GH3 What are you professionals charging your clients?

M

mmaller

Well-known member
I know this is a touchy subject, but I was wondering what general rates are you guys charging your clients for video projects in which
you are responsible for Directing, shooting, producing, and editing.
The job would be done by one man wearing all hats.

I realize that projects for different types of clients may require different pay rates.

The reason I'm asking is that I am having a debate with my partner over rates and what to charge.
Is a general estimate of $1500 a minute to high? (This rate takes into account the video shoot, all equipment needed, editing costs, transportation costs if needed, final delivery of project, etc)

is anyone brave enough to respond?
 
It depends... (that had to be the first response) You mean $1500 for one minute of delivered, finished video, right? So a 7 minute video costs them $10, 500. Is that correct?

I guess you guys went through an analysis of production costs, crew day rates, pre production, post, etc but I think it's a dangerous way to bid a project. It's too cookie cutter and you will get burned, or worse burn your client. Do the whole thing.

I take them case by case. Establish what your client wants and then write a detailed proposal based on your pre production and production rates, the number of days it's going to take to shoot including the crew costs, sound, and everything, and put a profit on it.

A 7 minute video of interviews is going to be less expensive than one where you need to gather broll or capture an event. Certainly if it is narrative content you're going to have other above the line costs, longer days for fewer minutes, dialog editing.

If you really want to dig in, I took a seminar at Able Cine with Jem Schofield of the C47 http://www.thec47.com/. He shared the way he proposes a project and it was hugely informative and helpful for me in pricing mine. I don't have any association except that I learned a lot and would recommend it.
 
In this one particular case, it's a simple monologue using a teleprompter. the video is about 3 1/2 minutes long. The talent is non professional.
It will require cutaways to imagery that illustrates what is being talked about.
Some material is being provided, other material (stills,music, etc) needs to be gathered from stock sites etc. After effects will be used to animate the artwork or pictures.
 
As a professional, I first figure out how much it will cost me to do the job, then figure out how much profit I'd like to make, and haggle with the client within those boundaries. One resource:

http://blog.vincentlaforet.com/2013/08/01/how-to-succeed-as-a-creative-long-term-know-your-c-o-d-b/

This can be difficult for those accustomed to being employed by others to absorb, but it's absolute necessity. For instance, had a bit hassle with one client recently that didn't understand why I had to raise my rates, and didn't accept that it was due to skyrocketing health insurance, but every cost you incur as a freelancer has to be accounted for somewhere.


Alternately, you could go the way a good ~80% of us just starting out did and stab wildly at a number on your first big project that seems huge but winds up being a fraction of what you need to actually get the job done competently so you wind up slogging through the last 3-4 days of the edit effectively working for free. I know that's what I did... it builds character... or something.
 
I never charge a fixed rate per finished minute. Shooting is by the half-day at $250, and editing is $50/hour. A small fee for my equipment rental is applied, and all other fees incurred are pass-through. I use these figures to work up estimates on a case-by-case basis, and try to work in %15-%20 wiggle room, if my client can stomach it.

Animation definitely raises the per-finished-minute cost, so it's hard to say. For a 3.5 minute teleprompter spot, my clients would think I was joking if I quoted them $5,250. I just produced an entire 2-day business conference with 2 videographers for that price, delivered. Granted, post-production was focused on breaking the content down into digestible categories and was very light on the graphics and animation.

You also have to understand that we are located in Vermont, not Connecticut. Depending on your level of production and your location in CT, the rules may be a little different up here.
 
mcbob said:
As a professional, I first figure out how much it will cost me to do the job, then figure out how much profit I'd like to make, and haggle with the client within those boundaries. One resource:

http://blog.vincentlaforet.com/2013/08/01/how-to-succeed-as-a-creative-long-term-know-your-c-o-d-b/

This can be difficult for those accustomed to being employed by others to absorb, but it's absolute necessity. For instance, had a bit hassle with one client recently that didn't understand why I had to raise my rates, and didn't accept that it was due to skyrocketing health insurance, but every cost you incur as a freelancer has to be accounted for somewhere.


Alternately, you could go the way a good ~80% of us just starting out did and stab wildly at a number on your first big project that seems huge but winds up being a fraction of what you need to actually get the job done competently so you wind up slogging through the last 3-4 days of the edit effectively working for free. I know that's what I did... it builds character... or something.
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I second the need to establish your CODB. From that, you can derive your day or hourly rates that takes into account your own profit. The provided link is awesome and if you don't want to do the math, try this one:
http://www.videomaker.com/video-rate-calculator

I just actually used this recently to write a proposal for a substantial construction survey. It came in higher than I guesstimated, but at least I therefore had some negotiating power.

As others have said, it depends on your shoot. I used to do legal videography where the hour rate had to factor in media storage for up to seven years. This amount was way more than 'harder' work of shooting football games, where I had to charge much less.
 
How much to buy a car ?
Rates vary from country to country - here's what they are in Australia
Broadcast camera- Sony XD per 10 hours $1400
DSLR - $1100 to $1500 per day for broadcast work - less for corporate - less again for small business, educational, community groups
Audio for TV $650 plus additional for more than 2 mics
Autocue $550 per day
Editing - dry hire $800 per day plus $50 per hour for editor.

Except for broadcast I charge what I think a client can afford or how much their budget is. Ask them for a ballpark budget and tell them what they can expect for that price. Do they want a ford or a Ferrari - you can drive both.
 
I found that charging by the finished minute just wasn't a good business model for me. Some projects need more work than others, so there was no way for me to estimate costs and come up with a workable rate.

What I do instead is charge by the day for the needs of the shoot. Camera with op is X/day. Lighting with grip is Y/day. If I need to bring in an audio op to run several mics, that's another cost. If I need to add a prompter, that's yet another additional cost. Production is always a minimm of one day, with half day incremnts beyond that.

Post production is by the hour in half hour increments, with a 2 hour minumum. I've done enough work that I can usually estimate the post needs of a project fairly close.

This way clients pay for only the work their project requires, and every job makes a profit.
 
malibudutchie said:
How much to buy a car ? … Except for broadcast I charge what I think a client can afford or how much their budget is. Ask them for a ballpark budget and tell them what they can expect for that price. Do they want a ford or a Ferrari? ...
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Exactly this.

Every customer/client has a budget, even if they don't know anything about video production. Ask them what their budget range is. Then, because you've previously figured out your real costs of doing business, tell them what service and results you can provide within their budget. Emphasize you can customize your work to fit most any budget, and you charge a reasonable, fair & sustainable rate.

Whenever possible, charge by the hour. This is best for both you and the customer. And much easier and more accurate than carefully specifying exactly what you'll deliver for a fixed amount. If you do propose a fixed price, be sure to specify what the extra hourly charges will be for specific additional work.

If a customer/client is reluctant to tell you what their budget range is, push back diplomatically. If they insist on keeping this info to themselves, and don't want to pay by the hour, walk away. Otherwise you'll regret working for them.

Have fun!
 
I have to debate that a little. Most all crew/gear is rented on a half day or day rate so charging hourly doesnt really make sense except for thr post side.

Also, though ive seen the advice on here to ask about budget upfront, my personal experience has been that clients dont like divulging and it makes you the vendor seem greedy. Like theyre thinking youre gonna say "oh you have $3000 to spend?, then, um, yeah, coincidentally, um thats, um exactly what itll cost. Funny how that worked out."
 
We try and bundle an "all inclusive" rate and it is somewhere around $1500 per finished minute.
Its all relative to the style of the project. We also charge a la carte day rates for certain projects too. Just depends on the client. Corporate usually gets a la carte, small biz and non profits get all inclusive. I always use a home building analogy with a client that doesn't quite get it.

You want to build a home? Ok, do you want a condo, townhouse or single family?
Bump outs? Upgraded baths? Etc...

Charge what you're worth. I'd rather have 2-3 clients a year that sustain me and get it, rather than scratch and bottom feed for 20 that don't respect the craft or the effort that goes into to doing it right.
 
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John Foundas said:
I'd rather have 2-3 clients a year that sustain me and get it, rather than scratch and bottom feed for 20 that don't respect the craft or the effort that goes into to doing it right.
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That's my motto. Everyone else can scour Craigslist for the guys willing to do a week's worth of work for $500.

No thanks.
 
I have a page where I publicize our video gear for rental. It's a useful page because I can use those prices in a quote for potential customers.

Another point is estimate much you will charge for shooting, editing, post-prod etc.

I also add on top of that various costs (administrative costs, transportation, project management etc.).

I make sure that I present 2 quotes to the customer, a high-budget where they get top-of-the-line visuals, and another one that "does the job".

Generally, I can then send in a document detailing all costs.

PS: I've done charging by the minute in the past. It will work against you. Instead of a 4 minutes video, the customer came back wanting only 1 minute, but with same content etc. Which means you have to work as hard, if not much, and you'll get paid only 25% you were expecting
 
Josh Bass said:
Also, though ive seen the advice on here to ask about budget upfront, my personal experience has been that clients dont like divulging and it makes you the vendor seem greedy. Like theyre thinking youre gonna say "oh you have $3000 to spend?, then, um, yeah, coincidentally, um thats, um exactly what itll cost. Funny how that worked out."
Click to expand...

The fear is that you will come off that way, but if your service includes post-production as well, it's really not that strange to quote a flat fee. When working for other filmmakers, I charge my day-rate. When working for corporate clients I always ask for the budget, and make them understand that there are a wide range of options available. How many people on set? How many cameras? How is the product delivered? Any animation?

It's normal to quote a flat fee a bit high to protect yourself from contingencies, and most real companies will be able to understand this. You need to know what their budget is so you don't go over it, and you are going to put as much work towards it as you can to make the end product as good as possible. So if you are charging them hourly, you are either going to exceed their budget (believe me, they have one even if they don't want to tell you what it is), or you are going to underperform. Or, if you know what their budget is and still insist on charging hourly, you may save them, like, $75.

So I like to charge flat fees to my clients. One way that I explain this to them, if they balk, is that as a freelancer, the flat fee incentivizes my productivity. Since I'm not in the office, how can they tell if I'm really working, or just ramping up the hours watching YouTube? With a flat fee, my time efficiency is all my problem, not theirs.
 
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