Tascam DR-60D or Marantz PMD661 Mk. II

W

wejackson

New member
Hi everyone,

I'm currently looking for a portable sound recorder to go with my Canon EOS 600D to make a few short corporate films. I currently own a Rode NTG2 and Rode Lavalier from previous projects.

In the past I've borrowed a friend's Zoom H4n to record audio, however I've always been pretty disappointed in the sound quality (lots of hiss, weird rumbling noises, crackling in the headphones). These problems are present when using both the NTG2 and Lavalier and with different XLR cables, so I'm assuming it's the recorder as fault. As I'd like to make a good job of these films, I'm looking to buy a recorder for myself - hopefully one a little better than the Zoom!

When I was at University I used to use Marantz PMD661's, which I generally found to be pretty good, so it seemed like an easy decision to buy one now. I also used to have a Marantz PMD222 cassette field recorder in the past, which was also very good until it died. However, now that Tascam have released the DR-60D, this choice has become a little more complicated.

From what I can tell, the DR-60D offers more features and good sound quality for only £300, while the Marantz sells for about £380. I like that the Marantz has analogue pots for sound level and LED meters, but I also really like the dual mono feature and convenient shape of the Tascam.

I'm aware that the Rode NTG2 puts out a comparatively weak signal, so the recorder I buy will hopefully have to have some pretty good preamps to avoid hiss.

Any ideas which would be the best recorder for me would be really appreciated!

Thanks,
Will
 
Last edited:
Hi Will, Welcome to the forum! There has been no posting of any really careful testing of the DR-60D preamps, let alone a direct comparison of it with the PMD661, yet, as far as I am aware. But the few samples posted, opinions and common sense (i.e. look at its specs, the op amp it uses, and its price) support the conclusion that any increase in preamp quality from the DR100 mkii is marginal. Of course, this isn't radically different from the PMD661. Add in the self-noise of the mics that you have (the NTG2 is OK but not stellar, and the lav - like most lavs - is noisier), then the difference in preamps will be less obvious, even with perfect technique. So I suspect the best choice for you of either of these units (or, indeed, another recorder or, better still recorder + preamp/mixer option) will be defined by how you plan to work, and you haven't given us very much to go on. When thinking about this, and how the different functions and form factors of the recorders might best suit you, you will need to consider how your two mics (and any others you buy - for example you may want a hypercardioid mic too) will be used: e.g. are you planning external recorder sound only or dual sound? I assume that the NTG2 will be boomed, so how will the boom operator monitor it if you are planning to have the recorder at the camera (as your liking of the DR-60D form factor suggests)? How will the Rode lav be connected (if wired, then you might be better off with a more pocketable recorder like the DR100mkii or, much smaller, [if lack of XLRs isn't a problem] the more affordable Sony M10, which could be used with either of your mics anyway and which similar quality preamps)? And then there is the question of where you see yourself going with this (i.e. thinking about what kit - such as a preamp/mixer - might be the most sensible investment for the longer term)...Cheers, Roland
 
Thanks for the reply. Sorry, I should probably have been a bit more specific!

Usually it's just me shooting, which I do by hanging the Zoom off a strap on my shoulder while either holding the camera on a rig or just having it on a tripod. I'm afraid it's a pretty low budget affair and I am fairly new to this, but as I've got a few jobs lined up where the clients are actually willing to pay me, I'd like to make the most of what I've got.

As I know I can get by holding the Zoom on a shoulder strap, it's not really so much of an issues if I have to do the same with the Marantz (the Marantz should actually be an improvement in this regard as the gain control and meters are on the side of the unit), however being able to put the Tascam underneath the camera on the rig could be quite convenient providing it doesn't get in the way. When I've used the lavalier in the past, it has just been for upper body mid shots, so I've been able to get away with running the XLR cable from the talent to the recorder without it appearing on camera. If I have to use the NTG2, I will normally bring someone else in to hold the boom and sound recorder. I am looking at working with just sound from the recorder, though I am interested in the Tascam's ability to relay sound to the camera as a potential backup.

While I like the idea of having a small recorder to go in the talent's pocket, I'd be a bit worried about not being able to monitor the sound; I imagine finding out in post that someone forgot to turn their phone off would not be very pleasant. Maybe I'm being a bit paranoid though.

A pre-amp/mixer is something I've considered, but I think right now I'd just like to get the best recorder I can afford so I can build upon it later with such things.

I suppose my priority right now is what's going to produce the best recordings with the microphones I have available to me. If things go well, I hope to upgrade them in the future, so something with XLR and 48v phantom power would be preferable.
 
wejackson said:
While I like the idea of having a small recorder to go in the talent's pocket, I'd be a bit worried about not being able to monitor the sound; I imagine finding out in post that someone forgot to turn their phone off would not be very pleasant. Maybe I'm being a bit paranoid though.
Click to expand...

That's not paranoid, that's just being smart. You should *always* monitor sound. What "would not be very pleasant" is telling a client that you screwed over his sound, or worse, didn't capture any sound at all. Great way to trash your rep. Just sayin'.

wejackson said:
A pre-amp/mixer is something I've considered, but I think right now I'd just like to get the best recorder I can afford so I can build upon it later with such things.
Click to expand...

The point of the DR-60D, as I see it anyway, is that it's a pre-amp / mixer / recorder in one box. It's aimed directly at one-man-bands. The lack of analog level controls (it uses digital pots that create an audible "step" in volume when moved) isn't that big a deal for the target market -- a one-man-band has too high a workload to be able to ride audio levels. Best we can hope for is to set the levels about where they need to be, then listen on headphones as we run the camera. This only works reasonably well if your recording system includes decent limiters, which the DR-60D apparently does have.

Fortunately for me, my need isn't immediate. I can wait until more people buy and use the DR-60D and start to make some comparisons available on the 'net. But clearly, I'm predisposed to like what Tascam has done here.
 
Will, thanks for additional info. Not sure if there's anything much that can be added: you are best placed to choose which recorder on the basis of functionality and form factor. Personally, with a limited budget and your type of simple set up, I'd go for a Sound Devices MM-1 (will last for years, is very simple to use, has the great SD limiters and preamps, and is very useful even in a much more sophisticated set up) into a recorder with a proper +4dbu line level input (which need not be as expensive as your two options), but I can't deny that this would cost a little more, not least given the recent hike in SD prices! Yes, you are right to be able to monitor the lav sound if you can (and it sounds as if the XLR-cabled connection is not a problem in your shooting - presumably of fairly static talent). The DR60D form factor sounds up your street: just make certain that you have been following the various threads on this and other forums that discuss its functionality, so you are not in for any surprises. Cheers, R
 
Thanks for the help everyone. It looks like the DR-60D may be the best choice if it fairs well in the reviews. I think I'll wait as long as I can before buying and see what the early buyers think of it, though the consensus seems quite positive so far. That Sound Devices MM-1 definitely looks like something I will consider down the line, when I have a little extra money to spend.
 
My budget is about £400. I could possibly stretch a bit further, but not by much. I was also considering a Fostex FR2LE for £454, but wasn't sure from the reviews I'd read that it would be a large enough improvement over the PMD661 to justify the extra ~£70. Of course, if the DR-60D can give me acceptable sound quality for £319, then that would be more money left over for the ever increasing list of equipment I seem to need!
 
I like the marantz 661 + a digital aes to spdf cable digigal made for me. That with a SD Mix Pre D and it is insane--i can do a comparison between the 661, tascam if you want?
 
swaneon said:
I like the marantz 661 + a digital aes to spdf cable digigal made for me. That with a SD Mix Pre D and it is insane--i can do a comparison between the 661, tascam if you want?
Click to expand...


Hi swaneon, I'd love an in depth audio quality comparison between the 661 & the dr-60d.

I was ready to place an order for the tascam but after carefull consideration, it appears to me that the form factor makes little sense to me. In additon to that I hate the idea of digital knobs instead of real potentiometers. Of course they look like they are easier to handle...

Since I am after a quality recorder in that price range I narrowed it down to the tascam dr-60d, roland r26 and the Marantz pmd661.
From what I understand the 661 is a bit cleaner than the r26 but I haven't found any straight comparison with the dr-60d.

I'd appreciate if you could make one.

Also, one last thing. I read some reviewers saying that the operating system on the 661 is a bit old and not so easy to use. What is your experience?

many thanks
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top