Transmitters with the input limiter.

V

Vitz

New member
Hi all,

First time here. As many of you before, I'm deciding on which wireless system I should buy. Yes, I've read all sticky threads :) but couldn't find the answer. Any help would be much appreciated.

Besides Lectrosonics, Audio Ltd and Micron, is there any other company making transmitters with the input limiter? I believe this is an important feature which should be a standard and yet I can't find many models with it.

Thanks,
Vitz.
 
Why do you consider it important? Limiters are usually a last resort tool to cope with inadequate or poorly adjusted gain structure. Most decent radio microphones just need the maximum level setting depending on the subject, their volume and what they are doing. Distortion from over loud sources is more of a problem than transmitters with too little attenuation. If the mic bottoms out, then the limiter would be pointless. If the mic can cope with a very high SPL - maybe even >130dB, then the attenuator presets can cope well too. For uncontrolled situations, I can see a point - perhaps where you've adjusted the attenuator to cope with a handheld mic, at chest height with a quiet speaker, and then some idiot grabs it, cups the mic basket and raps into it - but that's rare (at least for me). None of my transmitters have a limiter, and even if they had, I'd probably not use it - preferring the wider dynamic range the modern kit can reproduce.
 
Vitz said:
Besides Lectrosonics, Audio Ltd and Micron, is there any other company making transmitters with the input limiter? I believe this is an important feature which should be a standard and yet I can't find many models with it.
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In my view, limiters are more of a pre-amp feature, and are thus found mostly on field mixers. That said, the high end mics that you point out have them. Perhaps the industry just sees limiters as added functionality that helps differentiate high end mics from low-mid level mics. IDK.
 
Limiters are important for transmitters so that the transmitted signal (modulated RF carrier) does not exceed your countries regulations for deviation. Without a limiter, you can overmodulate.

Thus, the quality of the limiter becomes important. Usually, we recommend that for the best possible signal to noise, and for the best transmission characteristics (including range) that users should set their transmitter gain so that the peak audio signals just touch the limiter. On the Lectrosonics transmitters, this is indicated by seeing the -20 LED blink red. In other words, you want as much gain as possible before hitting the limiter hard on peaks.

The other thing that limiters are good for is the unexpected loud peaks you might get in an inspired performance. A good limiter might make the difference between a keeper and a re-take.
 
The new Zaxcom transmitters have NeverClip. Basically gives you 130db dynamic range, if I understand it right. I was actually playing with one today and it was pretty cool.
 
Thanks.

Those guys who don't use the limiter, don't you compromise on s/n ratio? Keeping 20dB of a headroom just in case if an actor decides to add more emotions... Isn't the noise a major issue of all wireless systems (forget a transmission for now, speaking of an audio signal quality only)?
 
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Vitz said:
Thanks.

Those guys who don't use the limiter, don't you compromise on s/n ratio? Keeping 20dB of a headroom just in case if an actor decides to add more emotions... Isn't the noise a major issue of all wireless systems (forget a transmission for now, speaking of an audio signal quality only)?
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I would not say noise is any longer a major concern with wireless mic system signal quality. Most of the systems developed during the past 10 years have excellent sound quality, including low noise if set up properly.
 
It's fair to say that in theatre - my main area, tweaking the sensitivity is the only real requirement - as long as the mics themselves are able to cope, then I've never had issues. I do quite like the variable gain systems, rather than stepped preset ones - I've spent the morning with 12 channels of Shure - not one I'd normally use, and the rotary gain trimmer was actually quite handy.
 
I don't recall that microns had limiters as such and it was more like a compander that optimised the signal to noise ratio on the VHF ones we used in the 80's and 90's. They also had a very slow release time so if you set them too high you get in all sorts of trouble with PA feedback.

As others have stated modern radio mics tend to have a very good signal to noise ratio and just setting the sensitivity should be all that is required but I still think most of them will have some form of circuit to optimise the frequency modulation.

Personally I use sennheiser G2 radio mics and have found them excellent and very easy to set-up, we used to set the microns to have the modulation LED on for normal speech but then if we shouted the red overload LED would come on. I still use a similar method with the G2 and set the sensitivity to suit the loudest peaks so I am not overloading the transmitter.
 
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