Student questions

[himynameisnathan]

Hi there, I'm pretty sure this has been answered to death, but I've got a few questions regarding DSLR Video. Im at uni at the moment and am looking to buy a new camera, in particular a HDSLR, mainly as I studied photography at 6th form so want to take pictures, but also would like to record video for my course, and for fun overall.

I initially was looking at the 7D, and after going to a trade show and using it, found it amazingly cool, as the video was awesome and the pictures stunning. However I've also been looking at the GH1, which for some reason I find more alluring, although I've heard a few things bad about it (same with 7D), so I've got a few questions/observations that I would like to put forward to you guys & girls.

1) In terms of Depth of field, would the GH1 be suffice? I'm not talking about 5D level stuff which tbh i find slightly excessive as all people seem to be doing is making the background blurry, simply because they can. Saying that, I would like to use DOF as it does look cool, in small doses.

2) I've heard alot of stuff about the choice on the GH1 to use AVCHD as its format (container). Alot of people complain that 17mbps isnt enough, but i've heard some people say that due to its efficiency, its similar in quality to HDV at 35mbps (which we use at uni, with Z1's) Realistically, I'm not going to be putting my film's in the cinema anytime soon or sending them to James Cameron, so basically what I'm asking will the image quality take a noticeable hit due to the bit-rate, or are people making a mountain out of a molehill and would it be fine for filming? (I can't say what type of filming that will be, as idea's have to be thought up as in a group) i've also heard lack of b-frames could be important or something like that?

3) Editing wise, i've heard AVCHD is a bit of a hassle to edit especially from the GH1, which wraps the 1080 24p in a 60i format which you have to transcode into an intermediate format then use a reverse telecine I believe. How hard & annoying is this process and image wise, does it hold up, as I've seen great videos on vimeo/youtube with the camera but they're people that obviously know how to make films, which I do to a lesser degree. I've got a macbook pro (2.4ghz c2d, 2gb (soon to be 4gb)RAM and a 256mb 8600m gt) would that be enough to edit AVCHD on FCP7

4) Last one....I think, I heard the lens that comes with a GH1 is supposed to be great for video, just a little slow (f4-f5.6) but you can buy loads of adaptors for basically anything, would it be worth getting say a canon FD to M4/3 adapter and getting a 1.4 50mm or something like that (good for DOF?) Are there any lens combo's anyone recommends?

5) turns out it wasnt the last, sorry. I was just wondering how this camera compares to the 7d/550d(rebel t2i) in terms of video? I know the 7d is really good and presume the 550d essentially being exactly the same interms of video wlll be good but for mostly video work, do the pro's of the Gh1 (twisty screen, loads of lenses, silent video lens)make it better for video against the pro's of the canon's (higher bitrate (less efficient?) loads more native lenses, bigger sensor)

Sorry that thread was longer than I though, but I would be eternally grateful if someone could answer it.

Thanks

Nathan

 

[PerroneFord]

I do not own a GH1, but am currently shopping for a DSLR after having used one for a film last fall. These are merely my opinions and observations having tried a few cameras, and having worked with footage from most of them.

1. DOF will be fine. But focal length is hard. The GH1 essentially doubles the focal length of any lens you put on it. A 50mm lens becomes a 100mm. So trying to get a truly wide shot will be a HUGE challenge.

2. AVCHD in general is a pain. Wrapping the 24p in a 60i container and yet another step to the process. And if Panasonic had implememnted a more robust version of AVCHD it might well have stood up against 35Mbps Mpeg2. But they didn't. So the camera doesn't. In my view it ruins an otherwise fine camera.

3. You're Macbook Pro isn't anywhere close to what's needed for editing AVCHD native. However, if you transcode to ProRes then everything is joing ot be just fine.

4. The Gh1 lens is slow. Fine for a sunny day outdoors, marginal (in my view) for an overcast day, and to my mind, useless indoors. A search of this forum will yield answers to the remainder of your question as it gets asked nearly daily.

5. You're in luck. There is a very comprehensive test going on right now being done by industry professionals (real Hollywood types) comparing these cameras to each other and to film. Best, unbiased view you're going to get. It's happening in stages and the first stage was recently completed. www.zacuto.com (Look for Great Shootout).

Best,

-Perrone

 

[andrzejkra]

1) DOF is great on the GH1. I agree with the above poster, focal length is the biggest challenge - the stock lens at 14mm is pretty wide but I wish it went down to 8mm. Keep in mind that the 7d also has a crop factor, albeit a bit less, so you will have a similar issue with that camera.

2) The codec is a bit weak and will break up into mud if you do whip-pans over high detail, especially if it muddy and 'static' looking to begin with. I (and many other users) find this pretty easy to avoid but your mileage may vary based on shooting style. I find mud is induced in shots where the composition is bad to begin with (lots of muddy, static detail and no real focus of attention) with poor contrast in details. I think this leads the codec to think that those pixels wont be noticeable, and so it renders the muddy scenery as muddy macro-blocks. Getting the right motion blur and having a good amount of contrast in your composition will avoid the problem. It also rarely occurs when you shoot at 720p, which is an okay fallback option if you can't avoid breakup - 1 or 2 shots in 720 on a 1080 timeline wont be easily noticed.

3) You have to transcode the files, it is a hassle much less frustrating than capturing DV tapes but more annoying than working with P2 cards.

4) The lens is a bit slow, but contrary to the above poster, it is plenty for anything shot under any sort of sunlight, overcast or not. You will probably have to stop it down significantly when shooting outdoors even at iso100. I have been able to do usable night shots with the kit lens at iso800 with the available light outside a metro station. It should serve you well wherever there is a moderate amount of light available. F4 is also very appropriate for shooting, too much of a shallow DOF is not always ideal. If you are shooting indoors, you should be using lights no matter what camera you get. The 50mm FD at 1.4 is absolutely beautiful on the GH1.

5) Go find some video on vimeo from both cameras and see for yourself. The thing you'll notice is that what looks good and what doesn't is going to map more to production choices and technical skills than to the specific camera used. All of these cameras are amazing. If I didn't have a GH1 I might consider one of the cheaper Canons, but I am not feeling any envy. The GH1 is actually more adaptable to lenses than the Canons as well.

 

[JerryB]

Quite honestly, you should wait a little. All the cameras (GH1, 7D, etc.) are great, but more than likely there will be cameras introduced by the middle/end of this year that have learned from the current dslrs mistakes.

If you can hold off for a little, then there will probably be an announcement of a GH2, probably a nice Sony contender, more than likely a new Canon (although they are continually blowing their load on what seems to be the same camera with little to no improvements) and who knows maybe Pentax or Nikon will finally get seriously into the game.

I would buy some nice fast prime lenses now and when a better dlsr is released this year you can buy the appropriate adapter and just the body and leave all the people with the 7Ds or GH1s in the dust.

Although, if you really want to get a camera now, get the GH1 body and buy the 20mm f1.7 lens or just get he stock lens (amazing for well lit days). The reason I say this is because mirrorless is more than likely the way of the future and the you can have a few nice m4/3 lenses and purchase the GH2 when it is released.

 

[j1clark@ucsd.edu]

1) In terms of Depth of field, would the GH1 be suffice? I'm not talking about 5D level stuff which tbh i find slightly excessive as all people seem to be doing is making the background blurry, simply because they can. Saying that, I would like to use DOF as it does look cool, in small doses.

I'm not a fan of extremely shallow DoF. In fact, I don't mind having a well lit shot, and deep focus...

I think the DoF on the GH-1, with the range of the stock lense, 14-150mm, would do for most narrative projects, where someone is only able to afford one of Camera X...

I chose the GH-1 over the 7-D, mainly because I could for $1300 get the camera+stock lens, and then spend the $400 (not yet forth coming... married... some else spent the budget...) to get a Zoom 4Hn to capture sound in a double system setup. (which I think is recommended for most of the DLSRs used today...).

2) I've heard alot of stuff about the choice on the GH1 to use AVCHD as its format (container). Alot of people complain that 17mbps isnt enough, but i've heard some people say that due to its efficiency, its similar in quality to HDV at 35mbps (which we use at uni, with Z1's) Realistically, I'm not going to be putting my film's in the cinema anytime soon or sending them to James Cameron, so basically what I'm asking will the image quality take a noticeable hit due to the bit-rate

For my purposes, and the test cases that I've looked at, the 'bit rate' issue is a non-issue. I shot a short, over a year ago now, with the HMC150. I really don't see the 'benefit' of a slightly higher AVCHD bit rate of the HMC150 over that of the GH-1.

With the realtime histogram, I can get a pretty good 'close to correct' exposure, or realize that the situation is pretty damn bad before hand... The HMC150 does have monitor functions, but really, I tend to use a meter, and the histogram function does give me an indication of what the image will be like. So the two combined I think is ideal.

3) Editing wise, i've heard AVCHD is a bit of a hassle to edit especially from the GH1, which wraps the 1080 24p in a 60i format which you have to transcode into an intermediate format then use a reverse telecine I believe. How hard & annoying is this process and image wise, does it hold up, as I've seen great videos on vimeo/youtube with the camera but they're people that obviously know how to make films, which I do to a lesser degree. I've got a macbook pro (2.4ghz c2d, 2gb (soon to be 4gb)RAM and a 256mb 8600m gt) would that be enough to edit AVCHD on FCP7

This is no different from the HMC150/40 case, both of those cameras use AVCHD, and as such, is problematic for editing on 'lowly mortal' hardware.

I edit my HMC150 short on a Mac Book Pro 17" (old version), and once the transcode process was done, I did not have problems editing. The biggest problem I had, was I have Final Cut Express, not Pro, so I used a PAL 25 set up for my 24p media... I'll let the yells of terror die down...

I now have CS4 Premiere, and even though it natively deals with AVCHD, the performance is poor on my hardware, so I still transcode...

4) Last one....I think, I heard the lens that comes with a GH1 is supposed to be great for video, just a little slow (f4-f5.6) but you can buy loads of adaptors for basically anything, would it be worth getting say a canon FD to M4/3 adapter and getting a 1.4 50mm or something like that (good for DOF?) Are there any lens combo's anyone recommends?

I have Nikon lenses, bought an adapter for Nikon, had no problems with my test cases. Given my aesthetics, I would not buy a lens just for its DoF... I'd buy the lens for the increase in light, and hence, being able to shoot in several stops lower lighting conditions, relative to the stock lens.

5) turns out it wasnt the last, sorry. I was just wondering how this camera compares to the 7d/550d(rebel t2i) in terms of video? I know the 7d is really good and presume the 550d essentially being exactly the same interms of video wlll be good but for mostly video work, do the pro's of the Gh1 (twisty screen, loads of lenses, silent video lens)make it better for video against the pro's of the canon's (higher bitrate (less efficient?) loads more native lenses, bigger sensor)

Don't have the Canons, so can't comment on 'which is better'... just the 'shoot out' thread seems to indicate one would not be embarrassed coming to the party with GH-1...

In a year, things may change...

But here is a 'philosophy'... given you are on a budget, given that you may have a bigger budget in the future, buy something that gives you the most for the budget you have now, provided it 'does adequate' for the job you need done.

In 2 years, all of the current Canons and the GH's will be 'old', and superceeded by vast improvements. I think this DSLR thing is a game changing even in the area of no/low budget narrative filmmaking.

The 'video' cameras will go the route that their traditional market has required, compatibility with the past 'video', use in ENG, or the like, but I think the DSLRs will be what will be used for making narrative films on the shoestring budgets.

Me, personally, I would have liked pretty much a sensor housing, and a lens mount, with sufficient digitization to get the image stream captured... which is pretty close to the RED idea as it was first announced, and pretty close to how I view the new DSLRs... Sensorhousing+LensMount+ImageProcessing.

 

[Martti Ekstrand]

DOF enough? Well, seeing is believing or so I'm told. GH1, CanonFD 35mm f/2.0 @ f/2.8, focused about 5 feet or so away.

 

[PhilJackson]

The lens and your physical distance is far more important than the image sensor when it comes to your DoF. As the shoot out has shown, for any non cinema release, you'll get great imaging from any of the cameras you are looking at. I think it's much more down to your personal shooting style and what type of stuff you'll be shooting.

 

[himynameisnathan]

Thanks for all the input everyone! Just a few thing's i'd like to clarify/add

@PerroneFord

DOF will be fine. But focal length is hard. The GH1 essentially doubles the focal length of any lens you put on it. A 50mm lens becomes a 100mm. So trying to get a truly wide shot will be a HUGE challenge.

I'm not too concerned about focal length as my current camera, a powershot g9 is only 35mm (FF equivalent) so even just a 28mm for me would be fine.

@JerryB

Quite honestly, you should wait a little. All the cameras (GH1, 7D, etc.) are great, but more than likely there will be cameras introduced by the middle/end of this year that have learned from the current dslrs mistakes.

If you can hold off for a little, then there will probably be an announcement of a GH2, probably a nice Sony contender, more than likely a new Canon (although they are continually blowing their load on what seems to be the same camera with little to no improvements) and who knows maybe Pentax or Nikon will finally get seriously into the game..

I was thinking about waiting for a possible GH2 but the only time I could think of them announcing it is photokina in september, and even then I doubt it would be available straight away. I'd also like to see if canon release a 60D then as that would be a perfect combo of the 7D and 550D i think.

@Martti Ekstrand

DOF enough? Well, seeing is believing or so I'm told. GH1, CanonFD 35mm f/2.0 @ f/2.8, focused about 5 feet or so away.

That does look pretty yummy I must say.

@j1clark@ucsd.edu

I chose the GH-1 over the 7-D, mainly because I could for $1300 get the camera+stock lens, and then spend the $400 (not yet forth coming... married... some else spent the budget...) to get a Zoom 4Hn to capture sound in a double system setup. (which I think is recommended for most of the DLSRs used today...).

Do you know if the beachtek DSLR audio box adapter (http://www.beachtek.com/# works with the GH1 as i'd quite like to use XLR mic's with it

Thanks again for all the input, if I didnt reply it's not because I didnt read it or think it was valuable, its because it was worded in a way that didnt warrant questioning.

i unfortunately thought of a few more questions i'd again greatly appreciate if you guys could answer. sorry!

6)Do you think it's worth waiting for a GH2, Canon 60D, whatever Nikon/sony/pentax/olympus release? I know some might say if you wait for the best you'll always be waiting, but do you think the improvments in the GH2 (Better codec, native 24p, shutterless design?) are worth waiting and paying extra for, assuming it's announced in september, same with the 60d, is it worth holding out until then as I'd much rather have a 60d than a 550D (7D build essentially without the price)

7)I've seen the GH1 on gumtree (a classifieds site in the UK, basically our craigslist) for £495($737,€552), second hand, body only, do you think it would be worth going without the kit lens for this price and then buying adapters to use Canon FD's and other different lenses? Or is it worth paying the extra £500 for the kit lens even though we've basically been told to mostly shoot with MF?

8)Another thing I've heard is that the PAL Model of the GH1 can't shoot 24p, only 25p. how big a problem is this? I presume 25p is still quite filmlike but the Z1's shoot at that so I can't be too sure what the difference is. If it is a problem, is it possible to use pulldown to conform the footage to 24p, if its even worth doing?

9)Lastly, I was reading yesterday about other lens mounts, such as C-mounts as some of them look pretty cool (http://cgi.ebay.com.au/Cosmicar-16mm-f-1-6-C-mount-Movie-TV-Lens_W0QQitemZ200452214744QQcmdZViewItemQQptZAU_Cameras_Photographic_Accessories?hash=item2eabe20fd8#ht_500wt_1182) would it be worth getting this camera primarily to use adapters and lenses for other camera systems such as that C-mount lens?

Thanks again

 

[deltoidjohn]

The beachtek adaptors will work with the GH1 but you'll still have to live with automatic gain. And you can't monitor what the camera is recording with headphones either.

6) Do you need to shoot anything before September? Personally, I couldn't wait any longer... I needed a 3rd video camera so I got the GH1 NOW. Knowing my luck, that probably means the GH2 will be announced tomorrow. If you can wait... you may as well. Even if a new model offers little improvement the prices may drop on the older models. Also I don't see the point in waiting for a 60d. If it's only for video then I'd go the cheaper 550d over the 7d any day. If you need it for stills or you NEED weather sleaing, pay the extra for the 7d.

7) Autofocus would be nice in some situations. I'm throwing my kit lens on ebay as soon as my Pentax K-mount adaptor arrives so I can use my collection of manual lenses. Another thing you'll want to consider is that if you want to buy the kit lens later on, it's really damn expensive on it's own.

8) 25p can be conformed easily to 24p and be imperceptible to most people. Only problem then becomes syncing sound from other devices (seperate audio recorder, second camera, etc)

9) You can adapt the GH1 to almost any lense. I'll be using my Pentax manual lenses and getting a Canon few FD primes. FD lenses are available really cheap on ebay and, being an older system, they all have manual aperture rings.

 

[Martti Ekstrand]

Again, seeing is believing.

4) http://vimeo.com/5966843

8) http://vimeo.com/6997918 & http://vimeo.com/5262224

6) A camera in your hands allows you to shoot and learn whereas a camera in rumour mills only allow you to long and dream. The commercial above alone payed off my whole investment in GH1 and extra gear. Which leads to

7) If you get that one, an adapter and some inexpensive second hand lenses you'll always be able to get a GH2 (or whatever it will be called) with a kit lens once it comes. In the meantime there's a spring & summer coming with lot of time and opportunity for a student such as yourself to acquire some serious amount of footage and shooting experience.

9) Not sure how much it will be worth it but those who do get into these things certainly seems to have a lot of fun.

As for sound, right now a better investment than a adapter is a separate audio field recorder given there's no manual control in any of the HDSLRs except 5DmkII. Preferably attach this recording device and the mic to a mate so you can focus on... well... focusing and composing the shoots.

 

[PerroneFord]

@PerroneFord


I'm not too concerned about focal length as my current camera, a powershot g9 is only 35mm (FF equivalent) so even just a 28mm for me would be fine.

To get a 28mm (FF35 equivalent) you'd need to mount a 14mm lens. Have you priced 14mm non-fisheye SLR glass?

 

[cloudv]

I have an old wide angle converter (WC-E68) from a Nikon 5000 that fits the 20 f/1.7 perfectly. It works out to a 27mm equivalent. Images look great with no apparent barrel distortion (looking at windows against the grid lines.) Looks like you can buy one for under $70 on ebay.

I’m going out of town and will show some examples week after next if folks are interested.

 

[cloudv]

PS Autofocus still works with wide angle converter on 20mm f/1.7.

 

[deltoidjohn]

To get a 28mm (FF35 equivalent) you'd need to mount a 14mm lens. Have you priced 14mm non-fisheye SLR glass?

Olympus have a few 14-42mm zooms under the $500 mark - and much cheaper on ebay. Or you could use the kit lens.

 

[Park Edwards]

your focal length doesn't double. your field of view is cropped.

 

[PerroneFord]

your focal length doesn't double. your field of view is cropped.

Yes, excellent point.

 

[thisisapocalypse]

To get a 28mm (FF35 equivalent) you'd need to mount a 14mm lens. Have you priced 14mm non-fisheye SLR glass?

Samyang's 14mm f/2.8 should be out soon at a really reasonable price and the Panasonic 14mm f/2.5 pancake is on the way as well - the Olympus 17mm f/2.8 pancake (while obviously not as wide) can be had for about $200 on eBay and despite the negative reviews I have found it to be a great little lens on the GH1.

 

[himynameisnathan]

Sorry for the lack of response guys, internets has been down, sad times.

again, similar method of my replies, if i dont reply to you it doesn't meen I didn't acknowledge what you said.

@deltoidjohn

Do you need to shoot anything before September? Personally, I couldn't wait any longer... I needed a 3rd video camera so I got the GH1 NOW. Knowing my luck, that probably means the GH2 will be announced tomorrow. If you can wait... you may as well. Even if a new model offers little improvement the prices may drop on the older models. Also I don't see the point in waiting for a 60d. If it's only for video then I'd go the cheaper 550d over the 7d any day. If you need it for stills or you NEED weather sleaing, pay the extra for the 7d.

I dont necessarily need to shoot anything before september, although it would be cool if I could, however I would rather not shoot over summer on a GH1 knowing that a GH2 will probably be announced at Photokina. I know getting the GH2 won't turn me into Conrad Hall but certain thing's could potentially be easier than using a GH1

@Martti Ekstrand

A camera in your hands allows you to shoot and learn whereas a camera in rumour mills only allow you to long and dream. The commercial above alone payed off my whole investment in GH1 and extra gear. Which leads to

If you get that one, an adapter and some inexpensive second hand lenses you'll always be able to get a GH2 (or whatever it will be called) with a kit lens once it comes. In the meantime there's a spring & summer coming with lot of time and opportunity for a student such as yourself to acquire some serious amount of footage and shooting experience.

I see your point, however my work is nowhere near the quality to sell to companies, advertisers etc...not that i'm crap (although I would say that) but compared to whats out there, it doesnt really compete, and I've got loads to learn about the field generally, being relatively new to it all. I would like to buy a GH1 adapter and second hand lenses however, financially, I might just about be able to stretch to a GH2, depending on when it comes out, let alone all the old lenses and adapters and thats assuming it costs the same as a GH1 did at launch, although hopefully it will be cheaper than that.

As for sound, right now a better investment than a adapter is a separate audio field recorder given there's no manual control in any of the HDSLRs except 5DmkII. Preferably attach this recording device and the mic to a mate so you can focus on... well... focusing and composing the shoots.

I was thinking about saving up for one of the zoom h4n devices as they look pretty cool, being able to hook xlr mics up to them, however, like I said, cost is a problem as I'd rather have a decent camera with shoddy sound than a decent sound recorder and shoddy (or no) camera. Hopefully after my birthday I'll have about £900, £600 from working and I can dip into my student loan if necessary.

@PerroneFord

To get a 28mm (FF35 equivalent) you'd need to mount a 14mm lens. Have you priced 14mm non-fisheye SLR glass?

I hadn't no, up until you mentioned it, they are well expensive, although If i look for an old canon one, my friend who just got a 7D might be up for splitting the cost and we get 1/2 ownership each, assuming FD's work on EF-s?

@cloudv

I have an old wide angle converter (WC-E68) from a Nikon 5000 that fits the 20 f/1.7 perfectly. It works out to a 27mm equivalent. Images look great with no apparent barrel distortion (looking at windows against the grid lines.) Looks like you can buy one for under $70 on ebay.

I’m going out of town and will show some examples week after next if folks are interested.

Wouldn't it be equivalent to 40mm, or does the WA converter make it 27mm. If so, that would be awesome to get, assuming it's relatively cheap. When you say 20 f/1.7, do you mean the panasonic pancake? If so, how does it all fit together, like mounting wise.

Some examples of that would be awesome thanks.



Two more question's (I'm so sorry, you guys must hate me)

10) I've heard that some(all?) of the micro 4/3 lenses are focus-by-wire. Some people complain whereas some people are perfectly fine with it. Realistically, is it one of those things that only bothers you if you look out for it. I think some of the olympus lenses for 4/3rds are proper mechanical focusing ones, but not to sure overall.

11) Do you guys think it's worth investing in the micro 4/3rds platform? I'm not saying that I think its going to die anytime soon, however compared to canon & nikon (and others) they are relatively new to the game. I really like the idea that they've been built ground up for video compared to canon who, while doing a good job on the video front, seem to be milking the legacy system for aslong as they acn. and if canon/nikon do get into the mirrorless game, all they're old lenses will basically be redundant on the new bodies, essentially ruining they're lens advantage, unless they use adaptors. Any thoughts?

Thanks again guys for all the help, I'm really looking forward to getting some videos together to show you guys once I get a camera (I think i'll be waiting, first in line for a GH2, hopefully announced at NAB)

Happy easter.

Nathan

 

[PerroneFord]

@PerroneFord



I hadn't no, up until you mentioned it, they are well expensive, although If i look for an old canon one, my friend who just got a 7D might be up for splitting the cost and we get 1/2 ownership each, assuming FD's work on EF-s?

The FD glass does not work. Not without an adapter that adds glass to the mix. This is why Nikon F-mount glass is as popular as it is.

Two more question's (I'm so sorry, you guys must hate me)

10) I've heard that some(all?) of the micro 4/3 lenses are focus-by-wire. Some people complain whereas some people are perfectly fine with it. Realistically, is it one of those things that only bothers you if you look out for it. I think some of the olympus lenses for 4/3rds are proper mechanical focusing ones, but not to sure overall.

I wouldn't touch one of those lenses. But that's just me.

11) Do you guys think it's worth investing in the micro 4/3rds platform? I'm not saying that I think its going to die anytime soon, however compared to canon & nikon (and others) they are relatively new to the game. I really like the idea that they've been built ground up for video compared to canon who, while doing a good job on the video front, seem to be milking the legacy system for aslong as they acn. and if canon/nikon do get into the mirrorless game, all they're old lenses will basically be redundant on the new bodies, essentially ruining they're lens advantage, unless they use adaptors. Any thoughts?

Personally no. I don't think investing in 4/3 glass is a great idea. And I don't think that it's a given that removing the mirror from cameras will make the glass redundant. I think its FAR more likely we'll see new bodies that accept the current mounts that are mirrorless. Bodies come and go. And always have. It's the glass that's the real investment. Nikon's glass from the dawn of their SLRs in the late 50's will still mount on these DSLRs, Nikon's film cameras, and most of the digital ones too. There is just no substitute for that.

 

[himynameisnathan]

wouldn't touch one of those lenses. But that's just me.

any reason in particular why?

Personally no. I don't think investing in 4/3 glass is a great idea. And I don't think that it's a given that removing the mirror from cameras will make the glass redundant. I think its FAR more likely we'll see new bodies that accept the current mounts that are mirrorless. Bodies come and go. And always have. It's the glass that's the real investment. Nikon's glass from the dawn of their SLRs in the late 50's will still mount on these DSLRs, Nikon's film cameras, and most of the digital ones too. There is just no substitute for that.

again, any reason in particular it's not worth investing in 4/3rds, as opposed to canon or nikon? I've heard good things about panasonic lenses. By this do you also mean it's not worth investing in the platform as a whole, or just the lens side of things?