The interior mic question

egproductions

egproductions

Veteran
I know this question has been asked a thousand times but I'm about to make the purchase and wanted to run it by you guys one more time. I want a top notch interior mic (think glass office space) in the $1k range. I currently have a 416 and it's served me well, however, rear rejection (or lack thereof) can be a problem at times. I'm thinking a hypercardiod for situations where I have two speakers having a conversation with eachother. I'm going to be using this mic with a Mix-Pre D

Also, is it crazy to pair my 416 with a hypercardiod for situations where I have two people interviewing (and talking to camera) at the same time? Will the difference in sound characteristics be jarring to the viewer?

Thank you!
 
I've had a Sennheiser MKH50 for just over 2 years now and it has served me fantastically well on a lot of indoor sit-down corporate interview shoots.

That's a mic with a reputation as a "indoor boom mic" which is the reason I invested in it.

I'm not much of an audio guy, but the mic has been superb to me. As long as I get it aimed at the person's mouth and within about 2 feet, it's always sounded great with minimal effort.

Even outside it's worked really well for me too.

I can't speak about the sound quality difference - I imagine the average person won't notice -- but something like the quality between a boom mic and lav mic, they might.
 
DPA 4017b or Sanken CS3e. These are the two that I go for. A Sennheiser MKH50 will also work well, but the off axis attenuation of the 4017 and the CS3e are the most natural of any mic I've used.
 
Two people in the same room really need the same mics, or at least two that can be eq'd well enough to sound the same. Are the mics going to be in vision? I saw the 'glass office space' and the sound of that kind of space just sounded alarm bells for any form of distance miking - can they not wear lav mics? For me, booming in reflective spaces has to be the worst, and tiny movements of the mics have a big impact on the 'fingerprint' of the room sound. It makes editing very tricky, as you really have to keep both mics up in the mix, because they sound very particular, and dipping one even just a bit is very obvious. If you like the 416, why not just borrow or hire one more for the day. I'm somebody who actually doesn't mind their sound indoors, as long as the aiming is done properly.Despite having hypers in my mic box, I really don't use them very often at all!
 
egproductions said:
Also, is it crazy to pair my 416 with a hypercardiod for situations where I have two people interviewing (and talking to camera) at the same time? Will the difference in sound characteristics be jarring to the viewer?
Click to expand...

Crazy? No. Try it and see how you like it.

Jarring to the viewer? Hard to say. But the differences in sound characteristics will most likely be noticeable. They might not be so bad if you hear them separately, but if you're cutting back and forth... just about anyone who's paying attention will hear it.

This is due to the way shotgun mics work; how an interference tube mic reacts when faced with rapid reflections off of walls / ceilings, which tends to cause comb filtering artifacts in the recording. Which is why interference tube mics are generally discouraged when recording interiors. Not that it can't be done and done well, but it takes some thought and effort to successfully pull off a shotgun in a small room as you probably already know.

My advice, such as it is, is to not use them together inside. If you need two hypers, you can find hypers that are almost as good as the MHK50 for about half the price, like the AT 4053b and the Audix SCX1-HC. With a MixPre-D you'll have loads of high quality gain available, so either should do fine (that is, my AT 4053b works really well with my MixPre-D).

Alternatively, you could put a lav on each subject. I typically use an Oscar SoundTech 802 and a 6m XLR cable for sit down interviews.

But if you really want to boom two, and you really want Hollywood level sound quality, you'll want a pair of hypers like the MHK 50, MHK 8050 (less size/weight, easier to boom), or Schoeps CMC6-mk41s (best sounding dialog mic I've ever heard). And none of these pairs are within your budget. Sigh....
 
paulears said:
and tiny movements of the mics have a big impact on the 'fingerprint' of the room sound.
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This is due to funky off axis stuff happening in some mics. You should really check out the DPA 4017. I was stunned at how good the off axis stuff sounded. It was just like pulling a fader down. Doesn't color the sound at all. Really natural sounding.
 
This forum needs a wiki.

It would be nice if there was a page about different shotgun mics, that just lists them, with whatever notes on each our forum members want to make. Now that would be valuable!
 
combatentropy said:
This forum needs a wiki.

It would be nice if there was a page about different shotgun mics, that just lists them, with whatever notes on each our forum members want to make. Now that would be valuable!
Click to expand...

Agreed it would be handy!

I've already done a comprehensive article for all the lower priced recorders:
http://ironfilm.co.nz/which-sound-r...various-indie-priced-sound-recorders-in-2017/

Shotgun mics and wireless are the next two topics on my list to cover.
 
Two Audix SCX1-hc should serve you well for your budget. I guess this is for OMB shoots, rigged talking heads, so the mics have to be earned back and make money (fast IMHO).
For anything else: Hire a sound person :)
 
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egproductions said:
Also, is it crazy to pair my 416 with a hypercardiod for situations where I have two people interviewing (and talking to camera) at the same time? Will the difference in sound characteristics be jarring to the viewer?
Click to expand...
I don't think so, generally speaking, as two different people are supposed to sound different. However, if you're interviewing identical twins (or clones) you really want to use two matching microphones because people will be expecting them to sound the same.

I have a Sanken CS3-e (for outdoors) and a Schoeps CMC641 (for indoors). For two person indoor shoots, I'll use them together since I don't own two of each. Sometimes with lavs as well.
 
The 416 will grab a lot more room reverb than a decent hyper/interior mic, and as pointed out, the 416 ain't great off axis. More so on both counts than the CS3e, ime.

So I think pairing a 416 with a hyper/interior mic could be kinda jarring, depending on the room. Could you buy a pair of lower-price hypers such as the Audix SCX1-HC or AT4053. I'm not super familiar with either, but if you can demo/rent a pair you could quickly figure out if they're work for you.

But I think I'm repeating what has already been written here. So I'll stop.
 
combatentropy said:
This forum needs a wiki.

It would be nice if there was a page about different shotgun mics, that just lists them, with whatever notes on each our forum members want to make. Now that would be valuable!
Click to expand...

I actually put a little something like that together nine years ago. Doesn't have the newer mics like the DPA but I had the MKH-50, CS3e and CMC-641. Sennheiser, at the time, didn't have a 416 to loan but they did loan me the MKH-50, which is a much better sounding mic IMHO.
http://www.kenstone.net/fcp_homepage/right_mic_brockett.html
 
puredrifting said:
I actually put a little something like that together nine years ago. Doesn't have the newer mics like the DPA but I had the MKH-50, CS3e and CMC-641. Sennheiser, at the time, didn't have a 416 to loan but they did loan me the MKH-50, which is a much better sounding mic IMHO.
http://www.kenstone.net/fcp_homepage/right_mic_brockett.html
Click to expand...

Dan,
That post is as close to gospel as one can get. It would not be a bad idea to repeat that with new mics if possible.

Cheers,
Sabyasachi
 
That post brought the Audio-Technica AT875R to my attention. It was the only one that kept my head relaxed when listening. (Mics are so similar that I have to listen to my body, my feelings, as I listen --- instead of trying to consciously hear their differences directly. Then again, I'm not much of a pro.)
 
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