The All Inclusive Post!

Eraserhead2416

Eraserhead2416

Active member
Ok! I'm going to purchase the DVX100A late summer/ early autumn. With it, I'm going to do some short films, along with some promo work to raise funds for a feature film I'm going to shoot Summer 2005. Should I call it a film, since I'm not actually using film?

Anyway, I'd just like to get a lot of my questions out in a single post. So here goes-
1. Looking at Promax.com they talk about DV systems and SD systems. I'm under the impression that DVX is SD and DV... so what's the difference?
2. MiniDV tapes! I've heard of a dry process (Panasonic?) and a "wet" process (Sony?). Dry is better, correct? What are my choices for dry tapes?
3. I've heard DVX footage compared to 16mm quality. How close is that to truth? I'm hoping for, later on, a theatrical run of this feature and I'd like to make sure it looks good blown up to 35mm. Is there any good info on the process used by 28 Days Later to get DV to film at a relatively good quality? I'd think that DVX footage would look better than said movie?
4. Is there any loss to quality when capturing DVX footage through a firewire as opposed to a capture card? I'm told no, it depends on codec used by card. If so, is there a way I can just get the codec? Perferably for a very low price, somewhere around the free range?
5. Anamorphic lens adapter? Why? $800 isn't too much after a $3.5k purchase, but is it necessary? I've usually shot with electric tape on the LCD screen to simulate the bars and then placed the bars in post. How would the anamorphic lens help? Does it give me option to change mm? Like shoot a 50mm plain, then go for a slightly warped 16mm, or allow a bit more space in the frame with a 24mm? THAT would be useful, especially for $800.

Okay, that's all I have for now. I'm sure I'll have more later. I'd just like to make sure I have all bases covered before I embark on something so expensive.
 
Re: The All Inclusive Post!

OK...since nobody smarter about this than me is answering...I'll give you my best shot!

[quote author=Eraserhead2416 link=board=Links;num=1080847180;start=0#0 date=04/01/04 at 11:19:40]Should I call it a film, since I'm not actually using film?[/quote]

I call mine movies. I like it better anyway, regardless of any other fact.

[quote author=Eraserhead2416 link=board=Links;num=1080847180;start=0#0 date=04/01/04 at 11:19:40]1. Looking at Promax.com they talk about DV systems and SD systems.  I'm under the impression that DVX is SD and DV...  so what's the difference?[/quote]

The DVX is indeed SD DV...so I have no idea...but I'd definately check out EVS and call Rush at the Glendale office to get your DVXuser.com discount. He's a great man, and you'll only hear one long gone man argue that.

[quote author=Eraserhead2416 link=board=Links;num=1080847180;start=0#0 date=04/01/04 at 11:19:40]2. MiniDV tapes!  I've heard of a dry process (Panasonic?) and a "wet" process (Sony?).  Dry is better, correct?  What are my choices for dry tapes?[/quote]

You'll want the Panasonic Master Quality tapes....Rush will sell them to you at DVXuser.com priced as if you were buying them 50 or more bulk.

[quote author=Eraserhead2416 link=board=Links;num=1080847180;start=0#0 date=04/01/04 at 11:19:40]3. I've heard DVX footage compared to 16mm quality.  How close is that to truth?  I'm hoping for, later on, a theatrical run of this feature and I'd like to make sure it looks good blown up to 35mm.  Is there any good info on the process used by 28 Days Later to get DV to film at a relatively good quality?  I'd think that DVX footage would look better than said movie?[/quote]

I think it's the best miniDV image out there...I would give up too much comparing...it is not film and it is not any other video camera either...it has it's own distinct look, and that look is the grandest look for it's price that you're going to get. Most people suggest that you contact the transfer house you are going to use to find out how they would like you to set your camera for their process. And I'm sure the DVX will produce a better image than the XL1s which was used in 28 days.

[quote author=Eraserhead2416 link=board=Links;num=1080847180;start=0#0 date=04/01/04 at 11:19:40]4.  Is there any loss to quality when capturing DVX footage through a firewire as opposed to a capture card?  I'm told no, it depends on codec used by card.  If so, is there a way I can just get the codec?  Perferably for a very low price, somewhere around the free range?[/quote]

You'll want to capture into Vegas for PC or Final Cut Pro for the MAC...that's just the consensus that has been reached. Preimier doesn't know what to do with the pulldown the DVX uses. It will be lossless to the best of my humble knowlege.

[quote author=Eraserhead2416 link=board=Links;num=1080847180;start=0#0 date=04/01/04 at 11:19:40]5.  Anamorphic lens adapter?  Why?  $800 isn't too much after a $3.5k purchase, but is it necessary?  I've usually shot with electric tape on the LCD screen to simulate the bars and then placed the bars in post.  How would the anamorphic lens help?  Does it give me option to change mm?  Like shoot a 50mm plain, then go for a slightly warped 16mm, or allow a bit more space in the frame with a 24mm?  THAT would be useful, especially for $800.[/quote]

Try shooting with the squeeze mode first, then check out the adapter. I like the squeeze mode just fine!
 
Re: The All Inclusive Post!

Is there any true advantage to editing true 24fps? Vegas would just do the pulldown like After Effects, right? So there's no change in quality, at least.

I don't mind rendering for four days, or something ridiculous like that, especially if it saves a large chunk of money.

Also, is there some sort of promo DVD I can get from Panasonic? I'd like to see at least some end results from the DVX without traveling a day to Chicago (nearest big city) to visit a shop.
 
Re: The All Inclusive Post!

1. DV/SD: DV is not SD.  They are different formats.  SD (Standard Definition) is the next step up from DV in much the same way that HD (High Definition) is the next step up from SD.  The reason why there are different systems for DV and SD is that SD requires more of everything (Processor speed, RAM, higher quality codec, disk space) to be able to edit it.  AFAIK, all SD capable NLEs still need a special capture card and hardware acceleration to be able to actually edit native SD.

2. Panasonic will (obviously) say that their brand of tapes are "made" for their cams.  This may be absolutely true, but it is also marketting.  I have seen no real reports on the effects of using Sony's "wet" tapes in Panny cams other vice-versa.  But what I have seen is the ill effects of mixing these different types of tapes in you cam.  The most important thing is to start with one type of tape and stick with it.  Very bad things can happen if you mix them  :-[

3. I think most people comparing the DVX to film would be more likely to comment on the similarity of its "look" or "motion" rather than the image quality.  Nevertheless, the DVX produces the best image quality (interlaced and progressive) of any MiniDV cam I've seen.  Many have had great results with film transfers from the DVX.  Hopefully Barry will chime in here as he has done some tests of film transfers from the DVX.  Technical prowess aside, the "quality" of the DVX's image is of course more determinant of how it was used and the skill of the camera operator/DP.

4. Firewire is the best way to go for DV footage.  DV will not lose any quality from the capture process unless something is terribly wrong with the capture codec.  Any NLE will come with a codec, and you could also buy one if you choose.  It's the opinion of many that Sony's DV codec (aquired from Sonic Foundry) has the best DV codec on the PC side.  On the mac side, you've really only got a couple choices, of which might actually all use the same quicktime DV codec anyway.  In short, you don't need a separate capture card to capture DV at its highest quality; any firewire port will do.

5. As suggested try shooting without the adapter and seeing if that's good enough for you before jumping in.  Many people seem to have complaints about the panny anamorphic adapter.  I haven't used it, so I can't really comment.

Yes, Vegas does allow you to edit on a true 24p timeline.  The question isn't really why would you want to edit this way if you've shot in 24p, but rather why wouldn't you?  You're matching up your editing timeline to the media.  This almost guarantees the most trouble free editing.  Also, rendering will be faster as there would be less frames to render.

Finally, Promax used to send out a DVX demo DVD with a scene shot by the DVX and the PD150 so that you could compare the two types of cams under the same conditions.  They may still be sending them out, try contacting them.
 
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