Patryk_Rebisz
Veteran
When feeding the 1khz tone from MixPre to Zoom H4 (NOT H4n) what should i set the input levels to (using Rode NTG2 with internal battery and Sennheiser G2)?
What input level to set Zoom H4 when using it with MixPre?
- Thread starter Patryk_Rebisz
- Start date
The original H4 could take -10dB line-level via the 1/4" inputs. The best thing to do is to use a 1/8" TRS>dual 1/4" TS Y-cable to feed the MixPre's tape out to the H4's line ins.
Patryk_Rebisz
Veteran
Then i create some kind of weird loop when i also have G2 unit connected as phantom is going bot to the NTG2 mic and the G2 unit.
Patryk_Rebisz
Veteran
So i understand correctly instead of XLT-to-1/4" i should use 1/8"-to-1/4" Y spliter from tape out, yes?
In that case when i feed the 1khz tone to the Zoom H4 my levels on the recorder should hit -10 on its scale, yes?
No. -10dB in this case is the voltage level of the signal and refers to unbalanced, line-level audio. As for the sound levels on the H4's meters, you still want to set your tone level to -20dB. That's the reference mark, and then your dialog should peak at -10dB with sudden peaks (sudden and loud noises like shouts and claps and coughs) hitting as high is -6dB.
There are several different kinds of dB scale, so it can get a little confusing.
Back to the interconnect, I used an H4 with a MixPre for several projects, and using the 1/8" tape out to the two 1/4" TS ins worked very well.
Patryk_Rebisz
Veteran
Thanks Alex!
(i assume XLR-to-1/4" wouldn't do the job? - cause i have those cables already)
(i assume XLR-to-1/4" wouldn't do the job? - cause i have those cables already)
Just a word of caution - the H4n does not have true line ins, as you cannot bypass the internal preamps. The way mentioned above is still the best way be (the gain would probably be 0 on the recorder), but the H4n is well known for being very sensitive on the input and is prone to distortion. Some claim that it works fine line in for them, some don't. Try it out and if you're content then fine. If you want to be shure though the best way would be to use a pad-cable between them.
Patryk_Rebisz
Veteran
That's why in bold letters in original post - NOT H4n!!
sonofaresiii
Well-known member
why is it preferable for peaking to be at -6db rather than 0db?
It's all about headroom. This is dBFS, or Full Scale. In the analog world, 0dB is the reference point (optimal signal:noise), and there's room to go past 0dB with no adverse effects. In the world of digital audio, 0dB is the top and there's nowhere to go from there.
With digital, everything is recorded in words, and the length of that word is determined by the bit-rate. 16-bit = 16 bits (or digits) per word. 24-bit = 24 bits per word. (Sample rate = the number of words per second.) So, in the 16-bit world, 0000000000000000 = silence. 1111111111111111 = maximum amplitude. At that point, all the bits are full and the signal is at 0dB. If you try to pack any more information in there, which you can't, it goes into digital clipping. That's a nasty sound, since it's literally sheering the tops off the waveforms and resulting in square waves.
This is why we aim for -10dB as a standard peak in digital sound, so that there's a good deal of headroom in case of sudden peaks.
Actually...
I was on a shoot back in October and rushed into setup for an interview. Plugged my G2 receiver into my MixPre-D and got terrible, terrible sound. It was thin and full of noise. I couldn't figure it out, and started tracing everything from the transmitter on. Everything was fine with the Sennheiser system. I got to the MixPre-D and saw that phantom was on for that input. Turned it off, and the signal was suddenly clean and clear. In theory, it shouldn't matter. In practice, I've seen otherwise.
Chadfish
Veteran
Hmmm. I guess one could put the wireless into the XLR jack of the recorder, and put the mic through the MixPre. I have accidentally had phantom on on my camera, with my G2/3 wireless, and has no odd noise. I assumed, maybe wrongly, that it would not hurt the units. My point is that the NTG-2 doesn't sound as good on battery power, but if that's your only option, the MixPre will give you back the gain you lose in spades.
sonofaresiii
Well-known member
Ahh, so if I KNOW I'm not going to get anything unexpected but I'm working with less than stellar equipment and need the extra gain, I can push it a little bit so my peaking is closer to 0dB as long as I know I'm definitely not going over?
Technically, yes. But...
Why? Set your recorder so that dialog averages between -22dB and -10dB. You can always bring the level up a little in post if you need. The only thing you'd be doing by pushing input gain to peak closer to 0dB is increasing the noise floor of the pre-amps and of that "less than stellar" equipment that comes before it. Recording in 24-bit will give you more flexibility in post without causing adverse effects.
But you're using a MixPre, so there's absolutely no need to push the gain in the H4 as the MixPre has "unclippable" limiters that will help you to keep levels where you need them. Set your MixPre's 1kHz tone, which runs at 0dB, to -20dB on the H4. Once you have that calibrated, set the input gain so that your mic is averaging around 0dB on the MixPre (which means that it will run above and below by a meter segment or two). This should translate to peaks around -10dB on the H4. Leave yourself the headroom on the H4, and use the gain on the MixPre to ride levels as needed.