F3: Sony SCL-Z18X140 Servo Zoom Lens for F3/F5/F55 Listed on Ebay - Starting at $4995

Why are you selling? I am close to a F55 and am looking at adding this to the lens options for hand held. I shoot in tough situations on the water from boat to boat where the steadyshot will make a big difference. Other wise I will be PL or EF. Am I making a mistake buying the lens?
 
I am not selling my SCL-Z18X140, it's too useful as far as I'm concerned right now but chipping in on this because I have used mine on the F3 shooting boat to boat, ( sailing boats ), a couple of times and yes the steady shot works very well in those situations.
The T stop "speed" of the lens is never an issue out on the water where lighting conditions are usually much brighter.......
I would though make sure, as I did, that your camera and lens is well protected from spray/salt water. I used a rain cover for the camera+lens taping it closed wherever possible and using a remote run/ stop switch plus a clear filter on the front of the lens....Then shot with the lens on full auto.
Changed focal lengths using the zoom rocker......That will not be as easy with the F55 of course.
Quality was excellent.

Added: Oh yes, I also used the much maligned rear EVF on the F3, ( the only time it has proven to be useful ), but in these conditions it was perfect. The camera / lens rig was shock-corded to a goalpost mount we rigged on the sailboat.
 
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Thank you Peter that is very helpful. Looking at the added control box which is silly that it adds so much bulk and weight. Come on Sony make the handle for this lens.
 
Paul - I'm selling primarily for cash flow. I made the decision to buy a set of 16mm Zeiss Super Speeds earlier this year. I also am in the process of getting a new tripod and head for my Sony F35. My primary lenses for the F3 & F35 are Arri Ultra Primes. I like this lens, but I'm shooting more and more "cinematic" stuff where it's not an absolute requirement to own a zoom lens.
 
Thanks for the response. I have found dealers who are selling for similar price, I think I will take that route.
 
The F3 had a nice zoom rocker built into its body. Since neither the F5 or F55 have this, what are some if any options to control it?
 
Wow. That lens sure didn't hold it's value, did it?
I wouldn't touch that lens for the following reasons:
1) Incompatible with all but three camera models in the whole world (F3, F5, F55) and Sony could abandon that mount entirely at any time thus leaving you with a white elephant.
2) Exposure ramps when you zoom, making it completely useless in an ENG type shooting environment.
3) Front element telescopes.
4) Slow speed. If shallow DoF is your goal, you can do almost as good with an EX3 -- which, by the way, costs less than one of these lenses new. Just think of that, you can get a whole camera (EX3 or PMW-200 that can do 50Mbps 422) for less money than this lens -- AND it will outperform this lens in the types of shooting situations that people say they want to use this lens for. I don't get the reasoning for buying this lens.

Some people might be happy with this lens, but it doesn't even come close to meeting my criteria for being a professional lens. It's just a consumer lens in a glorified housing.
 
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Regarding the exposure ramping, on the F3 at least you can enable TLCS (read more http://cinetiny.com/I7W4JNHO) which can compensate in real time for any change in exposure due to the lens stop ramping, or scene lighting changes.

The auto-exposure is very smooth and you can set the number of seconds you want the F3 to respond in when auto compensating.

I only wish the F55 had this feature. TLCS was also great for shooting time-lapse.
 
If you use TLCS to compensate for the aperture ramping you are basically allowing the camera to operate on automatic exposure -- either shutter speed or gain. Neither of which I am willing to give up control over to the camera under any circumstances. I don't know about other people, but I can certainly see the difference when gain or shutter speed fluctuate. In my opinion, using a non-professional lens that ramps is bad enough, but then using auto-exposure to compensate for it just compounds the problem.
 
Doug - how extensively have you used this lens model that you're criticizing?

You make some valid points, but others are really dependant on how the equipment is being used. There are certainly applications in which an EX3 is a more appropriate tool than any 35mm zoom lens, but conversely, the EX3 has a different color gamut and output options.

Also, while yes, there is always a risk that Sony could choose to abandon this mount, there's ample reason to suggest they're likely to keep using it. While the userbase for this lens is small, the number of people taking adavantage of this mount for 3d party lens adapters is huge. Sony would annoy a lot of people by moving to a new lens mount and forcing everyone to replace and rebuild those mounts and adapters for Nikon, EF, B4, etc. Hence, there's good business reason to keep this mount.

Simply put, there's not another lens for 35mm in the same price range that does the same things. So, I think, for the right applications, there's a reason to use it.
 
Doug Jensen said:
Wow. That lens sure didn't hold it's value, did it? Neither did the highly touted F3, which I suspect garnered a great deal more initial buying interest than the lens in question.
I wouldn't touch that lens for the following reasons:
1) Incompatible with all but three camera models in the whole world (F3, F5, F55) and Sony could abandon that mount entirely at any time thus leaving you with a white elephant. Of course, that assumes that one plans to abandon the camera for which it was purchased.
2) Exposure ramps when you zoom, making it completely useless in an ENG type shooting environment. Perhaps, but there are actually other uses for this lens besides ENG.
3) Front element telescopes. Now, this could indeed be an issue. But is there an alternative that offers the equivalent focal length given the price point, weight, size, etc?
4) Slow speed. If shallow DoF is your goal, you can do almost as good with an EX3 -- which, by the way, costs less than one of these lenses new. Just think of that, you can get a whole camera (EX3 or PMW-200 that can do 50Mbps 422) for less money than this lens -- AND it will outperform this lens in the types of shooting situations that people say they want to use this lens for. I don't get the reasoning for buying this lens. Are you suggesting that an EX3 or PMW-200 is superior to an F5/55 with this lens attached?

Some people might be happy with this lens, but it doesn't even come close to meeting my criteria for being a professional lens. It's just a consumer lens in a glorified housing.
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Professional or "consumer;" does it really matter if it does its intended job for those who find it useful?
 
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As a point of reference - I recently was DP on a "found footage" feature, and we primarily shot on the Sony PMW-F3 with this lens. A primary reason was that I owned both items, and the budget was tight, but for the application I found it to be highly effective. Much of the footage is ultimately going to be altered in post to make it look like it came from far cheaper cameras, but we did plenty of recording in circumstances with wide ranges in light, so the expanded dynamic range of the Sony F3 recording to ProRes was an asset. The minimal change in exposure on zooming was forgivable, as it's also something that happens on consumer cameras, so in the course of found footage , it's acceptable. The servo zoom gave me an aesthetic that manually zooming wouldn't, and primes weren't going to have the right "guy with a camcorder" feel. The lack of shallow depth of field was typically an asset as well - blocking was minimal, and I needed to follow action on the fly.

So, what's a deficency in once circumstance can be an asset in another.
 
Doug Jensen said:
Wow. That lens sure didn't hold it's value, did it?
I wouldn't touch that lens for the following reasons:
1) Incompatible with all but three camera models in the whole world (F3, F5, F55) and Sony could abandon that mount entirely at any time thus leaving you with a white elephant.
2) Exposure ramps when you zoom, making it completely useless in an ENG type shooting environment.
3) Front element telescopes.
4) Slow speed. If shallow DoF is your goal, you can do almost as good with an EX3 -- which, by the way, costs less than one of these lenses new. Just think of that, you can get a whole camera (EX3 or PMW-200 that can do 50Mbps 422) for less money than this lens -- AND it will outperform this lens in the types of shooting situations that people say they want to use this lens for. I don't get the reasoning for buying this lens.

Some people might be happy with this lens, but it doesn't even come close to meeting my criteria for being a professional lens. It's just a consumer lens in a glorified housing.
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1) I guess sony are pretty commited to that mount, also the lens is hard to make without a short FFD mount

2) loads of people dont actually zoom during a shot, they just want to save time on lens changes, its not that hard to tickle the iris between shots, zooming is kind of a bit 1980s isnt it?

3) indeed bad but without telescope it would be RedZoom size/mass - which is unmanageable on the shoulder

4) You may be able to get the look with an 2/3 EX3 but you cannot then shoot a 'cinematic' piece with an EX3 or even pull out a fast prime when it gets dark, or you have moved to the interviews section of your shoot and you have time to select a prime - a lens like this doubles the functionality of the camera - corporate or cinematic

The Emount version is unfocussable due to the fly by wire so this lens does seem to offer some very practical uses..

S
 
Hey, I'm just saying why I wouldn't use it and why I think there are better alternatives. Everything I've said is factually correct, but people have to decide for themselves if it makes any difference to them or not. Obviously different people have different needs and expectations, and the lens might be exactly what they are looking for.
 
What are those better alternatives?

Im not a huge fan of the lens - much prefer the look of the 18-100F4 that is rumoured - but that wont fit F3/5 and has potential for crappo focus..
 
Doug Jensen said:
Hey, I'm just saying why I wouldn't use it and why I think there are better alternatives. Everything I've said is factually correct, but people have to decide for themselves if it makes any difference to them or not. Obviously different people have different needs and expectations, and the lens might be exactly what they are looking for.
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Personally, I don't think a "FOR SALE" thread is the place to bash a piece of equipment with negative opinions. Although, to be fair, I placed this in the F3/F5/F55 forum, so I realize I opened it to a conversation.

Yes, you state some facts. And you use them to support a claim that the equipment isn't fit for professional use. Which, hey, fair opinion. I do think though, that as someone who publishes user guides for equipment, that your opinion may carry more weight than just any other user. There's a presumption of expertise, if you will. And yet, you haven't clarified how much you've actually used this lens, or if you have just decided it's a poor lens on specifications.

Wow. That lens sure didn't hold it's value, did it?
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Not fact. And, as far as I can tell, only based on the opening bid offered on an ebay auction, for a used lens, with a noted defect. Not, in my professional opinion, a fair basis to argue that the lens doesn't hold value.
I wouldn't touch that lens for the following reasons:
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Opinion.
1) Incompatible with all but three camera models in the whole world (F3, F5, F55) and Sony could abandon that mount entirely at any time thus leaving you with a white elephant.
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Fact followed by speculation.
4) Slow speed. If shallow DoF is your goal, you can do almost as good with an EX3 -- which, by the way, costs less than one of these lenses new. Just think of that, you can get a whole camera (EX3 or PMW-200 that can do 50Mbps 422) for less money than this lens -- AND it will outperform this lens in the types of shooting situations that people say they want to use this lens for. I don't get the reasoning for buying this lens.
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Single fact, followed by one professional's opinion on technique. And, as for "shooting situations that people say they want to use this lens for" I don't think you're casting a wide enough net.
 
I've shot with the EX1 and EX3 and can safely say, even with the slow zoom lens on the Super 35 cams,
there is a noticeable DOF difference. Even with the EX cams wide open, they are not as shallow. If you
dont believe me, you can look it up on one of many DOF charts online. It's certainly not the same as with
fast primes but its also appreciably better than the EX1/3.

As usual I think the broad cross section of DVX forum posters can lead to disagreements. The Super
35 cams can 'kind of' do similar jobs to the EX cams if you buy a zoom lens and set it to F6.3
(which does away with the ramping iris). Some will contend you should just buy a EX cam
and others would rather save a little money if their current cam does the job adequately.
Doesn't mean anyone is wrong, just means we are all different. Which is good, the world
would be boring indeed if we were all the same.
 
Doug Jensen said:
If you use TLCS to compensate for the aperture ramping you are basically allowing the camera to operate on automatic exposure -- either shutter speed or gain. Neither of which I am willing to give up control over to the camera under any circumstances. I don't know about other people, but I can certainly see the difference when gain or shutter speed fluctuate. In my opinion, using a non-professional lens that ramps is bad enough, but then using auto-exposure to compensate for it just compounds the problem.
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Yes in some cases shutter speed changes can definitely be noticable in the footage.

BUT - with TLCS you don't need to engage the shutter portion of the feature in the menu if you don't want to use it. Just leave it off and enable auto gain (leave auto shutter off) and set your exposure for the brigher image you will have, or lowest f-stop on the lens.

This sure beats iris pulls, plus will not affect overall DOF. Really TLCS is more of a trick for those who might not know about it. Shooters can decide if its for them or not. Still a great little hidden gem in the F3 menu.

Whether or not this lens or that lens is "professional" is kind of moot point. I use a mixed bag of different accessories, lenses, etc.. that others here might not consider professional but if it helps result in a professional finished product then really that's all that matters in my opinion.

More importantly as James points out, there is absolutely no lens that delivers these features for its price range. It's a motorized zoom that will shoot 35mm. For certain applications it would be perfect to some.
 
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