Thinking about MUD

Very interesting.

If the mud issue disappears with certain lenses and it is all down to the kit lens overloading the CPU then this would warrant a whole new thread in itself.

I just got the Leica 25mm F1.4 4/3rds lens. AF and aperature work fine via the official Panasonic 4/3rds adapter. Was unable to produce mud in 1080 24p with it (yet).

Have not noticed any mud with my 'dumb' lenses either... Zeiss CY, Canon FD or Canon EFS.

But I have a theory as to why this is...

Depth of field. The shallow DOF blurs a large portion of the image, meaning less detail is delivered to the CPU. The kit lens can be very flat and detailed at 14mm.

To test this theory I am gonna do some mud tests with my dumb Canon EFS 10-22mm versus the kit lens at 14-22mm tonight.

I have only tended to use my fast F1.4 lenses at night, where we know mud is not so much of an issue. It only really happens with brightly detailed day time scenes, i.e. trees, gardens, etc.
 
ryansheffer said:
Mud is not gotten rid of by using manual lenses. This is not correct. Blurred backgrounds, however mud much less.
Click to expand...

I dunno.

My testing has gone well so far.

I shot a few whip pans at infinity, a flat scene containing a lot of detail - asphalt, trees, red brick buildings...

With the kit lens I had mud.

With my Leica 25mm F1.4 via the 4/3rds adapter (which is not entirely dumb - it has fly by wire control via electronic contacts for AF, exposure, f stop, etc.) I did not have mud.

If mud is solved I am gonna hold a party in the street.

If mud is solved... my kit lens may even end up on eBay. I hear they're worth quite a bit :) Did the GH1 bargain just get a whole lot better?

Okay, for travel and convenience the kit lens is a must have, but for film making I simply don't need it.
 
Did you set the kit lens to 25mm? I mean, dumb question, but you know I gotta ask...

... man, I wish I had the GH1 right now to test what you're talking about.

But seriously, commanderspike has made the muddiest footage ever posted, so if he's not getting mud, that's... well, I gotta think he knows what he's talking about!
 
Is it possible the mud issue is exacerbated by the kit lens' computer controlledness? Like I know it does distortion and chromatic aberation correction in lens right? Regardless of the effects on what the camera's CPU is doing it is true that it does some correction to the image which is bound to cause problems in certain situations...hmm. I never tried trying to get mud on my other lenses...but now that you mentioned it most of the mud I've seen is kit lens....I think I managed to get some mud with my Nikon 50mm when i got a dash-board mount shot and it wasn't secured and was vibrating a lot (this was also in low light) I am so whip-panning my freaking camera when I get home with a manual lens on it!

We shall see!

I will post some frame grabs which is where the mud really is the worse, because on video sometimes it gets sort of hidden :)
 
I had a shot on a project yesterday that had a lot of greenery in the frame. There were trees blowing in the background and I can see some mud and pixelation in them. Used a Zeiss ZF 50mm lens. So I don't think you can avoid mud by just using a manual lens. You just need to be careful with camera movement. If you do have camera movement make them slow and smooth.
 
So, I just did a bunch of tests with my FDs vs the kit lens.

Basically - I have the same amount of mud on either lens, or at least close to it. However, when there is shallow depth of field, there is nearly no mud.

Keep this camera at a 2.8 or below and you will be a happy camper. Also - lowering the saturation and contrast in camera is key for lowering macro blocking, but it still happens on bright colors specifically red.

Man...so close to being sooo great.
 
Well I was playing around whipping it with a manual lens and was actually really impressed by how little mud there was...got it in a few places but it's really not too bad, hides nicely in with the fast motion, just like the rolling shutter jello, and seems to not only not show up at most points but when it does just for a few frames...usually when the whip changes direction or rotates suddenly. This kind of goes along with a theory I have about heavy vibration being particularly bad for mud creation. Maybe the kind of vibration you get with OIS on the kit lens rather than standard vibration is more prone to mud?
 
Of course there'll be less macroblocking with a shallower DOF; there's less detail overall. :P

Right now I'm more frustrated with my skills than the camera!
 
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