Where is Panasonic in this game?

Kenny_G said:
I wouldn't have to change my lenses that much. A f2.8 /f4 and even f5.6 would haven given me the DoF that i want. Now I often have to go with f2 or even f1.4 to get the same dramatic effect.
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...But there's a BIG BONUS to having to shoot at f/1.4 or f/2.0, you get to shoot with MUCH lower ISO speeds.

For example shooting with natural light at f/2.0 with an AF-100 or GH-2 might require an 800 ISO rating, but shooting at f/4.0 with a Canon 5D MK2 would REQUIRE an ISO rating of 3200 for the SAME DOF and SAME exposure.

This changes things in a BIG WAY, especially with Voightlander now making a 17.5mm f/0.95 M4/3 wide angle prime lens and a 25mm f/0.95 M4/3 standard prime lens. Hopefully there will be more super speed Voightlander lenses in the future. Imagine a 12mm f/0.95 prime lens!
 
Mike Harvey said:
Keep in mind, a lot of that had to do with the earthquake and tsunami. Also, that is company wide totals, and doesn't neccessarily reflect all the individual divisions of the company.
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I dig that - there's no way the camera division is the reason why they lost all that dough. In fact, I'm guessing it's one of their few bright spots. But regardless of how/why they lost the money, I just tend to think that they're be a little tender in all departments for a while...

Unless they feel they have a real winner on their hands.
 
TheDingo said:
...But there's a BIG BONUS to having to shoot at f/1.4 or f/2.0, you get to shoot with MUCH lower ISO speeds.

For example shooting with natural light at f/2.0 with an AF-100 or GH-2 might require an 800 ISO rating, but shooting at f/4.0 with a Canon 5D MK2 would REQUIRE an ISO rating of 3200 for the SAME DOF and SAME exposure.

This changes things in a BIG WAY, especially with Voightlander now making a 17.5mm f/0.95 M4/3 wide angle prime lens and a 25mm f/0.95 M4/3 standard prime lens. Hopefully there will be more super speed Voightlander lenses in the future. Imagine a 12mm f/0.95 prime lens!
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exactly!
this is one of the reasons why I like MFT so much.
 
Heard about the LETUS MFT. If I get this AF100...is the MFT also a good add on? Thanks. Putting together a list for a low budget indie feature using a lot of shadows. Different lenses.
 
So what's news on Panasonic site? How would they react on the new cameras on the market?
 
Berk said:
So what's news on Panasonic site? How would they react on the new cameras on the market?
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My guess is that we might find out at either NAB 2012 or Photokina in the Fall. There's no point creating new products until the technology is there. ( i.e. greatly improved sensor tech that supports a global shutter would be a big deal )
 
People keep asking a HPX250 body w M4/3 sensor from Panasonic for a while. I don't think it is visible to put out something like that since Sony and others has claimed that range pretty well. s-log now comes with the camera. Jan had said that camera would have cost around 10-12K. If they have something w P2 system they of course would push it. As result people could turn their back to it since competitors offer cheap recording solution or everybody has a sort of external recording unit.

I am expecting something revolutionary as HVX in order to gain " Being Leader" in the market again. There is no rumour I've seen any new product for NAB or anything for near future. sony and canon are riding the track by them self so far.
 
It looks like NAB 2012 is going to be year of Canon and Sony. Panasonic is still quite.
If sony puts out updated version of Fs100 as in rumoured FS700 they will close the market between 13K and 5K. I would like to see more options for sub 10K cameras.
 
I like panisonics colors, especially in the hvx, hpx cams. I have a feeling they will come out with a badass cam before long. They always do. I would like to see something similar to the C300, small formfactor. Heck I can live with m4/3rds. But with a 4:2:2 colorspace, and a better bit rate. Thats all, just a small simple camera much like the bolex, but with a little more of an interface. Nothing to fancy, I dont need a bunch features that I will never use, like gps.
 
maranfilms said:
I like panisonics colors, especially in the hvx, hpx cams. I have a feeling they will come out with a badass cam before long. They always do. I would like to see something similar to the C300, small formfactor. Heck I can live with m4/3rds. But with a 4:2:2 colorspace, and a better bit rate. Thats all, just a small simple camera much like the bolex, but with a little more of an interface. Nothing to fancy, I dont need a bunch features that I will never use, like gps.
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I a fine with the bitrate and 4-2-0 onboard to keep costs down (I like the fact that it is a sub $5K body and am happy with whatever codec they need to include to keep costs down as long as I have my 4-2-2 HD-SDI out so I can record it however I want). I just want more dynamic range and better highlight handeling (the only places the camera really leaves me wanting), and a possibly a little less noise and a little more resolution.

Of a side note, if you are wanting a camera like a Bolex, have you checked out: www.digitalbolex.com
 
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Panasonic has to think long and hard about MFT sensor cameras. The new standard is S35. MFT works for me but getting a little more from S35 is always going to be a factor when choosing the next camera. NAB will be great.
 
Historically, Panasonic has been the low-cost alternative to what the other guys do. They bring more bang for the buck at lower cost. Canon has historically used last-generation technology at a huge price premium, and Sony has typically had a 25-35% price premium over the comparable Panasonic.

Examples today: the HPX250 is $2,000 less expensive, and more powerful, than the Canon equivalent. And the AF100 does tons of things the Sony FS100 doesn't, at 1/3 less the cost.

I do not expect this fundamental relationship to change. If Sony is forging into a new price bracket with a $9000 FS700, don't expect Panasonic to go there, expect them to go somewhere around a $6,000 unit later on.

As for S35, it'd be nice if they'd add a product at that frame, as it's pretty much standardized by everyone else. Then again, Panasonic has been known to go it alone before, they went with solid state before anyone else, and there were a couple of years of people mocking and laughing and pointing fingers at that "crazy P2" -- right up until it took 80% of the market, and next thing you know there's a panic and there's SxS and SxS-1 and MxR and CF and AVC and minidisc blu-ray and everything else being scrambled together, but it was too late. Panasonic got that one right. Will they also be proven "right" with m43? I don't know... the frame size is pretty good, it's mostly the same size as 35mm movie film, and it does provide the POTENTIAL for cheaper faster better lenses than S35 does. But "potential" doesn't help the buyer make images today, so either someone really has to get on the ball and start fulfulling the promise of m43 (like more Voigtlanders, or the long-awaited 12-35 f/2.8 and 35-100 f/2.8) or yeah, it may be too late for m43 to make up ground.

In any case, I would expect that Panasonic will always provide the budget-friendly alternative. The HPX170 was 40% less expensive than the EX1, for example... that's their niche. That's how they roll. The VariCam was 35% less expensive than the F900. Sony will always have the more-expensive product, Canon will always have the grossly-more-expensive product using last-generation technology (8-bit mpeg2 on compact flash, really?), and JVC will always have some lamebrained half-off weird thing (like their 30p-only MPEG2 camera that predated HDV, or their 4K camera that records four independent 1080p streams and has four HDMI ports(!) and Panasonic will always be the company that's listening to the users here and trying to bring them budget-friendly alternatives, faster and sooner than anyone else. They were first out of the gate with 24p, first out of the gate with tapeless, first with 1080/24p, first with variable frame rates, first with a camera that did both 1080 & 720, first with a large-sensor camera, first with 10-bit recording, first with an all-in-one 3D camera... they'll be first with something else, too. Don't know what, but they'll be first somewhere. Although they weren't first with 4k, Sony got that with the F65, so ... I don't know what they've got up their sleeve, but whatever it is, they'll be first. So don't expect them to come out with an alternative to what the other folks are doing, that's not how they do it. They don't answer other companies, they make new products and let other companies answer them...
 
Barry_Green said:
But "potential" doesn't help the buyer make images today, so either someone really has to get on the ball and start fulfulling the promise of m43 (like more Voigtlanders, or the long-awaited 12-35 f/2.8 and 35-100 f/2.8) or yeah, it may be too late for m43 to make up ground.
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Technical merit aside, (IMHO) the market has spoken. S35 is the format to ride at this point and Panasonic would be wise to adopt it. When
you're up against EPIC/Scarlet and people are looking for "B" cams .. an AF100 type camera with an S35 sensor and more standard mount
would be a great product.

Doesn't have to be 4K (although that would be nice) .. but moving on from m4/3 would be a wise move. It's still valid in the still
camera market though .. there's a role the MFT plays there (mirror-less large sensor) that will be there for a while.
 
Adapting to market changes and filling a niche is simply a smart position for a company trying to sustain it's stockholders investment in the long run.

I just wish Panasonic would increase the dynamic range on their chips.... It's killing me. Im always paranoid of my highlights with Pannys. They are solid tools, but lordy lordy do we need another stop in the highs.
 
I know this is just a personal opinion:

So don't care about S35 anymore. APS-H, Full Frame, cool. S35 and MFT are so close that it just doesn't matter.

What does matter is Panasonic delivering GH2 quality or better in a 6~8K body, stat. As much as I love the GH2 Hack, it's SO FIDDLY. It's even MORE frustrating that the darned thing is outputting incredimelt imagery but at the expense of so many small things that need fixing.

Super sad, that the image is not the issue with the GH2... it's the operation. =[

I would be COMPLETELY HAPPY with an AF-200 body that crapped GH2 gold, less rolling shutter, and the option to output better quality for studio/greenscreen work in a pinch.

Don't even need 4K, just want a robust 1080/60P. Anything beyond that I can rent.
 
I hear you Barry and I don’t disagree with anything you just posted. In fact that was a awesome post, however whats happening right now is like the "who has the highest megapixel camera on the market" and I think MFT as is wont survive it. Its funny that MFT is the first affordable large sensor cam dedicated to digital cinema so it also would be insane to think its also EOL. I hope a path for the format is shown at NAB because Panasonic got the AF-100 right. It would be a bummer if it didn’t advance.
 
It is perfect time to buy used AF100. i am not sure of that selling would be that profitable at this point.
 
I'm gonna have to go with Barry on this. m4/3's is darn close enough to s35 to nit make a big fuss of it. I also like the fact that it you were to run out the door with only the lumix lenses, you can pack all of them in your back pocket. Toss a couple Nikkor primes in there and you have a compact system to run about. Now if Panasonic would only release the darn X lenses with 2.8. 12-50 and 35-200 i think it is? That would inject a new life into the AF100 and Gh2 overnight. But, the AF100 could use a 1:1 mag for focus check.
 
honetstly i hate that fs700 looks like sh*t.
i lvoe the specs. if panny doesnt come up with something im buying this!

c300/scarlet who?
 
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