Sony HDV Pro

Re: Sony HDV Pro

Looks interesting. I am somewhat confused. Says it has 1080i CCD's, but down further gives specs for both 1080i and 720p. So does that mean this camera will do both?
 
Re: Sony HDV Pro

Also I just remember all the stuff about the 8 bit when the XL2 was introduced. It says 8 bit or is that for something else.
 
Re: Sony HDV Pro

[quote author=Kidster link=board=nws;num=1094949780;start=0#1 date=09/11/04 at 19:59:13]Looks interesting. I am somewhat confused. Says it has 1080i CCD's, but down further gives specs for both 1080i and 720p. So does that mean this camera will do both?[/quote]
No. It's giving specs for the HDV format, which does include both, but this camera only records 1080i.

It will, however, play back both formats.
 
Re: Sony HDV Pro

[quote author=Gary_McClurg link=board=nws;num=1094949780;start=0#2 date=09/11/04 at 20:02:32]Also I just remember all the stuff about the 8 bit when the XL2 was introduced.  It says 8 bit or is that for something else.  [/quote]
The 8-bit you're seeing there is the data quantization factor. All DV and HDV video gets quantized at 8 bit depth.

The controversy surrounded the bit depth of the Digital Signal Processor on the XL2, some thought it was 8-bit, when the DVX uses 10 bit. 8 bit processing means it's capable of manipulating numbers only up to 256, whereas with 10 bit you can go as high as 1024, giving more precision to the calculations (you can pretend that the last 2 bits are a "decimal point" for example). The Sony FX1 is bragging that it has a 14-bit DSP, which would give it a range of numbers up to 16,384 (if I remember my binary...)
 
Re: Sony HDV Pro

[quote author=Kidster link=board=nws;num=1094949780;start=0#1 date=09/11/04 at 19:59:13]Looks interesting. I am somewhat confused. Says it has 1080i CCD's, but down further gives specs for both 1080i and 720p. So does that mean this camera will do both?[/quote]
Kidster, I thought the same thing until I realized they were referring to the Digital Master Tape.

Something that caught my eye:
Tape bit rate after compression: 1080i - 25Mbps, 720p - 19Mbps

From my limited understanding, it seems that even if the camera could do 720p - at 19Mbps would you really want to?

Hmmmm ??? ... from what I can tell, the only thing that sets this camera apart from the consumer version is XLR inputs and a black finish. Hardly worth (to me at least) the $3000 jump in price. There's got to be more to it than that.
 
Re: Sony HDV Pro

What's wrong with Sony??? Who wants MPEG2 as standard codec? Isn't that already super compressed? No progresive? Why they still insist in 60i? Wow, they have HD reolution that can easily be achieved by uprezing any 30P from SD DV standard? Sony stopped impressing me 5 years ago, they surely started the revolution with the VX1000, released good products like the TRV900 and PD100... but that's all... from breakthrough leaders now they are barely a competition...
 
Re: Sony HDV Pro

uprezzing cant peoduce imformation that is not there to start off with, it jut a resample of the same image but at a bigger scale. however downsampling can give better results than strarting of at the target resolustion.
 
Re: Sony HDV Pro

Read this on the Sony HDV site so thought I'd pass it on.

I work for one of the companies that develops postproduction software in Europe.

Here are a few quick notes on stuff that is coming out now or in the near future.

Sony is pushing hard 1080i. It is not better than 720p, which is backed by Matsushita, but Sony has always been better at marketing the high end stuff and has a better reputation in the broadcast industry. So the new Europe's HD channel is 1080i50. It actually makes sense to a degree because it is easier to make PAL out of 1080i50 than 720p50 and it is easier to convert PAL to interlaced HD than progressive. So Sony chose the winning, although not necessarily the most efficient way, but certainly more profitable for them.

Sony has sold already something like 4-5 thousand XDCAMS worldwide. Assuming 10K Euro net profit on each, this makes it 40-50 million profit on the XDCAM alone. NHK in Japan has already been testing the HD version of XDCAM. Expect NAB 2005 introduction. The HD XDCAM will use 2 layer blue laser media; basically a variant of the Blu-Ray format.

Blu-Ray format will be the dominant HD disc format. HD DVD will be introduced but will not have the muscle of Sony-Matsushita-Philips-Samsung-Thomson camp. The Sanyo-NEC-Toshiba is no match for the above consortium.

The Sony-Panavision alliance already bore the Genesis with 12 MP CCD and CineAlta recorder, to be introduced this Winter.

The push towards HD is because of low profit margins on SD products, especially on the consumer level. So expect a total HD explosion with many new products and prices moving steadily down.

JVC will be introducing two 3 CCD HDV cameras. Contrary to the rumors and manufacturer's leaks the more expensive 2/3" model will record 720/60p and will have 2x the standard HDV bit rate. These second generation cameras will have very good performance; nothing like the first generation.

Sony already supplied samples of their MPEG2 chipset to other camera makers so expect more HDV cameras to be introduced this Winter.

Don't expect any mirracles from the FX1. It is too compressed and it has to be; otherwise Sony would not be able to sell their more expensive DV cameras. Same goes for the new JVC's. Matsushita and Sony dictate the market and they cooperate more than ever in the past.

Despite all that, the FX1 is very good and will be a lot better indie filmmaker's tool than the Panasonic or Canon SD options. The FX1 footage will look a lot better on the big screen. When the footage is processed to progressive, the FX1 becomes a real viable low cost digital cinema production tool.

As to the current JVC HDV offering? They were prematurely introduced and equiped in such a way that they did very little for JVC's reputation or bottom line.
 
Re: Sony HDV Pro

Camcorder info reports pretty much the same:

"The only major difference is the inclusion of two XLR audio inputs, and a second manual audio dial control wheel. Sony would not officially say if the camcorder has 24P, however the message seemed to be that it wouldn't have it. The price also wasn't available, however they said they were aiming for around 6,000 euros"  {or around $7,360.92.}

I'm having a hard time believeing that XLR inputs and a black finish justify that much of an increase in price from $3,700.
I guess it's still wait and see for now.
 
Re: Sony HDV Pro

JVC will be introducing two 3 CCD HDV cameras. Contrary to the rumors and manufacturer's leaks the more expensive 2/3" model will record 720/60p and will have 2x the standard HDV bit rate. These second generation cameras will have very good performance; nothing like the first generation.
Click to expand...

Is there a 720/60p mode? I'd still like to see a 24p mode in the prosummer model!
 
Re: Sony HDV Pro

The photos of the pro version show areas on the rear of the camera taped off.

Barry, any guesses what might go there?

Raoul
 
Re: Sony HDV Pro

I read on another forum, the speculation of the differences in the PRO model vs. the consumer model (besides XLR audio) is a much better peice of glass. Better suited for HD recording. If this is true, I guess that would justify the $3000 difference in price.
 
Re: Sony HDV Pro

[quote author=Kidster link=board=nws;num=1094949780;start=0#14 date=09/18/04 at 01:20:04]I read on another forum, the speculation of the differences in the PRO model vs. the consumer model (besides XLR audio) is a much better peice of glass. Better suited for HD recording. If this is true, I guess that would justify the $3000 difference in price.[/quote]
From everything I've read, other than the XLR support, possibly better edge detailing (via a firmware upgrade), and a better warranty, there really is no difference between the pro and consumer versions. Despite "under $7,000" and "in the range of 6,000 euros" being the only, albeit vague, price projections I've seen, there is ample speculation that the premium will be closer to $1,000 to $1,500 than to $3,000. Still, that's pretty steep for what seem, right now, to be minor improvements (other than the XLR jacks, which are oddly located). Even with improved edge detailing, if that's handled via firmware, I'd hardly call that an added cost for Sony, so that doesn't merit much of a price hike. For the HD10, JVC charged only a $500 premium over the HD1's SRP, which was pretty close the the FX1's.
 
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