool to Premiere, which I have direct experience with. But I don't go around saying "FCP is a joke" or "people who use Mac's are brainwashed by the Steve Jobs cult" or any of that nonsense. Use what you like. Choice is good. Various platforms encourage competition. Vegas is plenty good enough for my work, and I make my living producing TV and commercials and corporate films. Is FCP "better"? I don't know, never used it. Is Vegas a "joke"? Well, that's just absurd, like I said I make a decent living with it, so how can that be a joke?

All I can tell you is, I used Premiere since version 4.2, even cut a 90-minute feature-length movie on that version, using the original DV Master card from Fast. I used 5.0, and 6.0... never went to 6.5. Started using Vegas, and instantly recognized that it was a far more powerful tool than Premiere. I can get much more done in Vegas, in much less time and in far, far fewer mouse clicks, than I ever could in Premiere. Vegas is a fun program to use, it's extremely powerful, and it does just about everything I need or want. Is Premiere "a joke"? No, just not what I want.

Is FCP "better"? I don't know. Is Avid "better"? Don't know. That's what's great about shows like NAB -- you can sit through demos of all of 'em, get hands-on time, test 'em, and pick which tool works for you the best.
 
Re: Which NLE you recommend.

I'm using Avid Xpress Pro and won't go anywhere else. It has been my background for years (higher end Media Composer) and if I ever go back to broadcast the Xpress Pro has the same interface so it keeps me in that world (Avid is the dominant system in brodacast). I have tried Priemere (teaching my 11 year old how to edit on 6.0 on the PC as we speak) and FCP 3, but I like the Avid best.

As far as editing goes Avid has been well refined and has the best media management hands down (handling large projects, hi/low rez, import/export, etc). If you have interest in using the higher end Avid's, then Xpress Dv/Pro is the way to go (Avid Free DV is on the web site avid.com, if you meet the system requirements try it out). I have never used Vegas.

Like Barry said, find something you like and make it work for you. Once people see something from my DVX and Xpress Pro, I no longer apologize for it being Mini DV and edited with a $4000 G4 running Avid Xpress Pro.

FD
 
Re: Which NLE you recommend.

Good point, it aint what you use, but how you use it.

I worked with premiere and avid, but prefer vegas.

Love the capture in vegas, makes it look like child's play.

I was over at the avid forum, and they consider vegas to be a toy

It sure is a toy, a very powerful toy.

In the end it comes down to the product, no viewer gives a crap what editing system you used
 
Re: Which NLE you recommend.

I was just wondering how Premiere Pro with the collection(AE, audition, encore) compares to Vegas's interaction with these other programs. I am sure that Pro by itself is not great, but its interface with AE is supposedly much better than Vegas. Is this true or not?
 
Re: Which NLE you recommend.

I was just wondering how Premiere Pro with the collection(AE, audition, encore) compares to Vegas's interaction with these other programs.  I am sure that Pro by itself is not great, but its interface with AE is supposedly much better than Vegas.  Is this true or not?
Click to expand...

As far as im concerned... They shouldn't consider it a suite. Yes they are all based on working with your video projects. However Premiere Pro is a complete re-write, and it doesnt really seem to "integrate" with AE... and Audition is just an audio editing program that Adobe bought from a company called Syntrillium "Cool Edit Pro". Dont get me wrong, they are all powerful tools, but they still seem seperate to me. Illustrator and AE are the most integrated software thus far.

Adobe's MPEG encoder is bad in my opinion... so I like to use an external encoder. Well... Encore doesn't like MPEG's brought in from outside encoders.... therefore Encore gets the big thumbs down from me. However I just downloaded an update for Encore, so we'll see how that goes.

I disagree in a way when people say they are all just tools. The end result is what matters bla bla bla. Its all true. But obviously, we're talking about this subject for a reason. The tools do matter, otherwise I'd be shooting on a Hi8, editing in Windows Movie Maker, and videotaping my monitor. The tools are what you do all of your work in. They affect how you work, how fast you work and the like. If the majority of the time that you are working, you're having problems with the software and what not... this will undoubtedly affect your work, and the end result for that matter.

Im used to Premiere. The new Pro isnt bad, but im about to give Vegas a try. Avid I learned in school, and as far as im concerned... is good for editing feature films. However not all the time do I want to set in and out points for every piece of footage I want on the timeline. Avid is powerful, but its very limiting. Its a strict way of doing things... however for large projects, rigid and strict methods may be what you need.

I tend to shut the f*ck up around Mac and Avid freaks. Since im in a film school, they are everywhere. Its like a cult. Don't dare say anything about Premiere, or bad about Avid or FCP. They'll come back and tell you that "everyone uses Avid" and that is "THE industry standard." Funny part is, When Im editing or compositing on their new G5's, the things freeze up more than my Athlon 2800. I once said something about the new premire being pretty cool... My teacher said ... and I quote ... "well.... its no Final Cut." A few months later, he sold his mac for a PC.
 
Re: Which NLE you recommend.

Vegas .... Lets ponder a moment. Are not Vegas users moreso a tight nit and cultish type group? Go to their board at the Sony site and see for yourselves.
If you have a problem using a Vegas function and are unsure of what to do and post your question youll get a half a dozen responses in a few hours or so.. The people there are very accomodating.
Its strange.. Everyone I know that uses Vegas is closed minded to any other program (cultish) like a religion. They dont even want to hear about it.
The reason why in my opinion is that it works and it works well.. The learning curve although difficult isnt very steep. The functions and STABILITY (key word) are second to none when compared to any other editor.
I recommend Vegas moreso than any other editor and now that Sony owns it and they dont drop the ball it will be a major competitor in the PROFESSIONAL NLE market soon.
Not that it isnt now.. Its just that it isnt as well known and needs some robust marketing exposure.
The weak parts of Vegas??? The only week parts are the DVD authoring system and the Titler. They work great.. But they are somewhat limited in the number of options available.
It is certain to change with the introduction of Vegas 5.0 wherein these functions will be enhanced. Also is rumored a 3D modeler. there is just no question for me Vegas is the true APP of choice... biased of course ;)
 
Re: Which NLE you recommend.

[quote author=Fred Plowman link=board=nws;num=1081502471;start=0#15 date=04/10/04 at 06:48:50]Vegas .... Lets ponder a moment. Are not Vegas users moreso a tight nit and cultish type group? Go to their board at the Sony site and see for yourselves.
If you have a problem using a Vegas function and are unsure of what to do and post your question youll get a half a dozen responses in a few hours or so.. The people there are very accomodating.
Its strange.. Everyone I know that uses Vegas is closed minded to any other program (cultish) like a religion. They dont even want to hear about it.
The reason why in my opinion is that it works and it works well.. The learning curve although difficult isnt very steep. The functions and STABILITY (key word) are second to none when compared to any other editor.
I recommend Vegas moreso than any other editor and now that Sony owns it and they dont drop the ball it will be a major competitor in the PROFESSIONAL NLE market soon.
Not that it isnt now.. Its just that it isnt as well known and needs some robust marketing exposure.
The weak parts of Vegas??? The only week parts are the DVD authoring system and the Titler. They work great.. But they are somewhat limited in the number of options available.
It is certain to change with the introduction of Vegas 5.0 wherein these functions will be enhanced. Also is rumored a 3D modeler. there is just no question for me Vegas is the true APP of choice... biased of course ;)[/quote]

Actually, I'll be the first to tell you that there are things I *hate* about Vegas and work in Liquid Edition half the time because of them -- the non-real time playback, for one; the almost complete lack of 3D effects for another.  Also, I prefer to apply 2D ("Track Motion") effects to the *clip*, not to the *track*, so Vegas loses there, too.

But I still love Vegas!  (Please don't kick me out of the cult!)

;)
 
Re: Which NLE you recommend.

Hey David.. you can do 2d effects to the clip or timeline :) And mine does realtime if I am using less than 3 tracks.
 
Re: Which NLE you recommend.

I know that you can do a lot with the pan/crop tool on the clip level -- but can you do the "track motion" effects to just the clip? If you *move* the clip on the timeline (or even extend the clip), will they carry over?
 
Re: Which NLE you recommend.

You can do keyframed motion on an individual clip using the pan/crop effects. You're a bit more limited in what can be done when working at the clip level, but it can be done, and yes, it would stay with the clip if you moved the clip on the timeline.

It takes a different way of thinking to use the pan/crop tool. Someone once described it by saying that the track motion moves the track around the clip, whereas the pan/crop moves the clip around the track, or something like that.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top