EVA1: Stop record button doesn't work (intermittent)

A

Amulet Man

Well-known member
I've twice or maybe three times now had a problem where (using approved V60 cards that otherwise work) the camera records but the "stop" record button won't work. The camera just keeps rolling and can't be stopped. I have to turn the camera off and then recover the clip after.

I haven't lost any footage to this yet, but I'm concerned for the future.

Known error?

Random glitch?

Issue with the cards?

Should I send the camera in for service?

Twice in the past I've had problems that were just quirks of Adobe's decoding or a faulty card, so I don't want to blame the camera again.

Thanks!
 
Using Start/Stop button on camera body or on handle?

When you recover the footage does the recorded clip include the extra recording time after you originally pressed the start/stop button?

I'm assuming the 'record' indicator in the viewfinder stayed on through all this?
 
OnSet said:
Using Start/Stop button on camera body or on handle?

When you recover the footage does the recorded clip include the extra recording time after you originally pressed the start/stop button?

I'm assuming the 'record' indicator in the viewfinder stayed on through all this?
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Camera body to record, then nothing will stop.

And yes, I believe it does, but didn't check carefully.

And yes.

Mitch Gross said:
Almost definitely a card issue.
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What cards actually work with this camera? I've tried a number of V90 cards and V60 cards and had problems with all of them but one, but a few of them were open box and those I don't trust, though they tested at stated speeds.

Oddly 150Mbps on a V30 card seemed to work okay. :/ I believe this was an issue even at 150Mbps with a 1667X Lexar card.

But it probably was a card issue. Only happened with this card I believe. Others just weren't recognized as SDXC etc.
 
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First off, make sure you have the latest firmware in the camera. Available for download on the Panasonic website. With each new firmware the error correction and card communication interface is tweaked and improved. The changes come because card manufacturers have variances so we constantly test to better optimize to them.

Only cards Panasonic can officially state are our own. That's just because we have no control over what another manufacturer does. With that said, I know many have had great success using Angelbird.
 
Amulet Man said:
What cards actually work with this camera? I've tried a number of V90 cards and V60 cards and had problems with all of them but one, but a few of them were open box and those I don't trust, though they tested at stated speeds.
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As someone who has had zero problems with cards in my EVA1, I find it strange that you've had problems with 'most' of yours. Are all of your cards at least 64gb UHS-II with decent record speeds?

As others have mentioned, I've been happy with the Angelbird v90 cards I own. I use them as my primary record media. But I've also had no issues with other UHS-II cards I own -- Toshiba Exceria Pro / Sony "G" series / Prograde v90. My clients like the quality (and reduced upload/xfer times) of 150 mbps so I shoot at that speed most of the time. I also dual record most of the time. On the rare occasion that I need to shoot a lot of 400mbps footage, I sometimes use the (no 'v' rating) Exceria or G cards in the second slot. The camera lets me know when set at 400-I that the media may not be supported (because it doesn't have a proper 'v' rating) but I get no recording errors with it.
 
OnSet said:
As someone who has had zero problems with cards in my EVA1, I find it strange that you've had problems with 'most' of yours. Are all of your cards at least 64gb UHS-II with decent record speeds?

As others have mentioned, I've been happy with the Angelbird v90 cards I own. I use them as my primary record media. But I've also had no issues with other UHS-II cards I own -- Toshiba Exceria Pro / Sony "G" series / Prograde v90. My clients like the quality (and reduced upload/xfer times) of 150 mbps so I shoot at that speed most of the time. I also dual record most of the time. On the rare occasion that I need to shoot a lot of 400mbps footage, I sometimes use the (no 'v' rating) Exceria or G cards in the second slot. The camera lets me know when set at 400-I that the media may not be supported (because it doesn't have a proper 'v' rating) but I get no recording errors with it.
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I first tried two open box Sony v90s; one was recognized as SDXC, the other simply wasn't. A separate Lexar 2000X wasn't recognized as SDXC either. The camera simply refused to write to them, either in 150Mbps or 400Mbps. I couldn't record footage to them at all. I think one of the two Sony cards actually works 100% fine and the other doesn't, not 100% sure.

The cards at least looked totally legit and were from Amazon. In Black Magic disk test, results were consistent with stated speed. Except the Sony card that doesn't work ramps up to its target speed slower than the one that does work. Really bizarre.

I could record 150Mbps HEVC to regular SD cards, however, provided they were relatively high speed.

I then bought a new Lexar 1667X. It works fine except I had the above problem twice. Couldn't stop record.

Firmware is new as of a couple weeks ago.

I'll try AngelBird next.
 
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A few things -- first, the market is flooded with counterfeit cards. I would never under any circumstances buy any sort of open-box card, or any card from ebay, or any card from any seller on Amazon except Amazon themselves. If it doesn't say "sold by Amazon.com", don't buy it. The only place to buy cards is from an authorized reseller. I am not surprised at all that you're having cards that aren't recognized as SDXC, or aren't recognized as V30 or V60, etc.

Second, I've said this a thousand times, this will make 1,001: testing a memory card for speed, or looking at "1667x" or anything like that, is USELESS. There is only one thing that matters: the "V" rating. That is the only thing the EVA looks at (well, two things, it must be an SDXC card and it must be the appropriate "V" speed). It DOES NOT MATTER what the "speed" rating is, what the maximum write speed is, what the "166x" speed is. None of that matters one atom's worth. The only thing that matters is the "V" speed, and if it's fast enough for what the recording mode requires. A "V30" card is good enough for everything the EVA can do except for the most intensive bitrates; a "V60" card is good enough for everything the EVA can do.

Third -- format the cards in-camera. This is crucial, this is unavoidable, you must must must must format the cards in the camera. You can take the most compatible card ever made (likely a Panasonic V90 card), format it on a computer or in a different camera, and it won't work properly in the EVA. The only way to get guaranteed compatibility is to format the card IN THE CAMERA, using the camera's "format" option.

If you want to get to the bottom of this, go down to your local Best Buy (an authorized reseller) and pick up a V60 card, format it in the camera, and test. It absolutely should work 100%. If you still have issues with your record button not stopping, try the record button on the handgrip; there's a chance that maybe your main record button's contacts are dirty or something like that.

That might be my next step. They're expensive though!
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Okay, this sentiment right here is what concerns me. If you're trying to "save money" by using cheaper cards, then -- that attitude right there is almost certainly the source of all your troubles. Your memory cards are the LAST place you want to cheap out on! You're banking your career and your entire budget on the footage you make, and that footage is getting recorded to a commodity media card. You should be using the most premium, best quality memory card possible. You have an $8,000 camera, but you're using used open-box who-knows-what memory cards in it? I apologize for coming off harshly, but seriously -- WTF? That's a terrible procedure.

Do yourself the biggest favor you can possibly do. Buy a premium memory card from a premium manufacturer. Get a top-of-the-line V60 SanDisk, Samsung, or Panasonic card, NEW, from an authorized retailer so you know it's genuine. And all your problems will almost certainly vanish. If they don't, your camera almost certainly would need servicing.
 
We've been using the Angelbird 128gb V90 cards in our studios for over a year with zero issues. I'd recommend them given my experience.
 
My past experience with Lexar media has been less than positive. When I bought my CX350 I also bought two Panasonic V90 memory cards. Expensive, yes. What is peace of mind worth?
 
Barry's advice above is spot on. You do yourself zero favors when you cut corners on media. I would add one more counterpoint to the argument that "premium" brand name cards are expensive: yes, those cards are expensive, but its cheaper to buy something that everyone knows to work vs. churning through several budget options. THAT'S expensive.

No, you don't have to buy the Panasonic branded cards... but, you do have to buy based on V rating (instead of relying simply on read/write speeds claimed by the manufacturer --which usually aren't SUSTAINED transfer speeds, anyway).

Good luck!
 
Thanks, everyone, going to try some more expensive cards.

I'll own up to the open box thing being misguided, perhaps, though I can (and am) returning the cards, so I guess more of a waste of time than money. But yeah, it wasn't the smartest decision I've made.

The Lexar card that's giving me this exact problem is V60 rated, though, and the camera recognizes it as such. Oddly, the highest end Sandisk cards don't have a V90 rating (or any rating visible). So it's not quite as simple as it seems. Trying Angelbird next.
 
Just a note about Lexar that you may or may not know (and not sure if anyone else mentioned it), but Micron - their parent company - closed the business around 2017 because of the overall market status, and then ended up selling them to the Chinese company Longsys.

Sometimes there may be production changes during a transition like this. And I'm not saying there were as I don't know, but the amount of reports of issues with them appear to have increased within the past few years.

And ARRI recently stopped recommending Lexar's CFast cards for their cameras in June:

https://www.arri.com/en/camera-systems/pro-camera-accessories/recording-media

Again, it could all just be bad luck.
 
NorBro said:
Just a note about Lexar that you may or may not know (and not sure if anyone else mentioned it), but Micron - their parent company - closed the business around 2017 because of the overall market status, and then ended up selling them to the Chinese company Longsys.

Sometimes there may be production changes during a transition like this. And I'm not saying there were as I don't know, but the amount of reports of issues with them appear to have increased within the past few years.

And ARRI recently stopped recommending Lexar's CFast cards for their cameras in June:

https://www.arri.com/en/camera-systems/pro-camera-accessories/recording-media

Again, it could all just be bad luck.
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Very interesting... thanks for the heads up.

Tried some Angelbird cards. They test a LOT slower, a third the speed of the Sonys that didn't work, but they work so far. Crazy.
 
Amulet Man said:
Tried some Angelbird cards. They test a LOT slower, a third the speed of the Sonys that didn't work, but they work so far. Crazy.
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It's not crazy. The testing is irrelevant. The ONLY thing that matters is the "V" rating.

The "V" rating is a rating for the minimum sustained data write speed. Theoretical potential write speed is irrelevant, the only thing that matters is: is the card GUARANTEED to be able to sustain the data rate the camera is feeding it. And there's a chip in there that communicates to the camera to tell the camera what "V" speed rating it is. If that chip isn't there, the camera will not work with that card, period. Even if the card is fifty thousand times faster than a V60 card, it doesn't matter: the camera looks for the chip in the card, it interrogates the card as to its "V" rating, and if the card doesn't answer properly, then the camera says "nope, incompatible card."

V90 is unnecessary and actually wasted on an EVA1 or CX350. Nothing those cameras can do exceed the capabilities of a V60 card.

So it's not quite as simple as it seems.
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I don't mean to be contradictory, but actually it's much simpler than it seems. If the card doesn't carry a V30 or V60 rating, ignore it. It doesn't matter who makes it, it doesn't matter if the computing magazines claim it's the best card or if the Amazon reviews are 10,000 5-star revies, none of that matters. The first and far most important factor is: does the card carry the V60 rating (if using 200mb or 400mb ALL-I) or the V30 rating (if using Long-GoP)? If it does, move on to step 2. If it doesn't, ignore it and find a card that does.

Step 2: is the card a piece of crap? There are plenty of craphole and fraudulent cards out there that carry all sorts of fake marketing on them, there's cards that claim to be SanDisk that aren't, and there are cards that claim to be V60 that aren't, and there are fake and counterfeit and bogus cards all over the place. If buying open-box or from ebay or some off brand nobody's ever heard of, expect trouble. So if it's a piece of crap, ignore it, even if it says "V60" on it, and move on to step 3.

Step 3: buy a quality card from an authorized retailer. The only way to guarantee you won't get stuck with a fake, bogus, counterfeit, garbage card is to buy a brand new card from an authorized retailer. The major brands like SanDisk will tell you who their authorized retailers are. Don't buy from ebay, don't buy from one of the famous NJ scam shops, don't buy from an Amazon reseller, go to the source and get a genuine card from a genuine authorized reseller.

As far as what brands and choices are out there: from what I can tell, SanDisk makes V30 cards, but doesn't make any V60 (or V90) cards yet. So if you want V60 for 400mbps all-I, don't buy SanDisk (until they make a V60 card someday). Angelbird and Panasonic and Sony make well-regarded V90 cards, and Angelbird also makes V60 cards. Again, there's no reason to pay more for an Angelbird V90 card when they also make a V60 card, as the camera cannot take advantage of the additional speed V90 offers over V60.

There are other brands offering V60 and V90, like Delkin's "Prime" and "Power" series, and Adata's "Premiere ONE" micro-SDXC, and ProGrade and Lexar and Transcend and Hoodman. I can't comment on those brands (other than the Lexar fiasco, Lexar used to be a premium brand, but NorBro's post does raise concerns). Obviously you'll want to do your due diligence when researching brands to see which ones are quality and which... aren't.

B&H's website lets you search specifically for V60 or V90 cards, it's a decent way to narrow down which brands offer V30, V60, or V90 compatible cards.
 
Barry_Green said:
It's not crazy. The testing is irrelevant. The ONLY thing that matters is the "V" rating.

The "V" rating is a rating for the minimum sustained data write speed. Theoretical potential write speed is irrelevant, the only thing that matters is: is the card GUARANTEED to be able to sustain the data rate the camera is feeding it. And there's a chip in there that communicates to the camera to tell the camera what "V" speed rating it is. If that chip isn't there, the camera will not work with that card, period. Even if the card is fifty thousand times faster than a V60 card, it doesn't matter: the camera looks for the chip in the card, it interrogates the card as to its "V" rating, and if the card doesn't answer properly, then the camera says "nope, incompatible card."

V90 is unnecessary and actually wasted on an EVA1 or CX350. Nothing those cameras can do exceed the capabilities of a V60 card.


I don't mean to be contradictory, but actually it's much simpler than it seems. If the card doesn't carry a V30 or V60 rating, ignore it. It doesn't matter who makes it, it doesn't matter if the computing magazines claim it's the best card or if the Amazon reviews are 10,000 5-star revies, none of that matters. The first and far most important factor is: does the card carry the V60 rating (if using 200mb or 400mb ALL-I) or the V30 rating (if using Long-GoP)? If it does, move on to step 2. If it doesn't, ignore it and find a card that does.

Step 2: is the card a piece of crap? There are plenty of craphole and fraudulent cards out there that carry all sorts of fake marketing on them, there's cards that claim to be SanDisk that aren't, and there are cards that claim to be V60 that aren't, and there are fake and counterfeit and bogus cards all over the place. If buying open-box or from ebay or some off brand nobody's ever heard of, expect trouble. So if it's a piece of crap, ignore it, even if it says "V60" on it, and move on to step 3.

Step 3: buy a quality card from an authorized retailer. The only way to guarantee you won't get stuck with a fake, bogus, counterfeit, garbage card is to buy a brand new card from an authorized retailer. The major brands like SanDisk will tell you who their authorized retailers are. Don't buy from ebay, don't buy from one of the famous NJ scam shops, don't buy from an Amazon reseller, go to the source and get a genuine card from a genuine authorized reseller.

As far as what brands and choices are out there: from what I can tell, SanDisk makes V30 cards, but doesn't make any V60 (or V90) cards yet. So if you want V60 for 400mbps all-I, don't buy SanDisk (until they make a V60 card someday). Angelbird and Panasonic and Sony make well-regarded V90 cards, and Angelbird also makes V60 cards. Again, there's no reason to pay more for an Angelbird V90 card when they also make a V60 card, as the camera cannot take advantage of the additional speed V90 offers over V60.

There are other brands offering V60 and V90, like Delkin's "Prime" and "Power" series, and Adata's "Premiere ONE" micro-SDXC, and ProGrade and Lexar and Transcend and Hoodman. I can't comment on those brands (other than the Lexar fiasco, Lexar used to be a premium brand, but NorBro's post does raise concerns). Obviously you'll want to do your due diligence when researching brands to see which ones are quality and which... aren't.

B&H's website lets you search specifically for V60 or V90 cards, it's a decent way to narrow down which brands offer V30, V60, or V90 compatible cards.
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Thanks. Does it make any sense that the V90 cards are getting 48 MBPS read (250 write)? It's odd, since that would even be under 400 Mbps for ALL-I....

And yet it works... Regardless, I think my big mistake was buying Lexar without realizing it was no longer a trusted brand. It sort of worked, other than this one glitch no problems. Which is too bad since the price is good.
 
Read speed is not part of the V standard, I don't think. It's write speed that matters - and not "burst" write speed, or "up to" or "max" write speed; those are irrelevant. What counts is the minimum sustained write speed. That's what the "V" rating represents: minimum sustained write speed. A V10 card can sustain at least 10 megabytes per second, continuously, forever. V30 sustains 30 megabytes, V60 does 60 megabytes (480 megabits) and V90 sustains 90 megabytes. That's why a V60 card is all you need for an EVA1; it writes a max of 400 megabits, and V60 supports at least 480 megabits.
 
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