Stop bitching about 25p already, it has it

[chrisso]

So first it was "boohoo no 25p", now it suddenly is "boohoo no 24mb/s at 25p", when will you learn it is supposed to be "boohoo no 1080p50"

I haven't used Final Cut either, I'm pretty much (useless) a beginner at video.

Wow. rogar-Shock(DBG):

As far as a sensible contribution, all I can repeat is PAL users should be offered the same level of specs as NTSC users. That only seems fair.

 

[tcglog]

Wow. rogar-Shock(DBG):

As far as a sensible contribution, all I can repeat is PAL users should be offered the same level of specs as NTSC users. That only seems fair.

So in your opinion as a video beginner I'm not allowed to have an opinion? I guess that tells more about you.. Remember that everyone is a beginner at some point and I'm sure I have much more expertise in many other areas than you.

As far as your sensible contribution, I guess nobody really disagrees with that.

 

[Framerate]

Framerate always matters

I'll drink to that:grin:

 

[Spectra]

So in your opinion as a video beginner I'm not allowed to have an opinion?

Of course you can have an opinion - after all this is a forum where people can, within reason, say what they like....the fact that your opinion is ill-founded and misinformed is another story altogether. As you yourself have admitted, you have very little experience in video production which means that most reasonable people on here will of course ignore most of what you have to say...which is how it should be.

I havent seen any "bitching" or "moaning" on here but I have seen MANY posters indicate that they are perplexed as to why Panasonic seem to have left PAL users with no progressive frame rate options on the GH2..... a very fair and reasonable question one would think considering most of the broadcast world is PAL based (China and India are included in this list just fyi).

I and many other end users are simply not interested in a camera that only offers interlaced video....you obviously have not had to deal with time stretching or any other process that makes interlace an absolute PITA to work with. Good for you.

 

[Spectra]

Till now I have only used Twixtor for super slow motion with 720p50 material. It works quite well with riggid bodys, but has trouble with e.g. fluids and rotation.

I have not used interlaced material yet, but if I can find some time I will try to extract it from 720p50 footage (any idea how to do this as easy as possible in Final Cut?). Or someone can give me a short file of interlaced footage...? I will let you know, but don't wait for it ;-)

The software is not guessing the missing lines, it is more like finding the right pixels in the previous and following frame (using 25p or 50i) to calculate there location in the picture and also interpolate from the surounding pixels (only 50i). In theory(!) 50i is better than 25p to get 50p as final result, but only if you have good footage. Any "mud" or compression artifacts will lead the software to false pixel matching, resulting in useless results.

In my opinion Twixtor is definitely not the best software. It is - as always - only a compromise between time and quality.
I still haven't found software where you have the option to render at "infinite" quality (e.g. some iterative algorithm that goes thru all of the sequence till there is no pixel left to improve - which will take a very very... long time to render).

Twixtor needs to be paired with "Fields kit" to properly deal with interlaced material....well the versions I have used in the past did anyway and unless they have updated the software recently I am pretty sure it still does.....

You need to separate the fields and convert the interlace frames to progressive frames before you can time stretch video or you suffer a loss of resolution and introduce interlace artefacts - it is a very time consuming and cpu intensive process as it doesnt just use frame blending (you can but it isnt the most accurate way of doing things) but uses motion adaptive algorithms to try and rebuild the full 1080 resolution on 1080i source material (which is in reality 540P sampled at 50 x a second) - you need to set this up with motion vectors manually and have it track this motion... a bit of RSMB motion blur also helps to give a more naturally fluid or "filmic" look.

 

[chrisso]

So in your opinion as a video beginner I'm not allowed to have an opinion? I guess that tells more about you.. Remember that everyone is a beginner at some point

In my opinion you shouldn't be so confidently arguing with other forum members, especially when they clearly have a deeper understanding of this subject.
I'm a beginner too.
What my comment should tell you about me is that I'm here to learn, not tell other forum members they are wrong.

 

[tcglog]

the fact that your opinion is ill-founded and misinformed is another story altogether.

The same moaning goes on, still no indication that anything I have said would be incorrect. Maybe if you'd actually read through the thread I wouldn't have to explain the same thing a million times. Or maybe you have a thick skull?

As you yourself have admitted, you have very little experience in video production which means that most reasonable people on here will of course ignore most of what you have to say...which is how it should be.

No that is not at all how it should be. People with different backgrounds and different levels of knowledge should be able to interact with each other, and learn more. Some helpful individuals with more knowledge could even try to help the beginners with their problems. The more knowledgeable individuals can also interact with each other and become even more knowledgeable. THAT is how it should be. I hope you realize how ridiculous your statement sounds. If you need to ignore everything that anyone with less posts than you writes I suggest you go back to e-mailing.

I havent seen any "bitching" or "moaning" on here but I have seen MANY posters indicate that they are perplexed as to why Panasonic seem to have left PAL users with no progressive frame rate options on the GH2..... a very fair and reasonable question one would think considering most of the broadcast world is PAL based (China and India are included in this list just fyi).

And I agree with them. But if it's just repeating the same things over and over and over again even when we still don't know whether the GH2 will actually have 25p or not - that is what I call bitching. And I have just posted indication to the contrary. I don't need to be a video expert to know that it would be much more beneficial to use the bitching energy to complain about not having 1080p50 instead.

I and many other end users are simply not interested in a camera that only offers interlaced video....you obviously have not had to deal with time stretching or any other process that makes interlace an absolute PITA to work with. Good for you.

Well lucky me, and this has absolutely nothing to do with what I have written in this thread.

 

[tcglog]

In my opinion you shouldn't be so confidently arguing with other forum members, especially when they clearly have a deeper understanding of this subject.
I'm a beginner too.
What my comment should tell you about me is that I'm here to learn, not tell other forum members they are wrong.

Well some of us have more confidence than others. And I'm not telling anyone they are wrong. Can't believe that this is so hard to understand. I guess video knowledge doesn't equal iq in genera.. Read the thread again, start with my post above.

 

[Noel Evans]

Yes, well this thread is going no where. THE END.