So now that the prices for the CD 7Q have come out, is anyone considering moving to a scarlet package for around the same price? It seems to make sense if you aren't a doc/event shooter. You don't get the 240fps but you get 16 bit compressed 4k raw and don't need a bulky monitor/recorder rigged to the camera to get it.
Used Red Scarlet Package VS FS700 + CD 7Q
- Thread starter DanKov
- Start date
The reason I totally stopped considering the scarlet is that if I want to chg my frame rate it's at the cost of a crop. Also, I don't mind low res, but I like consistent res. When I shoot xsize and ysize and match they just won't look the same. Maybe it shows to me coz i know.
But the crop thing, was an instant dealbreaker. I won't be able to work as fast if I wanna keep track of it all.
I just don't appreciate the tradeoff, would rather a larger rig that provides a consistent size with variable fps. I don't want to change lenses to match fov and have to deal with that if i wanna jump up to 60+ fps.
My 2c. Other jobs have other priorities.
But the crop thing, was an instant dealbreaker. I won't be able to work as fast if I wanna keep track of it all.
I just don't appreciate the tradeoff, would rather a larger rig that provides a consistent size with variable fps. I don't want to change lenses to match fov and have to deal with that if i wanna jump up to 60+ fps.
My 2c. Other jobs have other priorities.
Owen Rennie
Member
Scarlets high speed is pretty useless... I never go above 48fps.. Push it to 60fps at 2k but what i read it doesnt look that good so i stay clear... Unless youtube compressed i guess..
I like the crop as i shoot surfing mainly so at 48fps it's fine...
Love my scarlet, picked it up used and been buying used parts on reduser over the last few months.. saved a fortune.. Red isn't as expensive as many believe.. I got 1 x 128gb card and i rarely even fill half of it... And my old mac pro sux but after trranscoding i get by... I dont know the CD 7Q but you won't regret red... unless it breaks of course
Owen
I like the crop as i shoot surfing mainly so at 48fps it's fine...
Love my scarlet, picked it up used and been buying used parts on reduser over the last few months.. saved a fortune.. Red isn't as expensive as many believe.. I got 1 x 128gb card and i rarely even fill half of it... And my old mac pro sux but after trranscoding i get by... I dont know the CD 7Q but you won't regret red... unless it breaks of course
Owen
Yes, the crop thing / slow motion issue on the Scarlet sucks and is a major issue, at least for me. They are still very different camera. Someone else said this about the BMC (but it still applies here); the FS700 is a Swiss Army Knife (it does a lot of things) while the Scarlet is a Machete (it does 4K really well).
If I were to only shoot 4K, I think the Scarlet would be better. But I can't afford all that drive space, RED RAW = 527.34 gigs per hour x 2 (for backup) and those hard drives will be filling up quick. So for me, it's compressed codec.
Now the 5DIII hack on the other hand has me interested. Once they get it figured out, there's probably going to be a 2.5K RAW option so the drive space won't be quite so crazy and it won't need a recorder (I hate recorders). I have all the confidence that the brilliant and super hard working guys at Magic Lantern will figure it out and make it amazing, so I might just pick up a 5DIII ($2900 brand new off E-Bay) for RAW, about the same price as a Convergent Design Recorder and the 5DIII will have a way longer shelf life IMO because I think recorders will soon be a thing of the past because the 5DIII hack has shown that recorders are not needed for RAW.
If I were to only shoot 4K, I think the Scarlet would be better. But I can't afford all that drive space, RED RAW = 527.34 gigs per hour x 2 (for backup) and those hard drives will be filling up quick. So for me, it's compressed codec.
Now the 5DIII hack on the other hand has me interested. Once they get it figured out, there's probably going to be a 2.5K RAW option so the drive space won't be quite so crazy and it won't need a recorder (I hate recorders). I have all the confidence that the brilliant and super hard working guys at Magic Lantern will figure it out and make it amazing, so I might just pick up a 5DIII ($2900 brand new off E-Bay) for RAW, about the same price as a Convergent Design Recorder and the 5DIII will have a way longer shelf life IMO because I think recorders will soon be a thing of the past because the 5DIII hack has shown that recorders are not needed for RAW.
nyvz
Veteran
Redcode raw has significantly lower storage requirements than nearly every other raw because it is compressed. At the most common shooting modes, scarlet is about 120GB per hour, NOT 500GB. Perhapa you are thinking of blackmagic/canon/arri/sony/convergent RAW which are all 300-1TB per hour?
5dmk3 raw is at least 2x more data than scarlet and 4x less resolution. And you'll likely be stuck choosing between heavy moire or huge crop and very expensive fast CF cards. Also skew looked horribly unusable in some tests...
Hey Noah,
I just saw this article that compares RED Epic data rates to the C500 to the F55. You definitely would know more than me about RAW, so I was just regurgitating what the article states
http://wolfcrow.com/blog/the-battle-for-4k-raw-a-red-epic-vs-canon-c500-sony-f55-price-comparison/
I just saw this article that compares RED Epic data rates to the C500 to the F55. You definitely would know more than me about RAW, so I was just regurgitating what the article states
http://wolfcrow.com/blog/the-battle-for-4k-raw-a-red-epic-vs-canon-c500-sony-f55-price-comparison/
nyvz
Veteran
Well those numbers are approximately correct for EPIC 5k 3:1, however even the biggest blockbuster movies (Spiderman, Hobbit, Prometheus, Gatsby, etc.) shooting on Epic rarely shoot with compression ratios lower than 5:1, and also you are comparing 5k RED RAW to 4k RAW Canon and Sony. Most people shooting on RED Scarlet or RED One shoot 4k at 7:1 or 8:1 compression, which is 4x less data than Epic's highest quality 5k 3:1. The nice thing about RED is you can change your resolution and compression for your needs, up to 18:1 compression, which at 4k or 5k is still probably fine for a lot of ENG/doc/longform shooting for 1080p delivery and still has the benefits of RAW. So more realistically instead of that article concluding RED media costs almost 2x as much as Sony/Canon, under normal circumstances it costs less than half Sony/Canon, with the flexibility to cost far far less.
http://www.red.com/tools/recording-time
Stuart Mannion
Member
Battery life, quietness (no fan), high frame rates, weight, flexibility to shoot compressed HD as well as later upgrade to raw OR Prores... some of the reasons I went with the fs700. Lets just hope that the image quality lives up to the expectations.
nyvz
Veteran
I agree, and the FS700 is one of the most convenient cameras currently available, and it puts out quite nice sharp images which will only get nicer with Slog. I use my FS700 so much more than my Scarlet for those reasons, but Scarlet does get a reasonably nice rental rate.
That said, for 4k+ RAW shooting, the upcoming Scarlet Dragon may really prove itself compared to all the competition, due to its supposedly greatly improved sensor and the compressed RAW workflow people have taken for granted but the new uncompressed RAW cameras will really show how important it is. I have yet to hear of anyone using any of the uncompressed RAW workflows for actual jobs, and I will be a bit surprised if it does catch on at all...
Stuart Mannion
Member
Good point Noah. I wonder if CD will implement Cineform compression at some point. To me uncompressed raw is not practical and the compression is one of the best aspects of the Red system.