Charles, thank you for your invaluable advice. I will let you know how it goes. (I’m also a huge fan of Key and Peele.) :thumbsup:
DVX200: Steadycam, Glidecam, Gimbal, or Ronin? For DVX200 Camera.
- Thread starter LavalleLee
- Start date
Charles, thank you for your invaluable advice. I will let you know how it goes. (I’m also a huge fan of Key and Peele.) :thumbsup:
CharlesPapert
Director of Photography
Oops, looks like something got deleted before I posted. I started to say, if you were to consider a steadicam/gimbal combo with the Pilot, you'd have to be pretty careful with your choice of gimbal and camera as the arm is rated at a 10 lb payload. An RS2 with its own payload maxed out would be 12+ lbs, for instance. There was a pretty good variation of spring capacity with the smaller rigs though, you might get lucky and find that yours can carry a little bit more.
This is a great point. I rewired a Flyer LE sled for hd-sdi about 8 years ago, and was nearly hitting the weight limit with c300 mk ii rig (lens, batteries, wireless ff, teradek, and atomos shogun as a monitor). Depending on lens, even a matte box with filters could push the arm to the limit. If i remember correctly, there were 19 and 23lb capacity arms, I had the 19. Basically no option to even try a gimbal pairing unless you plan on exclusively flying a mirrorless and relying on autofocus.
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The C70 is 3 lbs with an A30, and with a lens and base plate it hopefully won’t exceed 10 lbs. The RS 3 is an additional 3.3 lbs.
CharlesPapert
Director of Photography
It's kinda pushing it. Typically, with the smaller Steadicam brand rigs the max capacity of the arm is going to be the most obvious indicator of reaching payload maximum (fully cranked up, the bones of the arm will droop below the desired angle) but the less apparent aspect of pushing the other components of the rig like the gimbal and vest are somewhat less obvious until you reach failure. With the scenario of adding a gimbal to the top stage of a Steadicam and presumably extending the post longer to balance that offset mass, you are adding additional stress to the post (by operating in a horizontal scenario where the masses are now perpendicular to the post), but I'd be most concerned about the top stage. If your gimbal allows you to remove or shorten the handle and mount directly to the camera platform, that's a big help, but having the camera mass substantially raised above the platform again puts a lot of stress on the bearings in the stage (the fore-aft and side-side adjustment) when the rig is articulated sideways in flashlight mode etc. I'd suggest in these scenarios keeping the mass down to no more than 2/3 of the max payload (6.5 lbs or so) and even then, no assurances. I'd also suggest doing regular visual inspections on the post to look for hairline cracks in the carbon fiber, and note if the post or the camera platform adjustments start to stick.
It would be advisable to start looking for an upgraded vest that has a compatible socket block, or at the very least think about driving some rivets through the velcro straps on the Pilot vest. With the added torque of a rig being flown away from the body and especially if the velcro is a little worn on the vest, you could run the risk of it flying apart at an inopportune moment.
This all sounds a bit doom and gloom but chances are you'll just start to have issues with adjustability on the rig before catastrophic failure. The worst case scenario, where the rig ends up flying off your body and crashing to the ground, is not impossible but unlikely. I'm sure everyone has seen the video of rig flying off the operator (google Steadicam failure Cinegear) and while that is a worst case scenario of no-hands operation and full extension of the arm, it's still food for thought.
Thanks for the warning... I am not sure I want to google that video. Would it be in the genre of splatter films? :zombie_smiley:
While I wait for the Steadicam to arrive, any advice on the following:
Is it better to bolt the camera directly to the top plate, or is it possible to use some kind of dovetail solution?
CharlesPapert
Director of Photography
It's certainly possible, but in general you want to keep the camera assembly as low as possible to minimize the length of the rig to improve inertial handling. An intermediate dovetail will raise the camera's center of gravity, which then requires you to raise the gimbal (that's OK) but if you run out of that, you have to lengthen the rig to compensate. Not really a problem with a lighter camera though.
Another concern with extra plates is possible vibration. You need to make sure that the dovetail you are using is rock-solid, no play in it. And that the mounting plate involved has two screws to avoid possible rotation.
Thanks Charles for sharing. Seems like it will be better to bolt the camera straight on to the Steadicam plate.
My next investment will be a sturdy C-stand, then.
CharlesPapert
Director of Photography
You could use a c-stand, but I always found those not the best choice for Steadicam. They are relatively heavy, yet they still need a sandbag for safety if you are going to cantilever the rig out while balancing. For a rig that lightweight you should be fine with a quality baby stand (kit stand). Much lighter, but the wider leg base makes them more conducive to offset weight.
If you wanted something with more oomph, there are various versions of strong baby stands around designed for Steadicam such as this one: https://kupogrip.com/kupo-kupo-stea...o60fwjaX2ECKC9OU-raWY5P5oE31B3OkaAkMJEALw_wcB
Charles, you’ll have to excuse my ignorance. I am not familiar with the lingo. Is a baby stand the same as one of those light stands you get on Amazon?
Jim Feeley
Veteran
A baby stand is a specific type of stand. From the Matthews Studio Equipment Griptionary:
"Baby Stand: A stand designed with a 5/8" Pin at the top. Almost all lighting instruments under 2000 Watts in size are made to be mounted on a Baby Pin. Matthews manufactures a number of stands, both rolling and non-rolling such as the Baby Junior Stand in both double riser and triple riser. Century Stands, Matthews Kit Stands, and Beefy Baby Stands are all manufactured with a Baby Pin at the top. Matthews Combo Stands are now made with a Baby Pop Up Pin for greater flexibility."
https://www.msegrip.com/pages/griptionary-1
And here's a video from Adorama going over the basic types of stands:
CharlesPapert
Director of Photography
Mmm, interesting that a C-stand is included in that definition of baby stand because it has a baby pin top. IRL I don't think anyone would say that though. Yes, a lightweight lighting stand with the legs that collapse inwards when you fold it up is a baby stand, the lightweight ones usually called a kit stand as it is what comes (used to come, anyway) in a small tungsten kit like a couple of Arri 300's and 650's etc. Generally speaking for a super light Steadicam like we are discussing, a good kit stand can manage the weight and sidetorque of balancing, just make sure it has the full-size baby pin on top and not the cut-out version with threaded top (like shown at 4:04 in that video above). The safest choice is a legit baby stand with square stock legs, you can find lightweight versions made of aluminum (vs steel) out there. The larger footprint with the legs give it more stability than a c-stand so a bag is usually not necessary, which is just easier to deal with with a tiny or nonexistent crew. Something like this: https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produ...tand_with.html
Thank you Jim and Charles - I didn't even know there were so many types of stands.
Maybe this is a question for CharlesPapert : I got my SteadiCam Pilot and it is in great condition (with a new V-mount battery mount), except for the vest which is quite icky sticky. I see that the general advice is to just clean the pads, but is there also a way to remove the stickiness of the vest?
https://steadicamforum.com/index.php?app=forums&module=forums&controller=topic&id=17055
CharlesPapert
Director of Photography
Wonder what made the vest itself sticky...?!
I would think probably rubbing alcohol or something similar should work to get the stickiness off the vest.
I would think probably rubbing alcohol or something similar should work to get the stickiness off the vest.
CharlesPapert
Director of Photography
Obviously, do a small test area first. It's been too long for me to remember if the structure of the Pilot vest is anodized or if there is some krinkle finish on it that could come off with a solvent.
Will do.
The seller made me aware of this before I bought it, and at $350 I can probably get over the yuck factor…
Jim Feeley
Veteran
There's an Astroglidecam joke waiting to be made here, but I'll let that opportunity slip by....