The Limb Salesman, 35mm film shot on DVX100

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cineman9

Member
On Sunday I caught a screening of the low-budget Canadian feature "The Limb Salesman" at the Vancouver International Film Festival. I really had no interest in seeing the film until I learned it was shot entirely on the DVX100 and transferred to 35mm. Once I heard this, I had to check it out.

Overall, I felt the DVX images held up on the big screen. I am comfortable in saying that this camera is a viable tool for independent film production. The 24p progressive scan capture seems to deliver the goods. In fact, it does the job as good as I've seen for mini DV but without that awful streaking blur typically associated with films shot in 60i. Oh, and the focus looks great.

This said, there are some problems worthy of note -- most significantly with color/contrast range and image detail.

Throughout the movie, there is a consistent lack of range between the brightest and darkest points on the screen. This is most notable when, say, an actor inside a room stands in front of a bright window or in scenes where one part of the screen is lit but the rest is covered in darkness. The intensity you'd expect for these extremes isn't there. Same goes for the spectrum of the colors. Shots of flickering candles, for example, come off pretty flat. Not the rich oranges you're used to. Don't get me wrong, the DVX has great color for a mini DV camera. But having seen so many films shot on film, my brain knows that things can look better.

The issue of image detail comes into play for long shots. Although the camera is very impressive in capturing close-ups and medium shots, the limits of resolution are apparent when things go wide. The weakest shots in the film are the establishing shots.

To be fair, and perhaps even to the credit of the DVX, all of these issues seem to do with inherent limitations of the mini DV format. It would be silly to expect HD quality from an SD camera. At the end of the day, I am impressed by what can be done with this camera.

Not that this does anything to save a bad script which...well...I'll leave it to you to search for reviews on this film.

You can find more info on "The Limb Salesman" at http://www.thelimbsalesman.com. Cheers, everyone.
 
Re: The Limb Salesman, 35mm film shot on DVX100

Another thing to consider is the camera user. The DVX has such a vast range of control over the image, that what you saw may not be the best that it can get. You can easily get past a lot of miniDV's limitations by controlling the environment with appropriate lighting and limiting the amount of long shots. Resolution, as you say, is really missing when there is a lot of detail in landscape shots, for example.

The color is another thing that can be controlled almost infinitely on the DVX and I suspect the cinematographer did not utilize this to the best advantage if you are aware of the limited color range.

There's no doubt about it, the DVX will be overshadowed by film's relatively huge latitude and its color range but I think the DVX is capable of looking a lot better than you reported in this instance.
 
Re: The Limb Salesman, 35mm film shot on DVX100

Excellent points, disjecta. I'll say again that the images looked very good and certainly were among the best I've experienced for miniDV. Without having seen any other DVX-to-35mm films, it's difficult for me to gauge how well the images did/did not live up to the potential of the camera.

Another thing I don't know about that is hugely important is whether or not they shot using an anamorphic lens. Also, it might be worthwhile to know about the details of the transfer to film. Not all processes are made equal.

One thing I might add, and this has nothing to do with the DVX, is that the whole movie is shot using a ridiculously high shutter speed. I guess the director thought it would make for a unique look for the film's "retro-futuristic" setting. Personally, I didn't go for it at all. It didn't impact my opinion of the DVX as it was clearly a creative choice. I just thought it made for a poor aesthetic.

I'd like to know what others think; has anyone out there seen this film?
 
Re: The Limb Salesman, 35mm film shot on DVX100

Hey Darth, just wanted to ask if you knew whether or not the anamorphic adapter was used. We are blowing up a short film to 35mm pretty soon and we rented an anamorphic adapter for the shoot. IT was a challenge to work with, but I am very pleased with the results.
 
Re: The Limb Salesman, 35mm film shot on DVX100

Hi Scharky,

No, the anamorphic lens was not used, it was cropped in post. Also, it was shot with the DVX 100 (not the dvx 100A), and was shot in the 24pNormal mode as opposed to the Advanced mode. Also, my understanding is that the DV tapes weren't firewired into an editing program, but were instaed transfered to digibeta, then dumped into an Avid(I think I'm right about that, but not100% sure). So shooting with the ana and editing through a firewire native NLE could potentially give you better results. Go to the link I posted in my last post above yours.

Geoff
 
Re: The Limb Salesman, 35mm film shot on DVX100

From what I've seen (including my own work), the DVX100 and the DVX100a hold up on the big screen well enough for the average audience. The acceptance of the movie then goes back to what it should be; the storytelling merit of the production.

And I agree that wide shots suffer seriously from both miniDV limitations and the fixed lens of the Panny camera. The fact that we can't swap lenses on our Precious is my single largest complaint about the DVX100 line. I'm currently working on a project where I've got to get some establishing shots of Colorado, and I've been out and about three separate times, in the right place at the right time, and I haven't been happy with anything I've captured so far. This is a very frustrating problem to deal with; I've gotten so used to having a huge amount of control over what the camera records to tape.

Even for all that, I am extremely pleased with this camera. It simply delivers very high value for the price. I showed a music video in Las Vegas about 6 months ago on a 22 ft screen, and an industry insider paid me a great compliment by pulling me aside and asking me how much I paid for HD camera rentals. When I told him it was a $3500 miniDV camera, his jaw hit the floor, he looked back at the screen, and demanded that we play the video again. We did later that evening, and I got his business card right then, and a follow-up phone call the next week.
 
Re: The Limb Salesman, 35mm film shot on DVX100

For the record, I thought the Limb Salesman looked better on the big screen than 28 Days Later, by a long shot.

That said, I saw Limb on a smaller art house screen, and 28 on a huge gigaplex screen. Still, There were times when watching Limb that I was astonished with the beauty of the image, where as 28 never looked beautiful to me, just raw(Of course that rawness worked within the context of the film).

Geoff
 
Re: The Limb Salesman, 35mm film shot on DVX100

Thanks for your answer, and for me 28 days later looked beautiful just at the end and ,as i was told ,this section was shot in 35 mm. Maybe the video is good for making dvd or tv production and not for sending to 35mm or maybe it could achieve the film look or a better look but it´s not convenient for the big movie market tha has spent millions in getting 35mm equitment. I am not an expert in that, but that is what i see.
 
Re: The Limb Salesman, 35mm film shot on DVX100

Remember that "28 days later" was shoot first with pixelshift technolgy beacause of the lack of native res on the CCD, then its used the fake 25p with gave it about 360 lines of res. after that they cropped it wich means they ended upp with a picture of 720*200 in res. Then count in all the other drawback the camera has compared to the DVX.

But of course in the middle of the film I was so in the story to not be bothered with it.
 
Re: The Limb Salesman, 35mm film shot on DVX100

[quote author=speedbump link=board=nws;num=1097049415;start=0#7 date=10/08/04 at 18:28:42]
And I agree that wide shots suffer seriously from both miniDV limitations and the fixed lens of the Panny camera.  [/quote]

i agree the wide shots lack detail. typical of almost any DV cam. but ,the anamorphic lense increases detail on wide shots drastically. IMHO, when blown up, theres really no comparison between a wide shot with the ana compared to one from the standard lense. its really that much better.
 
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